Topic: Alternatives to Permabans for plagarism - page 3. (Read 22177 times)

Just this:



As above, I think the policy should stay the same right now because certain mods giving certain people free passes isn't fair and will only lead to more issues and hassle. I guess you can try petition the other Globals/admins as they may have a different opinion, but certain staff showing leniency is just opening up a huge can of worms to me and if you unban one hundreds will start pestering you, but they can obviously feel different. Hopefully signature bans will come into play at some point and I would happily issue them and maybe even consider reinstating the signature if they've proven over time that they're here to contribute. Maybe signature campaigns will be banned in the near future and then maybe we can unban everyone who was ever banned for sig spam and they can choose to contribute or not.

ChiBitCTy along with Roboabhishek were the two users I suggested for a sig ban:

Appeal threads:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.35819856
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.48408455

I'm not sure I buy either of their excuses (though they are plausible) but I'd be willing to give them a second chance as they were both active and somewhat appreciated members and have vouches from other respected members, but I think some sort of sig ban would be appropriate here given they were both essentially doing it for payment. They both seem to care more about just getting their accounts back and even suggested they're fine with a sig ban so I think this is something we should consider:

I ask you to pardon I did not know this rule and wanted to start life from scratch

Was there ever any update to this @hilariousandco?

I feel like if we were to at least try it out there's a perfect Candidate for it.

Nice attempt to twist it to fit your agenda, but:

1) Copy pasta is not a mistake, it's a deliberate action often involving obfuscation as well.
2) Your ban evasion is also major offense so you either still haven't read the rules or you don't give a shit... I'd say that makes your posturing on the fairness of said rules moot.

How about the ban remains, just that the each time a user post a reply or opens a thread, there's a warning banner or notification against plagiarism?

That way, there's no grounds of appealing once he/ she gets banned.

Then ask your friends if you have a lot of them.

Did not happen to them that they bought a lot of goods in the store, while unconsciously forgot to pay for the chewing gum, which was put in the pocket, when it was necessary to use two hands to get some goods.

If that happened, do you think they're thieves?

Now they can't go shopping, right?

Probably you will even stop communicating with such people, right?

In fact, they just go back to the store and pay for it and the problem will be exhausted, the forum does not have this capability.

You can deceive thousands of people and you just lose trust (as it was with Atriz) but you can continue to conduct their dark deeds...

Is that justice?

I think it's hypocrisy.

You like to compare things that can't be compared.

For you, even a person who unknowingly made one mistake is a criminal without the right to rehabilitation...

ps:

I can write the same thing about many favorite comparison with institutes.

Yes, you can make a diploma using someone else's work and you will be expelled, or you will forget to indicate 1 source in the list of used literature when writing a diploma project, for which you will not be expelled.

You have to understand the difference in these things.

There is a huge difference in when a person does it once and most likely unconsciously and when a person does it on purpose.

I didn't notice you putting emphasis on that.

I think that 1 temporary ban is enough for a person to understand that he made a mistake and should be more careful than to be sentenced for life without the right to appeal.

But this will only work if you're really fighting plagiarism, not trying to bury users...

These two won't guarantee that they will stop from plagiarizing more post once the ban is lifted or the fine is paid, the chances of them doing it again will be higher as the days goes by. I also see that the permanent signature ban can cause a lot of affected members to spam the forum with their shitpost saying that the system is unfair and how they can't getaway from just one plagiarized post. I think the old system still works just fine. I don't see that their is a certain degree of plagiarism where a member can be forgiven plagiarism is still plagiarism, there is no creativity or effort behind it.

When the "mistake" or "didn't know it's bad" argument is brought up I'm trying to imagine the user shoplifting and then trying to explain to the cops that it was a mistake or that they didn't know it's not cool to walk out of the store without paying.

So yeah, it doesn't happen accidentally. And it's not like in the store we see signs "don't go out without paying".

The concept of plagiarism by mistake doesn't really make any sense to me. I don't believe that a person can really forget to mention the source from where he just literally copied and pasted something into his post/comment unless they don't care, or aren't aware of the fact that plagiarism is treated as a crime in here and is dealt with a harsh punishment.

Mistakes are done by everyone, I agree, but why don't we commit this kind of mistakes? (I'm talking about everyone who are considered to be good members of the community). Of course we all require to search the internet in order to answer a few queries that we are not sure about, at least I do, but what I do is either confirm the thing first and then convey it in my own way, and if in a case where I need to quote something, I make sure I mention the source I've taken it from because I have some sense and I know it is not right.

The only excuse I can think of by someone who has plagiarized anytime in past (either by mistake or purposely) is that they were not aware of the rule. For that matter, The Registration Message thing should be rolled out which would be sent to every new account upon registration which would either contain a list of the rules or the link to the thread that contains them, along with the other important stuff a member needs to know before using the forum. Also, the message should be sent to every user account at the time of implementation to avoid getting complains and later excuses from the pre-existing user accounts that are still unaware of the rules.


I believe the current punishment of permanent ban for plagiarism has nothing wrong in it since it rarely happens when a user unintentionally plagiarizes and doesn't even realize their mistake even after reading so many things about the issue in the forum, and committing mistakes like that even after reading the rules sent to your inbox personally should be treated with the same punishment as others. Hence, I voted for, "No - Nothing should change and permabans remain".

In real life common circles, people tend to use information and other people’s phrases freely, speaking then without having to cite the source (what a laugh that would be). But of course, common acceptance of plagiarism varies on the circle where it is being used, and even the communication form itself.

The forum has a couple of good reasons to consider plagiarism a penalty: it is more often than not being used to gain a personal benefit, be it by trying to build character and reputation to some (poor) extent, or to cut corners and save time instead of using the grey matter in conjunction with personal time.

The rule is not trivial to enforce as it is, since it requires people to report the plagiarism and others to asses it. Therefore, likely a fair share goes unspotted (but may spin back at some point down the line). Shifting the parts of the playing board where one can plagiarize without being punished and leaving other parts as inpunitive zones seems like a strange solution. I’d prefer keeping the rules simple, but perhaps, introduce a timeframe where these kind of reports may apply to (say over the last two years of the accounts posting history).

My apologies if this was mentioned here already or somewhere else on the Forum (I did a quick search through the 5 pages looking for bounty and altcoin as keywords and didn't find anything).

How about preventing plagiarists from reading and posting in the Altcoin and Bounty sections + the ability to send PMs?
That way they would not be able to search for, participate or send bounty reports (make money off the forum) but they can still post in other sections of the forum. Not all users who copy/paste are merely shit posters and they can still contribute in some positive ways.

Then it will be possible to see the distinction between those who simply give up and leave since they cant take part in bounties and the others who actually want to participate in the forum and try to better themselves.

Yes. I think any permaban causes evil points. As for what other behaviours do I think theymos will have to answer that. I'm not sure what he wants as public knowledge or not.

A curious question:

Does plagiarism ban cause evil ip fees?
Or in other words which type of ban/activities attract evil IP fees?

Whoever is in the recovery team is probably just there to restore hacked/lost accounts and not cases of bans for breaking rules. Theymos has said there are no concrete rules regarding bans and we can enforce them as we see fit and be more lenient in certain cases, but I'm not going to give certain people free passes because it's not fair and is just going to lead to more issues and hassle when people start complaining that x was unbanned for y by so-and-so so why aren't they. The only way I'll likely start giving people second chances if theymos implements signature bans. That way there's some fairness across the board. You can have your account back but you just can't earn from it. I would be happy to review accounts if this was put into place but I don't think it would be fair to unban certain people and they can resume partaking in signature campaigns whilst others don't even get their accounts back at all. Several people have said they would happily forgo a signature if they can just get their account back so I think it's something we should look at. If that happens and they stick around and show that they're a helpful member of the community and aren't here just for payment then I'd even be up for reviewing whether they can have their signature back at some point as well, but I think if Globals start making up their own rules for who gets unbanned or not it's just opening up a huge can of worms that will only lead to more problems.

Perma bans are needed somethimes but should be issued with absolute care. Some people around here are adding a 100x more value than the single ‘mistake’ they made. A user who takes the time to fundamentaly apply for lifting his ban should be taken very seriously.  I would like to see this change! My vote is here.

This is just suggestion but admin need to decide what need to be done,but looks like still the permaban is the result when someone got plagiarism and its most likely to stay in the future as well since he implemented the new ban message for plagiarist and says appeals are not likely to be accepted.

Do we know if any progress has been made in this topic ?

Has the new team in charge of managing hacked and locked / banned accounts been given any directives?





Source = https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/recovering-hackedlost-accounts-5089777

OK. Sorry. accept my apology. i will delete those posts & will not post anymore.

Mate
This is not evading! ive not posted in any topic outside of  META forum. im just posting about my ban issue

You don't get a blanket permission to post anywhere you like in Meta:


You posted in 9 threads with this account. Some posts have nothing to do with your ban. I'd say you should stay where you are and stop dreaming about getting unbanned if you can't read the rules even after you got banned once.