Affiliates (Paid Streamers) - Fair or Not to other non-paid gamblers? - page 2.

haidil

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Quote from: hahay on September 01, 2021, 06:51:07 AM

I don't know about that and I don't know what kind of fair form is required in this case. Is it because other streamers who use personal money and then lose have to get compensated but I don't think so, because they are broadcasting only for the purposes of their channel and not to advertise related casinos. right? So yes, I think with the sheer number of casinos available today, any unendorsed streamer could at least use another casino site, but if you still want to beat the house using the advertised casino then you have to be prepared for the consequences. As a gambler you have to be responsible for your own choices, and not about expecting or asking for something fair from the casino concerned. With them or the casino having informed what the percent house edge is in the game concerned, then I think it's a fair thing the casino has done.

That's what I often notice when streamers broadcast live on their YouTube channel. They don't even discuss the deal with the casino that is being used. Or often some bookies who do have affinity with the casino deliberately negotiate in addition to the content itself, they also get compensation from advertisements that they accidentally display on condition that they include their name and gambling website.

doomloop

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Quote from: Hydrogen on August 31, 2021, 07:28:17 PM

I wish mcdonald's and assorted fast food franchises would give out more food vouchers to those willing to stream themselves eating in their restaurants. It seems like a natural progression. With the advent of the internet and live streaming the trend may be inevitable. I think the novelty factor will eventually wear thin as people become desensitized to the advertising and hype.

Not sure about those eating in their outlets but food brands do sponsor a lot of streamers. For example, there are guys like Matt Stonie who make videos about fast eating and finishing a menu from a particular brand like KYC within a time period. I am not 100% sure but they must be sponsored by the brand because it helps both the streamer and the brand.

Quote from: Hydrogen on August 31, 2021, 07:28:17 PM

If a streamer can gamble with $100,000+ and fail to profit. That could make for a good crash test dummy system.

That's right but the real point is streamers trying to fake that dummy balance as real and hyping their wins.

Quote from: Hydrogen on August 31, 2021, 07:28:17 PM

If they gave me $100,000 to gamble on sports & stream it. There's a chance I'll be walking away with more than $100,000. And that's how it should be.

Well, the funds sponsored by the casino are normally play-only types of funds. You can play, stream and have fun with them but cannot withdraw.

qwertyup23

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Quote from: Yogee on August 30, 2021, 12:20:51 PM

This must be a continuation or in relation to your previous topic on RTP. That was a great thread to read by the way.

I don't think there is a need to expand on your RTP argument. There is indeed a level of unfairness there. Anyone with a knowledge on this probably wouldn't bet on the slot or game streamed by the sponsored streamer.

Unfortunately, the popularity of gambling websites being affiliated by some streamers are widespread nowadays. Though these paid streamers gain their cash from the casino itself thereby creating/increasing the cash pool on a certain game, sometimes, they tend to bend the rules and odds to their favor. This creates a level of unfairness on the part of the viewers as this convinces them to gamble at a certain gambling website.

Basically, the money that was lost on these paid streamers are recovered quickly from the scheme they created that attracts new gamblers.

Wexnident

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Quote from: Kakmakr on September 02, 2021, 02:57:42 AM

You guys must understand this.... The paid Streamers are paid a fixed amount to put up a show. Their actions and behavior when they Win and Loose are fake, because the casinos gave them that money to put up that show.

I think calling the behavior fake 100% is a bit too much. They may be using money not really from them, but the games they are playing are still being played by them. They are still, technically, the ones experiencing the wins and losses in that match. It's like saying someone has no reaction to dropping the mmr of a friend's account since it's his friend's account and not his, right? There may be a difference between losing your money and losing others, but it wouldn't be 100% fake, there would still be some disappointment that stemmed from yourself in there.

Dread Pirate Roberts

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Quote from: Kakmakr on August 30, 2021, 10:20:06 AM

Now the question is this.... If Casino's give a lot of money to certain people to gamble and Slots are based on a combined "Pool" of money to make up the RTP for an individual Slot... are other non-paid gamblers not competing for wins against the "House"?

like a company pays an influencer to promote its business. I think it's still fair if it's still in the context of how their promotion works with influencers who they think are suitable for their marketing targets. and usually they get what they win and a certain max. the only people who know how their partnership works are only them.

Kakmakr

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Quote from: chaser15 on September 02, 2021, 06:48:13 AM

Quote from: Kakmakr on September 02, 2021, 02:57:42 AM

These guys are swimming in money with some of them having 40k to 50k subscribers.... Roll Eyes

Because aside from promoting the site they also built their name from scratch and hence become influencers. It's not about being they are paid but to be able to have that kind of big number of subscribers it requires dedication and hard work.

Up to people if they will go with the flow. If a streamer successfully managed to acquire that number of subscribers it means their actions are being graded as a good score to their viewers. The big money they received and earned is the fruit of their effort.

Households earning more than $100,000 globally, stand at 30.7% ....look closely ==> households, so it is the combined income for everyone in that house. Many of these Streamers do not have specific qualifications to do this, apart from a sparkling personality and a few good contacts in the right places. Roll Eyes

Now let's compare Streamers with Doctors === Here we have a Streamer receiving between $50 000 to $100 000 per month and the Global Health Physician Salary of $126,700 per year (top earners (90th percentile) making $214,500 annually across the United States)

https://www.ziprecruiter.com/Salaries/Global-Health-Physician-Salary

Note : The $50 000 to $100 000 is only what the casinos are paying the Streamer and not the other income derived from Subscriptions / Drops / Twitch income... etc. Wink

https://www.ibisworld.com/us/bed/households-earning-more-than-100-000/35/

chaser15

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Quote from: Kakmakr on September 02, 2021, 02:57:42 AM

These guys are swimming in money with some of them having 40k to 50k subscribers.... Roll Eyes

Because aside from promoting the site they also built their name from scratch and hence become influencers. It's not about being they are paid but to be able to have that kind of big number of subscribers it requires dedication and hard work.

Up to people if they will go with the flow. If a streamer successfully managed to acquire that number of subscribers it means their actions are being graded as a good score to their viewers. The big money they received and earned is the fruit of their effort.

Coin_trader

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Quote from: Kakmakr on September 02, 2021, 02:57:42 AM

You guys must understand this.... The paid Streamers are paid a fixed amount to put up a show. Their actions and behavior when they Win and Loose are fake, because the casinos gave them that money to put up that show.

The paid streamer gains income from several sources, like "subscriptions" and payment for the Twitch sessions and a fixed payment from the casino and also "drops" from the viewers and also affiliate income, if they get them to signup with their referral link. Roll Eyes

These guys are swimming in money with some of them having 40k to 50k subscribers.... Roll Eyes

This the common job of these guys and nothing to be bothered by that since they earn there followers by doing tons of streams and promotion for free when they are just starting on there career. It just happened that streamers nowadays is too in demand and there work is the one that can generate tons of profit from gambling industry for there effective promotion. Seems fair and nothings wrong about it unless they are winning the jackpot using the casino free money then that's a different story.

Kakmakr

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You guys must understand this.... The paid Streamers are paid a fixed amount to put up a show. Their actions and behavior when they Win and Loose are fake, because the casinos gave them that money to put up that show.

The paid streamer gains income from several sources, like "subscriptions" and payment for the Twitch sessions and a fixed payment from the casino and also "drops" from the viewers and also affiliate income, if they get them to signup with their referral link. Roll Eyes

These guys are swimming in money with some of them having 40k to 50k subscribers.... Roll Eyes

iv4n

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Quote from: goinmerry on September 01, 2021, 04:45:36 PM

Quote from: Kakmakr on September 01, 2021, 03:54:19 PM

When you watch a Streamer like "Trainwreckstv" .... and you see him betting $1000 per bet, you distance yourself from betting like that. Nobody in his right mind will drop $1000 per bet on a Slot.... if it was their own money.

I think it's not with the amount that viewers are following but the actions of that streamer regardless of the amount that a viewer is placed.

No one will really follow a $1,000 per bet because that is ridiculous on our part even how loyal and die-hard followers of that streamer are. Regardless of where the funds came from, viewers have to use their common sense that streamers are just trying to make their viewers fall on the bait. That's the role of the streamers, to attract their viewers to do the same.

I agree that viewers should use their common sense! In the end, it's all on us to understand what we are watching and to not fall on everything we see... all that is a part of the marketing strategies, some of them are not ethical and moral, and we all know how far can all that goes just for more viewers!
I think viewers are the crazy ones here, I will use the Big Brother example (in all forms), it's something crazy, but I don't blame the people there and people who created it... they have many viewers, and when there's a demand someone will provide! So clearly these streamers are followed, they just provide what some people want to see... they found a way to earn and they are doing that!

aioc

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He is crying over spilled milk, he is not forced to play and stream while he is playing so if he losses it's his decision to play, you don't play and ask for a refund because you are a streamer and you play your own money, that's not fair if you want to offer your service as a streamer then do so, but don't rant because you lose your own money while promoting the gambling site in your stream while others are using casino money.

Kyraishi

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Quote from: Kakmakr on September 01, 2021, 03:54:19 PM

When you watch a Streamer like "Trainwreckstv" .... and you see him betting $1000 per bet, you distance yourself from betting like that. Nobody in his right mind will drop $1000 per bet on a Slot.... if it was their own money.

The other side of the coin is this... he is betting on these Slots and he is feeding those Slots for other people too, so if he does not hit the big wins on those Slots he was feeding... then those Slots are filled for other gamblers to win. (Remember : He is filling those Slots with the casinos money too) Wink

Exactly. And no way have they got enough bankroll to keep them going over the long run.

I think that it's getting to a point where some of the content is bordering on the ridiculous.

People like Foss and juicy are clearly gambling with house money without a care in the world and faking their reactions in order to get people hooked. This is immoral and misleading behaviour and should be condemned.

carlfebz2

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Quote from: dothebeats on September 01, 2021, 04:17:33 PM

And this is why some streaming platforms are trying to limit gambling streams. You have streamers who gamble with their own money and lose big time, while you also other streamers who are affiliates and do not lose anything on their own pocket yet still convey the similar thing: promote gambling to minors who may be watching their streams. I think it’s fair that some are paid-to-play on stream as it’s within their terms. The gambling platform has the right to decide on who they sponsor after all, so no need to get butthurt if other streamers are not chosen for the partnership.

When it comes to selection of streamers then most of companies will really be looking for those most influential one or the one who has more followers because that would really make their spending to be worth
compared into those who do have less.

For terms and conditions in between the platform on where those streams do happen then there's specific regulations which should really be followed which i do consider
for it to be ethical.

uneng

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Quote from: Kakmakr on September 01, 2021, 03:54:19 PM

The other side of the coin is this... he is betting on these Slots and he is feeding those Slots for other people too, so if he does not hit the big wins on those Slots he was feeding... then those Slots are filled for other gamblers to win. (Remember : He is filling those Slots with the casinos money too) Wink

Hmm, thinking this way it doesn't look so bad, right?

But to say the truth I think this kind of advertisement is being more negative than positive for casinos. Everyone is aware about streamers using fake money to gamble and most opinions from the public I've seen reject this concept of propaganda. These guys are actually ruining their reputations as social influencers by pretending to gamble insane amounts of money they wouldn't for real.

I believe casinos should change their marketing strategy. Instead of giving fake money to streamers, just increase their payrates, so they will have to use real money in order to gamble. And of course, they will keep the bets under a reasonable and realistic size, because if the gambler makes huge bets, it will be blatantly obvious that is a fake gambling session leading to unconvincing marketing campaign in my opinion.

goinmerry

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Quote from: Kakmakr on September 01, 2021, 03:54:19 PM

When you watch a Streamer like "Trainwreckstv" .... and you see him betting $1000 per bet, you distance yourself from betting like that. Nobody in his right mind will drop $1000 per bet on a Slot.... if it was their own money.

I think it's not with the amount that viewers are following but the actions of that streamer regardless of the amount that a viewer is placed.

No one will really follow a $1,000 per bet because that is ridiculous on our part even how loyal and die-hard followers of that streamer are. Regardless of where the funds came from, viewers have to use their common sense that streamers are just trying to make their viewers fall on the bait. That's the role of the streamers, to attract their viewers to do the same.

alpamar99

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for now there are so many things like that and indeed they do things that are profitable for them as well as for the casino itself, this is tantamount to a symbiotic mutualism (in their eyes).
but on the other hand there are still many people who are deceived by this kind of trick and indeed still think it is true even though it is an arrangement made between the person who is paid and the casino itself.
On the other hand, actually things like this are not taboo, it's like it's an open secret because if I'm not mistaken there was once a streamer who made a mistake while livestreaming which at that time he accidentally showed a conversation between him and one of the casinos that offered this kind of thing but refused because there are other sites (casinos) that offer a larger nominal.
actually it's legal because they benefit from each other but for beginners who don't understand this they will follow the same thing with the same hope when in reality it won't be like that.

coupable

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Quote from: Kakmakr on September 01, 2021, 03:54:19 PM

When you watch a Streamer like "Trainwreckstv" .... and you see him betting $1000 per bet, you distance yourself from betting like that. Nobody in his right mind will drop $1000 per bet on a Slot.... if it was their own money.

The other side of the coin is this... he is betting on these Slots and he is feeding those Slots for other people too, so if he does not hit the big wins on those Slots he was feeding... then those Slots are filled for other gamblers to win. (Remember : He is filling those Slots with the casinos money too) Wink

Until proving that the casino gives him money to play (not just a paiement for streaming the platform), we can't say that the casino is sheating when one of its streamer promoters drop 1000$ per bet on a slot. If you distance yourself from betting like that, this doesn't mean that he is not using his own money.
From another side, if the casino does really give him big money to play crazy bets and pay him for streaming promotion, i can guess that the winnings are not real, neither withdrawable .

dothebeats

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And this is why some streaming platforms are trying to limit gambling streams. You have streamers who gamble with their own money and lose big time, while you also other streamers who are affiliates and do not lose anything on their own pocket yet still convey the similar thing: promote gambling to minors who may be watching their streams. I think it’s fair that some are paid-to-play on stream as it’s within their terms. The gambling platform has the right to decide on who they sponsor after all, so no need to get butthurt if other streamers are not chosen for the partnership.

Kakmakr

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When you watch a Streamer like "Trainwreckstv" .... and you see him betting $1000 per bet, you distance yourself from betting like that. Nobody in his right mind will drop $1000 per bet on a Slot.... if it was their own money.

The other side of the coin is this... he is betting on these Slots and he is feeding those Slots for other people too, so if he does not hit the big wins on those Slots he was feeding... then those Slots are filled for other gamblers to win. (Remember : He is filling those Slots with the casinos money too) Wink

perfect999

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This paid-streamer topic has been in discussion for a long time now. I think if the stream mentions about the sponsored funds, it's completely safe and sound to play with the money. If the streamer is hiding the fact, that the money is sponsored to him from the casino, it's not morally correct. I have seen some streamers jumping after big wins even when the money is quite surely funded by the casino and those wins are not real neither withdrawable.

Quote from: Kakmakr on August 30, 2021, 10:20:06 AM

Syztmz (Streamer not using Affiliate money) had a heated discussion on his last Stream about him having to compete with his own money, against Affiliate Streamers that are using Casino money. ( I think he lost something like $100 000 on his last 13 hour stream session )

As much I hate those paid streamers, I am not sure why Syztmz is so upset about the whole situation. No one forced him to use funds more than he can afford to play with. I also thought Syztmz was more a player than an affiliate when I saw his name on top in stake races.

Topic: Affiliates (Paid Streamers) - Fair or Not to other non-paid gamblers? - page 2. (Read 647 times)