Topic: [ANN] Grin | PoW Mining | Electronic transactions for all. Community driven. - page 40. (Read 73829 times)

That's too much for a small market cap coin. 1/20 of bitcoin's daily FIAT meal.

If you make the same calculation for LTC, it is 14400coins x $44 = $633k / daily need to keep the LTC price stable.

LTC is the 5th biggest coin.

GRIN is 199th.

Doesn't look good.

Imma buyer at $0.5.

Oops! Fixed now! Yes, the number looks better now, thanks for letting me know!
Those figures... they make you wonder just how much money is required to keep so many different cryptocoins floating.

Make that 1800 BTC (12.5 BTC per 10 minutes) ...

pbfarmer gave a correct explanation, but I'll try offer an example with numbers.

BITCOIN
Coins issued per day: 1800 BTC (12.5 BTC per 10 minutes)
Current price: 3800$
Current MarketCap.: $67 billions

GRIN
Coins issued per day: 86400 GRIN (60 GRIN per 1 minute)
Current price: 3.80$
Current MarketCap.: $14 millions

Now imagine that every day people are spending dollars to buy Bitcoin. There are some who would sell but after subtracting this amount, we have an overall amount of 6,840,000$ fresh fiat spent to buy Bitcoin.
They keep buying Bitcoin every day and forever and the amounts stay the same.
If they'd buy every Bitcoin for 3800$ each, they'd buy all the 1800 issued Bitcoins and the price wouldn't move at all.

When the issued Bitcoins are halved, if the interest for Bitcoin is still the same, there won't be enough mined coins for all the buyers. Therefore they'll have to buy from the market, raising the price until we reach a price where the interest to buy is reduced.
This bold sentence is the essence of the matter and why people are suggesting that GRIN won't enjoy very high prices.
Sure, there are many more factors than just the inflation rate, but the inflation rate is the most predictable and known factor of them all. It's logical that speculators and especially investors will weigh heavily this factor.
For example we can't know what amount of coins will be dumped by the miners.

By the way, GRIN requires 328,320$ every day to hold this price.

Oh, I suck at lot of things in life, but math.... never.

I think your math sucks, try doing it again.

won't be long until it goes under $1, sorry to say this but your an idiot if you are buying at the current price with the massive inflation rate.

Bottom line, the 'block reward reduction' of BTC is really just the means to the end of a fixed supply.  That fixed supply is the real consideration -- it incentivizes hoarding, and therefore is more suited to an 'investment' or store of value.  Compare this to GRIN, which has an unlimited supply, which puts constant downward pressure on the value (until/unless emission gets to replacement parity), and therefore incentivizes 'working capital' - i.e. use as a medium of exchange.

In short, yes, 1 GRIN you own today should be worth less not just in 4 years, but tomorrow, before any considerations of current fair value and/or speculative pressures.

If you look percentages, inflation is same like any other coin have.
When 4 years pass, then we will see inflation bigger than Bitcoin, Litecoin, Ravencoin or any other similar coin have, since there is no halving. In fifth year of mining, GRIN will have 25% yearly inflation since there is no halving and Bitcoin or Ravencoin for example had/will have 12.5% per year. Until fifth year, inflation is exactly same.

Grin coin is the hottest altcoins launched in 2018, and it has still been the hottest in early months of 2019.
Miners, traders, investors, crypto enthusiasts, lots of people have interests and huge demand on Grin coin.
I believe that after next two or three years, Grin coin will jump into the top 50 on coinmarketcap, at least.

Actually, I find your opinions to be very rational and I have to agree again.

I'd be happy to explain why I call it "undervalued", but please bear with my train of though! Also the main topic for the price can be continued in the appropriate thread if you want (link)
I always value a project, a stock or a coin based on their competition.

For the GRIN's case I compare it to Ravencoin and Monero. Ravencoin because of both having the same emission (for 4 years) and the same launch-type (no ICO/premine, community driven). Monero because its main selling point is probably its privacy, the same as GRIN's.
Judging by the price of both coins, I'd expect GRIN to have 2.5 times its current price on the short term and rival Ravencoin. Maybe if it's successful it can become stable at about 3 to 4 times its current price.
If that was to happen in 4 months from now, by that time we'll have 3 times more coins issued. So a 4 times increase in price and a 3 times increase in supply will result in 12 times its today's market cap.
With today's data, a 12 times increase of market cap would bring GRIN at $194m and position 32, still a lot lower than Monero's $810m market cap.

It all depends on where you place GRIN in comparison with other projects with similar customer target. Personally I place it around place 30-40 by marketcap and that's why I see it undervalued.



No, but they're doing halvings by time to time (and ETH has a lot of uses which GRIN is lacking).
Actually, I'm expecting the block reward to be a reason for GRIN to fork split down the road, when the community will be divided between reducing the block reward or sticking with their initial announcement.

Would you put 40% of your portfolio in cash in a traditional market?  That's basically what you are proposing w/ this split.

The intention of this coin, considering it's emission schedule, is to be a medium of exchange.  Such a vehicle is not traditionally held in such large positions, unless one is hedging against (or expecting) downward movement elsewhere, or planning on a spike in value for some other reason. 

I guess you're suggesting the latter - which begs the question... undervalued by what measure?

"For first 4 years" is the key in my statement.

@RivAnge
Neither Ethereum had or have max supply. Overall, I agree with almost everything you wrote.

I agree that the emission is as with any other coin, it's at least EXACTLY the same as Ravencoin's. I'm defending the developer's decision since the start.
However, an important factor for the coin's price is that there are no plans for a halving. This alone keeps some investors away, even if it won't matter for 4 years or more. There's also no maximum supply.

I remember that the team has stated that GRIN is not targeting to be another "store of value", it's not aiming to compete with Bitcoin and XRP.
If I were to invest a big amount of money for the long term right now, would I choose BTC which is the most widely adopted and as future-proof as it gets? Would I choose XRP for its slow coin burning? Or would I choose GRIN which is a new and cheap coin, but will issue new coins forever?

Well... right now I'd go 40%-40%-20% (GRIN-XRP-BTC) because GRIN is undervalued, but as soon as my investment would be at 200% I'd sell most of the coins for something else.
I believe many are thinking the same way, which is why I don't expect 2000% price pumps.

Please explain this to me again, I guess maybe I have no reading comprehension?

https://github.com/mimblewimble/grin/blob/master/doc/grin4bitcoiners.md

Grincoin is actually a good altcoin, one of the best altcoins, after Ethereum, DASH, Monero.
More than ten years after the beginning of the bitcointalk forum, since the day theymos took over the forum from satoshi, Grin coin is the first altcoin accepted as one of the payment means in the forum.
By now, only two payment gates:
One in Bitcoin, for years.
Second in Grin coin, since recent months.
It's more than impressively for Grin.

Nevertheless, I totally agreed with you that Grin coin has to been corrected deeply.
Where it come from, it will be corrected to that price range, before staring next round of growth.

Only smart miners are selling. In general most of miners seems very smart people to me.  Price of Grim will go under 10k sat. Mark my words.

Emission is same as any other coin for first 4 years.
Exact same as Raven or as Bitcoin or Litecoin.

There is no halvening after 4 years, but that yr 2023 is far, far away in crypto.

It has nothing to do with buzz, the emission was never intended to be sustainable for a pumping coin by design.