Alternatives to the new OzCoin 3% DGM Fee - page 2.

organofcorti

donator

Activity: 2058

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Poor impulse control.

Quote from: evanesce on August 12, 2012, 03:17:17 AM

Quote from: Graet on August 11, 2012, 11:02:17 PM

evanesce why you have shares in current round?
I thought you had left Cheesy

cheers

oh
I couldn't find you on this list
https://ozcoin.net/content/hall-fame-donations-bitcoin
maybe something is broken?

I rolled back to oz momentarily when eclipse was down for those few hours but don't you worry I made sure you got your 3% in that round.. I'll set up my client to roll back to deepbit instead next time.

You know, for having such a wonderful reputation in the community you sure arent impressing me much on a personal level.

Well, you do seem to think that he shouldn't be paid for his work, right? You're implying that his work on Ozcoin isn't worth being paid. You want to reduce your mining variance for free. Graet has put a huge amount of unpaid personal time into Ozcoin and you're saying it's not worth being paid for. I can see why he'd be pissed at you.

Try solo mining for a while and you'll see why many miners don't mind a small fee in exchange for variance reduction and charging a fee means that donators aren't subsiding miners like you. So you'll move to EMC? Great pool, and Inaba is an excellent pool op. But you moving there does bugger all to help him, and his fulltime miners will be subsidising you.

Put yourself in a pool operators shoes: if you had to spend a portion of every day running a pool, would you be happy working two jobs - one to feed your family and one for free? Would your wife and kids be happy never seeing you? Would you be confident you could handle any emergency any time?

evanesce

full member

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Quote from: Graet on August 11, 2012, 11:02:17 PM

evanesce why you have shares in current round?
I thought you had left Cheesy

cheers

oh
I couldn't find you on this list
https://ozcoin.net/content/hall-fame-donations-bitcoin
maybe something is broken?

I rolled back to oz momentarily when eclipse was down for those few hours but don't you worry I made sure you got your 3% in that round.. I'll set up my client to roll back to deepbit instead next time.

You know, for having such a wonderful reputation in the community you sure arent impressing me much on a personal level.

Valalvax

sr. member

Activity: 437

Merit: 250

Quote from: Graet on August 11, 2012, 11:02:17 PM

evanesce why you have shares in current round?
I thought you had left Cheesy

cheers

oh
I couldn't find you on this list
https://ozcoin.net/content/hall-fame-donations-bitcoin
maybe something is broken?

You might need some, you can buy it with the 2.5% you've been saving

http://www.amazon.com/Harold-Imports-2-Ounce-Size-Cream/dp/B001732FVG

Graet

vip

Activity: 980

Merit: 1001

evanesce why you have shares in current round?
I thought you had left Cheesy

cheers

oh
I couldn't find you on this list
https://ozcoin.net/content/hall-fame-donations-bitcoin
maybe something is broken?

crazyates

legendary

Activity: 952

Merit: 1000

Quote from: zvs on August 11, 2012, 08:02:27 PM

what exactly does ozcoin have that makes it better than eclipsemc? i'm honestly curious

I've never mined with eclipse, but there are 2 huge factors of why Ozcoin rocks:

Stability - With multiple servers at physically different locations, it's hard to get to a point where I can't mine. My first 3 failover pools are Ozcoin backup servers, so it ensures I'm always mining. (of course, solo mining is failover #4 Wink

)

Integrity - From what I've seen, Graet has been nothing but upstanding and honest with his miners, especially if any problems arise (down servers, payout not working, and the recent ddos). This to me makes it worth it.

Graet

vip

Activity: 980

Merit: 1001

Quote from: evanesce on August 11, 2012, 05:34:26 PM

Graet, I mean no disrespect to what you have done for the coin community, and I apologize if anything was taken that way. I still strongly disagree with the 3% increase, though it appears that I may be the only one to date

quite a few people disagree, some have been quite abusive some have just moved on.
one made a forum thread full of fud.
then started aplogising.

OH ROFL JUST LOOKED AT 1ST POST - CHANGED SIGNIFICANTLY WHILE A WAS ASLEEP

I was going to write a big long post but honestly cbf

no-one is required to mine at Ozcoin - as always miners that would like to mine at Ozcoin are welcome.

Inaba is a good guy - go mine on EMC if you don't like fees or one of the many other 0fee pools

I made a business decision about Ozcoins future - If this is the only time in your life you have been dissapointed by a businesses decision you are either very lucky or very young.

zvs

legendary

Activity: 1680

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https://web.archive.org/web/*/nogleg.com

Quote from: Shirik on August 11, 2012, 08:12:35 PM

Quote from: zvs on August 11, 2012, 08:02:27 PM

Quote from: wknight on August 11, 2012, 05:08:53 PM

I am very sorry that you feel the services OZCOIN is not worth 3%. We all wish you luck in the future on finding a pool you will be happy with.

and pls no comments about how it's down atm. extended down time has happened... twice in the last two months?

I know you don't want to hear this but...

Stability.

Since I joined OzCoin I haven't seen my miner directing any significant traffic at any of my backup pools. And this isn't because the servers haven't gone down. Rather, it's a mix of OzCoin's servers being in different locations (allowing for easy failover and no single point of failure) and the sysadmins being very proactive in their approach (pointing DNS entries at other servers when they go down, whether for maintenance or otherwise).

You can't discount the quality of service.

i'll concede the point about diff locations

eclipsemc used to have some EU servers, but now they're all located in US (all through wholesale internet). so when wholesale internet messes up (which I think was probably the case this time), it takes the whole operation down

but, you could just use eclipsemc and have maxbtc (or visa versa) as backup server. i mined on maxbtc for about a month straight & it probably had about 12hrs of downtime in that period

Shirik

newbie

Activity: 32

Merit: 0

Quote from: zvs on August 11, 2012, 08:02:27 PM

Quote from: wknight on August 11, 2012, 05:08:53 PM

I am very sorry that you feel the services OZCOIN is not worth 3%. We all wish you luck in the future on finding a pool you will be happy with.

and pls no comments about how it's down atm. extended down time has happened... twice in the last two months?

I know you don't want to hear this but...

Stability.

Since I joined OzCoin I haven't seen my miner directing any significant traffic at any of my backup pools. And this isn't because the servers haven't gone down. Rather, it's a mix of OzCoin's servers being in different locations (allowing for easy failover and no single point of failure) and the sysadmins being very proactive in their approach (pointing DNS entries at other servers when they go down, whether for maintenance or otherwise).

You can't discount the quality of service.

zvs

legendary

Activity: 1680

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https://web.archive.org/web/*/nogleg.com

Quote from: wknight on August 11, 2012, 05:08:53 PM

I am very sorry that you feel the services OZCOIN is not worth 3%. We all wish you luck in the future on finding a pool you will be happy with.

it isn't worth 3% because there are pools like eclipseMC and maxBTC that one can switch to, that don't have fees

what exactly does ozcoin have that makes it better than eclipsemc? i'm honestly curious

and pls no comments about how it's down atm. extended down time has happened... twice in the last two months?

evanesce

full member

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Look ARROUND!

Quote from: mdude77 on August 11, 2012, 05:55:27 PM

I can't see how anyone could be expected to run a 0% pool. There's no such thing as a free lunch, the money HAS to come from somewhere. You've got some nerve to refer the miners there as lazy that won't switch when you expect it to stay free. As of right now, the average user there has 3.4g/h. That hash power isn't free, and I doubt any of them appreciate you referring to them as lazy. I'm sure they know what they are doing.

My Apologies for labeling some miners "lazy". Obviously we're a much smarter bunch than the average consumer. However, I'm starting to run out of apologies heh...

I do like how passionate we all are about this currency. Positive or negative, this sort of passion should fuel this economy for years to come.

mdude77

legendary

Activity: 1540

Merit: 1001

Quote from: evanesce on August 11, 2012, 05:34:26 PM

I appreciate your post, and for sharing your knowledge of the situation.

It's possible that just maybe my ways of thinking and views in general are different from the norm more than I had anticipated, but I feel it's appropriate to at least voice my opinion about the whole subject and get some nice intelligent responses in return (most of them were nice anyways heh).

Graet, I mean no disrespect to what you have done for the coin community, and I apologize if anything was taken that way. I still strongly disagree with the 3% increase, though it appears that I may be the only one to date

I can't see how anyone could be expected to run a 0% pool. There's no such thing as a free lunch, the money HAS to come from somewhere. You've got some nerve to refer the miners there as lazy that won't switch when you expect it to stay free. As of right now, the average user there has 3.4g/h. That hash power isn't free, and I doubt any of them appreciate you referring to them as lazy. I'm sure they know what they are doing.

You're free to go where ever you want. I personally am on p2poolright now because I like the concept, and recently it's been coming ahead of 0% pools, let alone the 3% or 5% pools. But ozcoin is my backup, and if p2pool goes south, I'll be back even with 3%. 3% is more than fair IMHO, and anyone who expects it be free needs to examine themselves and consider where their greedy selfish motives are coming from.

M

P.S. I was on BTCGuild when they were free. Then they changed to 5%. They are STILL one of the biggest pools out there, ahead of Ozcoin. These miners, myself included, know what we're doing, contrary to your opinion.

imsaguy

vip

Activity: 574

Merit: 500

Don't send me a pm unless you gpg encrypt it.

Quote from: Clipse on August 11, 2012, 03:16:27 PM

Well obviously Graet is terrible at bait and switch tactics considering it took him over a year to work out this long con. Roll Eyes

Clearly Oz is a ponzi.

Littleshop

legendary

Activity: 1386

Merit: 1004

Quote from: evanesce on August 11, 2012, 05:34:26 PM

Quote from: wknight on August 11, 2012, 05:08:53 PM

Quote from: evanesce on August 11, 2012, 01:58:03 PM

I personally felt I was bait and switched over at Oz, and while the merits of my reasoning are up for discussion, still that's how I felt.

I am very sorry that you feel the services OZCOIN is not worth 3%. We all wish you luck in the future on finding a pool you will be happy with.

However, insulting one of the most honest people that runs a pool (Graet) isnt the smartest thing to do. In fact he has paid out of his own pocket when its come to extra payouts because of database screw ups. Hell did you know that OZCOIN just paid out double on multiple blocks recently? Who eats this? Graet.

Ohh did you know that OZCOIN was hacked one time and lost all the coins in the wallet? Graet took it out of his own pocket to make sure people got paid. However, the community even donated to the pool to help offset the loss.

Its a lot of work to keep this pool going. Making sure things get fixed so it does'nt happen again. Graet has always looked out for everyone in the Bitcoin community even if they dont mine on his pool.

So before you start slinging false information and talk shit about how Graet is now moving over to a fee base to keep the pool open. Look at yourself and ask. "What have I done for bitcoin lately".

I appreciate your post, and for sharing your knowledge of the situation.

It's possible that just maybe my ways of thinking and views in general are different from the norm more than I had anticipated, but I feel it's appropriate to at least voice my opinion about the whole subject and get some nice intelligent responses in return (most of them were nice anyways heh).

Graet, I mean no disrespect to what you have done for the coin community, and I apologize if anything was taken that way. I still strongly disagree with the 3% increase, though it appears that I may be the only one to date

I can understand that a fee increase hurts but it seems to be within reason. If he had no fee then went (suddenly) to a 5% or 10% fee without warning it would feel like a bait and switch. 3% with notice is not unfair.

evanesce

full member

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Quote from: wknight on August 11, 2012, 05:08:53 PM

Quote from: evanesce on August 11, 2012, 01:58:03 PM

I personally felt I was bait and switched over at Oz, and while the merits of my reasoning are up for discussion, still that's how I felt.

I am very sorry that you feel the services OZCOIN is not worth 3%. We all wish you luck in the future on finding a pool you will be happy with.

However, insulting one of the most honest people that runs a pool (Graet) isnt the smartest thing to do. In fact he has paid out of his own pocket when its come to extra payouts because of database screw ups. Hell did you know that OZCOIN just paid out double on multiple blocks recently? Who eats this? Graet.

Ohh did you know that OZCOIN was hacked one time and lost all the coins in the wallet? Graet took it out of his own pocket to make sure people got paid. However, the community even donated to the pool to help offset the loss.

Its a lot of work to keep this pool going. Making sure things get fixed so it does'nt happen again. Graet has always looked out for everyone in the Bitcoin community even if they dont mine on his pool.

So before you start slinging false information and talk shit about how Graet is now moving over to a fee base to keep the pool open. Look at yourself and ask. "What have I done for bitcoin lately".

I appreciate your post, and for sharing your knowledge of the situation.

It's possible that just maybe my ways of thinking and views in general are different from the norm more than I had anticipated, but I feel it's appropriate to at least voice my opinion about the whole subject and get some nice intelligent responses in return (most of them were nice anyways heh).

Graet, I mean no disrespect to what you have done for the coin community, and I apologize if anything was taken that way. I still strongly disagree with the 3% increase, though it appears that I may be the only one to date

wknight

legendary

Activity: 889

Merit: 1000

Bitcoin calls me an Orphan

Quote from: evanesce on August 11, 2012, 01:58:03 PM

I personally felt I was bait and switched over at Oz, and while the merits of my reasoning are up for discussion, still that's how I felt.

I am very sorry that you feel the services OZCOIN is not worth 3%. We all wish you luck in the future on finding a pool you will be happy with.

However, insulting one of the most honest people that runs a pool (Graet) isnt the smartest thing to do. In fact he has paid out of his own pocket when its come to extra payouts because of database screw ups. Hell did you know that OZCOIN just paid out double on multiple blocks recently? Who eats this? Graet.

Ohh did you know that OZCOIN was hacked one time and lost all the coins in the wallet? Graet took it out of his own pocket to make sure people got paid. However, the community even donated to the pool to help offset the loss.

Its a lot of work to keep this pool going. Making sure things get fixed so it does'nt happen again. Graet has always looked out for everyone in the Bitcoin community even if they dont mine on his pool.

So before you start slinging false information and talk shit about how Graet is now moving over to a fee base to keep the pool open. Look at yourself and ask. "What have I done for bitcoin lately".

evanesce

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Quote from: crazyates on August 11, 2012, 04:56:18 PM

I don't see how being one of the best pools around isn't enough to warrant a 3% fee that not only covers the 1.5% running costs, but also extra costs for future developments.

That is frankly your opinion that it is one of the best pools around. So for you, it flies.. That's good, however not the case with me. And the other comment above? I wasn't telling anyone anything, merely a suggestion

crazyates

legendary

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Quote from: evanesce on August 11, 2012, 03:24:00 PM

A year at 0% fees is a great way to build up the nice hashrate Graet enjoys today to get his hefty sized 3% in upcoming fees, this way he can literally feed off the lazy people that don't bother to switch pools once this happens.

Yes, because all of us that continue to mine at ozco.in are just too ignorant to get off our lazy asses and switch pools because you tell us to.

Quote from: evanesce on August 11, 2012, 03:51:45 PM

Given your post, the only point I have left to make... is that me, myself, personally... don't feel the 3% fee is justified, seeing as I recall someone saying they only needed about 1.5% (reference needed, i'm researching) to break even, when they were pointing out that donations were only averaging 0.6% or something (again, reference needed, i'll look around.. all I know is it was well under 3%).

All in all, Ozcoin is welcome to do whatever they wish, it's a free world, or so I hope.. lol

Edit: http://www.ozcoin.net/content/covering-costs has the statistics I was looking for:

Quote

Currently we are running at ~0.8% "donations", to cover running costs this needs to be closer to 1.5%. (~$600AUD or 120BTC per month)

I don't see how being one of the best pools around isn't enough to warrant a 3% fee that not only covers the 1.5% running costs, but also extra costs for future developments.

evanesce

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Quote from: Clipse on August 11, 2012, 03:31:01 PM

Ok let me try again since sarcasm clearly doesnt reflect well on here.

Ozcoin ran at a low hashrate at 0% fee since only a month or two ago, they kept paying over and over out of their own pockets and with few recent double payouts they also did the same.

Now do you think they deserve to get paid for their work ? That is totally up to you to decide however claiming they are out of deliberately cheat you out of bitcoins and thus trying to tar them as scum is just psychotic and void of any reasoning.

Please provide different examples, creditcard rates and google products have nothing to do with the pool service and you know it.

Excellent post. Thank you for helping me to understand.

Given your post, the only point I have left to make... is that me, myself, personally... don't feel the 3% fee is justified, seeing as I recall someone saying they only needed about 1.5% (reference needed, i'm researching) to break even, when they were pointing out that donations were only averaging 0.6% or something (again, reference needed, i'll look around.. all I know is it was well under 3%).

All in all, Ozcoin is welcome to do whatever they wish, it's a free world, or so I hope.. lol

Edit: http://www.ozcoin.net/content/covering-costs has the statistics I was looking for:

Quote

Currently we are running at ~0.8% "donations", to cover running costs this needs to be closer to 1.5%. (~$600AUD or 120BTC per month)

Clipse

hero member

Activity: 504

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Quote from: evanesce on August 11, 2012, 03:24:00 PM

Quote from: Clipse on August 11, 2012, 03:16:27 PM

Well obviously Graet is terrible at bait and switch tactics considering it took him over a year to work out this long con. Roll Eyes

A year at 0% fees is a great way to build up the nice hashrate Graet enjoys today to get his hefty sized 3% in upcoming fees, this way he can literally feed off the lazy people that don't bother to switch pools once this happens.

This happens all the time though, 0% interest first year on credit cards, then jack up to 21% with a 50$ annual fee, just one example.... How about google voice, free calls till "who knows when"... then what will the fees be?

Ok let me try again since sarcasm clearly doesnt reflect well on here.

Ozcoin ran at a low hashrate at 0% fee since only a month or two ago, they kept paying over and over out of their own pockets and with few recent double payouts they also did the same.

Now do you think they deserve to get paid for their work ? That is totally up to you to decide however claiming they are out of deliberately cheat you out of bitcoins and thus trying to tar them as scum is just psychotic and void of any reasoning.

Please provide different examples, creditcard rates and google products have nothing to do with the pool service and you know it.

evanesce

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Quote from: Clipse on August 11, 2012, 03:16:27 PM

Well obviously Graet is terrible at bait and switch tactics considering it took him over a year to work out this long con. Roll Eyes

A year at 0% fees is a great way to build up the nice hashrate Graet enjoys today to get his hefty sized 3% in upcoming fees, this way he can literally feed off the lazy people that don't bother to switch pools once this happens.

This happens all the time though, 0% interest first year on credit cards, then jack up to 21% with a 50$ annual fee, just one example.... How about google voice, free calls till "who knows when"... then what will the fees be?

Topic: Alternatives to the new OzCoin 3% DGM Fee - page 2. (Read 4403 times)