Topic: Am i wrong thinking Butterflylabs is the end of Bitcoins ? - page 2. (Read 5578 times)

The only realistic problem I can see with fewer miners is that they may collude to increase TX fees.  If a large proportion (> 50%) decided they would no longer include transactions in blocks with less than say 1% tx fee paid then the rest of us would be pretty screwed, but then if they did that they would be disinceting the use of BTC which would cause the price to fall and them to make less money mining.  Doesn't make much sense.

You do realize that over 50% of all coins have already been mined, right? We already have a good number of coins to work with to create an economic ecosystem. From here on out, mining is NOT to make ginormous profits. Mining is to keep the network going, approve transactions, and make it as resilient as possible to an outside attack. Yes, the BTC rewards and later the TX fees will keep rewarding miners for their efforts.

So no, BFL is not the end of Bitcoins. In fact, all ASIC companies are helping to get the ball rolling towards a more secure network. Remember, Bitcoins is still relatively new, and is going through some growing pains. I do think it will level out in the end.

+1

No, it doesn't.
If some still want to become miners there's nothing stopping them, it shouldn't  and doesn't matter to them if they need to invest in GPUs, or in ASICs.

But Bitcoin is not about mining, it's about freedom, the hardware used by miners doesn't change that.

If price drops it is unlikely that they will be hoarding. If price crash I will by more. If price increase, that it not a problem either if business is not pegging their products to btc.

i don't understand this logic, even though it's repeated quite often

yes, to a certain degree it means a more secure network, due to the proliferation of botnets.  

on the other hand, it turns bitcoin generation into an oligarchy, much moreso than it is at the moment


marginal propensity to save

the same logic you use here is the same logic that is used to bring taxes down to 0% for 'job creators'


so what?  does it change the fact that it does?

People using coins != Miners
What's so hard to understand about that?
Mining is a highly competitive business and has nothing todo with the general use of Bitcoin as a currency.

The small miners don't actually have enough coins to spend to influence the market in any way, besides that even big miners need to pay bills, so they will probably spend or sell mined coins too.


Why should different mining hardware drop the price, or change the market?
It's not that there'll be any more coins produced, it'll be about 3200BTC per day, no matter if miners run pen&paper, CPUs, GPUs, FPGAs, or ASICS.

Mining isn't the point to get more people using Bitcoin!

Come back from where?
Those people holding a few of those machines that operate at insane Hashrates are the very same people that operate large GPU-farms today, they get a lot more BTC already today than you do, as stated before, ASICs don't really change that.

I sold yesterday... Still keeping BTC10. Maybe the price goes even higher.

Please SELL!!! Last chance to sell at $27!!!

 Thank you for a better understanding and yes the new machines are way cheaper then the hardware i have now. Allot more practical. I still just dont see a good outcome of it all really. Speaking in terms of the long run and more people actually using the coins. The way i see it is the small miners are most likely the ones that will just spend the coins and they will recirculate.I find it hard to see the world or majority investing there cash when they see the huge drop in price and how fast it is going to happen.I am only thinking for myself but if the market drops as rapidly as i think it will when tons of these machines get rolling the Bitcoin that mind you i think its absolutely amazing to work out how well it did and become a currency which was very close to valid.

 I know Die Hard Bitcoiners will always be here till the end but isn't the point to get more people using them as a currency?

 Right now i love it its a blast to do and i am on 2 small machines really that i already owned so reading about Bitcoins and Mining and investing ,Gambling all the great stuff about it i got sucked in and love it. As i am sure many other Newbies did. But then when i started reading the Million posts and videos on how bad these new machines are for Bit coining as a whole my draw kinda dropped and i came here to just ask straight up what the deal was.

 I cant possibly understand how the value with ever come back up when you know there will be a few holders of toms of these machines operating and insane Hash rates.


 I thank you guys for the replies you left they were very helpful. I love Bitcoin's I love Mining (Not for huge profit but just for fun) And i would be devastated if everything fell apart as many predict it will.My personal reason for Mining is i was folding before Mining as i have a handicapped child. Well it seemed more practical to make some Bitcoins while having the same fun and Donate to some of the different Children Charity's like Autism and Cerebral Palsy and of course pay my electric ,Gamble a little,Invest a little. But these new machines kinda kill the whole online world of it all. Can i write and Post this message while Mining on one of those new machines? Can i be on the new Mining machines being part of the community?

 Just a bunch of stupid little concerns but you guys have been very helpful. Although sadly if it was a gamble i would be against Bitcoins making it do to this new technology Unfortunately .

But please guys come back in a couple years to this thread and say I told you so. Because there is nothing i want more then to be wrong. I really dont understand why you guys want to take the new people getting into Bitcoins out of the Picture. I think that 1 thing right there is a Killer. In the pool i am in 1 person owns like half the hashrate and the rest are all little guys. I know some with buy but can you imagine the amount that wont.

Sorry for the long blab and Long Live Bitcoin's

It isn't the end of Bitcoin but the end of Bitcoin mining and that means that Bitcoin will be used as a currency as opposed to a silly get rich scheme, Bitcoin was never intended to be purely about mining and it's actually been incredibly well designed for a real economy that isn't run by central banks, so the short version of it all is yes, you're very wrong

FTFY.

The only people who will really profit from ASIC are the few people that have the units now. Everything later is basically a joke.

This is the progression of any monetary system. The means of production are concentrated into fewer hands while the many have to compete against each other to get the crumbs of the pie. This is why we see the many problems we face as a global society, and it is one that money will never fix. While bitcoin is technically a better money, it remains money, and it can only lead to the further destruction of the human species until we learn to live without money.

^^This!


I don't see what bitcoins being used by the majority of people as an online currency has todo with the fact who generates them, or on what hardware they do it.

There's no need to be a miner at all to use Bitcoin as an online currency, a user doesn't really care who creates it.

If you wanted to become a decent miner before, you needed to invest in a lot of decent GPUs, or FPGAs,
if you want to become a decent miner now, you need to invest in (at least) a couple of ASICs.

ASICs don't change anything! (except for botnets, hopefully)

I think people said the same thing when you couldn't mine from the CPU's anymore.  I used to mine with GPU's what a headache.  lol

ASICs are just the natural order defending itself from outside threats, as any organism would.

You don't make hardly anything that you use yourself and most of it works great. And $1200 or whatever is hardly out of reach for home production anyway.

we HAVE to move ahead and hash harder

the ASICs will be widely dispersed, you mentioned the jale, even the SC single is $1300, cheaper than a GPU rig

if BFL and others had not moved ahead with bare metal ASIC then governments or banks would have, with the aim of destroying bitcoin

indeed, ASIC is bitcoin's salvation

It means a more secure network.  It does mean GPU mining is over, but there's a new technology until the next new technology.