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Topic: [ANN] [PPC] PPCoin Released! - First Long-Term Energy-Efficient Crypto-Currency - page 107. (Read 684864 times)

legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1010
An user pmed me about paper wallet.

For now you can use command
ppcoind dumpprivkey
and then print it to paper

Later you can import it back to another wallet:
ppcoind importprivkey

I am not familiar with paper wallet and QR code etc. Anyone has a good idea of how it works and maybe start a project to convert such a bitcoin tool for printing paper wallet?

Quote
Hi, I was wondering how do you generate a ppc address and matching private key for paper storage?
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1010

It seems though that the coin generation schedule is a bit off. Sunny once estimated that the coin generation should average 15-20 million PPC per year. With a fluctuation between 40k-5k, averaging 20k/day we're at 7.3 million PPC per year. So even without asics in the wild, it seems that coin generation already massively slowed down.


Yeah current estimate would be 5m-10m coin production in 2013.
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1010
A quick look at Chris's devcoin repository shows that devcoin difficulty is derived from previous 144 blocks (average over one day, they started this continuous adjustment at block 10700). While ppcoin's difficulty is derived from previous 2 blocks (exponential moving average over one week).

https://github.com/doublec/devcoin/blob/master/src/main.cpp#L678
legendary
Activity: 1078
Merit: 1005
Here's a question for you, how is PPCoin going to remove the centralized checkpoint sharing when difficulty target is based on the immediately preceding block? What happens to a coin that does this and has a reorg? I guess that means Freicoin can't use your difficulty adjustment algorithm. This is the reason for the 8 block delay for the filter output.
Devcoin adjusts on every block IIRC and doesn't have checkpointing. Have you take a look how they do it?
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1010
Here's a question for you, how is PPCoin going to remove the centralized checkpoint sharing when difficulty target is based on the immediately preceding block? What happens to a coin that does this and has a reorg? I guess that means Freicoin can't use your difficulty adjustment algorithm. This is the reason for the 8 block delay for the filter output.

I don't know why you think deriving difficulty from preceding block(s) would cause any problem with reorganization, are you suggesting that bitcoin's block 2016*n would also have problems with reorganization? Difficulty is checked when connecting block, and it doesn't matter if you derive it from last two blocks or from last 2016 blocks.

As for Jorgeminator's difficulty chart I can't vouch for it's accuracy 100% but indeed there were several major peaks over 200ghs, because I basically check coinotron and bitparking pools pretty much every day.

Bitcoin's readjustment gets a rate using two times and uses that to adjust the difficulty within the limiter. The chain with the highest difficulty is the one selected by the reorganization. Every single block in your chain depends upon the last blocks difficulty. We can't use it because we don't have central check pointing to say which blockchain is the true one. It adjusts too often to lead to a stable network without central checkpointing.

I think you probably have some misunderstanding here. Reorganization has nothing to do with how often difficulty is adjusted, nor how many blocks are used to adjust difficulty. If you are concerned with difficulty changing every block that would weaken confirmations, yes there is a slight weakening in that attacker can override n-confirmations with his own n-blocks, n>=2, but not for 1-confirmation, as difficulty on both branches is the same for the first branching block. But no, I don't think it means you require checkpoint to protect the network, as bitcoin has the same issue albeit only every 2016 blocks. You can mitigate this problem by using older blocks to derive the new difficulty though, which forces multiple blocks on both branches to be at the same difficulty for the same height.
sr. member
Activity: 966
Merit: 311
Here's a question for you, how is PPCoin going to remove the centralized checkpoint sharing when difficulty target is based on the immediately preceding block? What happens to a coin that does this and has a reorg? I guess that means Freicoin can't use your difficulty adjustment algorithm. This is the reason for the 8 block delay for the filter output.

I don't know why you think deriving difficulty from preceding block(s) would cause any problem with reorganization, are you suggesting that bitcoin's block 2016*n would also have problems with reorganization? Difficulty is checked when connecting block, and it doesn't matter if you derive it from last two blocks or from last 2016 blocks.

As for Jorgeminator's difficulty chart I can't vouch for it's accuracy 100% but indeed there were several major peaks over 200ghs, because I basically check coinotron and bitparking pools pretty much every day.

Bitcoin's readjustment gets a rate using two times and uses that to adjust the difficulty within the limiter. The chain with the highest difficulty is the one selected by the reorganization. Every single block in your chain depends upon the last blocks difficulty. We can't use it because we don't have central check pointing to say which blockchain is the true one. It adjusts too often to lead to a stable network without central checkpointing.
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1010
Here's a question for you, how is PPCoin going to remove the centralized checkpoint sharing when difficulty target is based on the immediately preceding block? What happens to a coin that does this and has a reorg? I guess that means Freicoin can't use your difficulty adjustment algorithm. This is the reason for the 8 block delay for the filter output.

I don't know why you think deriving difficulty from preceding block(s) would cause any problem with reorganization, are you suggesting that bitcoin's block 2016*n would also have problems with reorganization? Difficulty is checked when connecting block, and it doesn't matter if you derive it from last two blocks or from last 2016 blocks.

As for Jorgeminator's difficulty chart I can't vouch for it's accuracy 100% but indeed there were several major peaks over 200ghs, because I basically check coinotron and bitparking pools pretty much every day.
sr. member
Activity: 966
Merit: 311
Here's a question for you, how is PPCoin going to remove the centralized checkpoint sharing when difficulty target is based on the immediately preceding block? What happens to a coin that does this and has a reorg? I guess that means Freicoin can't use your difficulty adjustment algorithm. This is the reason for the 8 block delay for the filter output.
sr. member
Activity: 966
Merit: 311
Jorgeminator made a hash rate comparison between freicoin, terracoin and ppcoin, which I believe is reasonably accurate:
Here you go  Wink



He did this with the numbers ABE gives out, which only works for coins that use the Bitcoin difficulty adjustment. Do you think your coins hashrate was bouncing up and down like that?
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1010
Vircurex reports network hashrate around 135 Ghashes.

As I have been discussing with Sunny King in PM because of all the variables in the design of PPCoin, everything changes each block, its next to impossible to calculate the real hash rate. I assure you its nowhere near 135 GH/s.

I can confirm that vircurex hash rate estimate is not accurate. However its not 'next to impossible' to estimate ppcoin network hash rate. I have already discussed this topic in my weekly update #12 last November:

  • Regarding network hash rate, since ppcoin is designed with variable spacing target for proof-of-work blocks, you cannot directly compare network hash rate to other block chains based on proof-of-work difficulty. To estimate network hash rate you would need to first get an estimate of current proof-of-work spacing target (in seconds), by counting the number of proof-of-work blocks in the last 24 hours for example. The formula to calculate the total network hash rate is: hash rate = difficulty * 4G / spacing target.

Jorgeminator made a hash rate comparison between freicoin, terracoin and ppcoin, which I believe is reasonably accurate:
Here you go  Wink



It is also next to impossible to guarantee that for a given hashrate the coin will be at a certain difficulty within a certain period of time. Our PM discussions have made me think I should apply the PPCoin difficulty algorithm to Bitcoin and demonstrate what happens. I imagine Bitcoin's difficulty would be somewhere in the trillions (or worse) with the PPCoin difficulty adjustment algorithm.

Take calculations like the one done by Vircurex, which probably assumes a constant difficulty and a 10 minute block spacing, with a grain of salt.

Why do you want to apply a variable spacing design to a pure proof-of-work coin? There is no need for that. I was only recommending freicoin to adopt the continuous difficulty adjustment, not variable spacing target. Besides I have never claimed that a high difficulty means superior network protection, so why bother? But even if you do, ppcoin only makes proof-of-work difficulty between 0x - 11x larger so I don't know where you get this trillion number.

It's true that hash rate is a good indication of network strength for proof-of-work coins, but for ppcoin it's the contrary. A lower hash rate is preferred by ppcoin, as it's an indication of energy efficiency. Indeed even as a hybrid design, ppcoin is a lot more energy efficient to a pure proof-of-work coin of comparable market cap.
donator
Activity: 994
Merit: 1000
2+ million coins mined early, yesterday little over 9k ... you really think that most people are dumb enough to buy PPC even at 0.00013 rate?

PPCoin is early-adopter scam coin, nothing more.

"If" ppcoin is a success, then 0.00013 is still a bargain. The people who mine first (2+ million coins) are not necessarily the ones which make the most profit. If the first miners sell cheap (because they had no costs), then others in the free market are there to profit from future appreciation.

Also - stay real. 2 million ppc at 0.0001BTC/PPC is 200 BTC, which really isn't a lot of value.

It seems though that the coin generation schedule is a bit off. Sunny once estimated that the coin generation should average 15-20 million PPC per year. With a fluctuation between 40k-5k, averaging 20k/day we're at 7.3 million PPC per year. So even without asics in the wild, it seems that coin generation already massively slowed down.

In any event, don't focus on the trading economics of a cryptocurrency, but on it's properties instead - that what gives it long-term value...
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1010
2+ million coins mined early, yesterday little over 9k ... you really think that most people are dumb enough to buy PPC even at 0.00013 rate?

Coinotron under 10 Ghashes, BitParking under 5 Ghashes, Vircurex reports network hashrate around 135 Ghashes. That is so cool, few people
have the most old and new coins, and have enough stake to do whatever they want to, including limitless free double-spends attempts.

PPCoin is early-adopter scam coin, nothing more.

Sure you are welcome to create a no-early-adopter commie coin to compete in the market. In my opinion it's one of the architect's jobs to protect the interest of 'early adopters' because they deserve it. Welcome to the world of free market  Wink

The first day mintage is naturally high for any publicly pre-announced coin because miners would pile in at the release. We had already done a couple things to alleviate it, by starting difficulty at 256 and continuously adjust difficulty at every block. So there are less than 1000 initial low difficulty blocks. Compare this to a coin that doesn't take these measures, for example freicoin started difficulty at 1 and has more than 10000 low difficulty blocks.

As far as I am concerned ppcoin project is currently the only project in production implementing alternative technology to bitcoin, nearly all other altcoins are carbon copies of bitcoin. So I am sure there are astute users out there that would disagree with you as to ppcoin's value.
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
2+ million coins mined early, yesterday little over 9k ... you really think that most people are dumb enough to buy PPC even at 0.00013 rate?



Coinotron under 10 Ghashes, BitParking under 5 Ghashes, Vircurex reports network hashrate around 135 Ghashes. That is so cool, few people
have the most old and new coins, and have enough stake to do whatever they want to, including limitless free double-spends attempts.

PPCoin is early-adopter scam coin, nothing more.

Apparently, you know nothing about PPC.  Way to go.
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
Our seed nodes would be offline some time next week due to hosting problem. While I look for alternatives, I might need your help to volunteer a temporary seed node.

This means, any node running ppcoind as server (if you have >8 connections then you are definitely running as server). Then I would point seed.ppcoin.net to it's IP (of course static IP is better, but even dynamic IP is ok, as long as it doesn't change very often). Please only volunteer if you can run the node 24x7 for at least one month.

The job of seed node is to help new node with initial download of block chain. The load on seed node is very low I believe so bandwidth shouldn't be a concern.

Let me know if you want to volunteer. Please PM me static/DHCP, IP address and upload bandwidth if residential line. Any recommendation of BTC hosting providers is also appreciated. Thanks!

You can use the proofofstake.com node.

Andy

legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1010
Our seed nodes would be offline some time next week due to hosting problem. While I look for alternatives, I might need your help to volunteer a temporary seed node.

This means, any node running ppcoind as server (if you have >8 connections then you are definitely running as server). Then I would point seed.ppcoin.net to it's IP (of course static IP is better, but even dynamic IP is ok, as long as it doesn't change very often). Please only volunteer if you can run the node 24x7 for at least one month.

The job of seed node is to help new node with initial download of block chain. The load on seed node is very low I believe so bandwidth shouldn't be a concern.

Let me know if you want to volunteer. Please PM me static/DHCP, IP address and upload bandwidth if residential line. Any recommendation of BTC hosting providers is also appreciated. Thanks!
full member
Activity: 467
Merit: 100
DIA | Data infrastructure for DeFi
Thanks. I turned off, it's OK.
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1010
This GUI use 100% procesor.
It is normal  Angry ?

Usually that means the built-in cpu mining is turned on (especially if you have multi-core processor). Have you check the 'gen' configuration parameter in your ppcoin.conf file? Note the default is turned off, so if you don't see 'gen' in the configuration file then cpu mining should be turned off.

full member
Activity: 467
Merit: 100
DIA | Data infrastructure for DeFi
This GUI use 100% procesor.
It is normal  Angry ?
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1010
Sunny King tell me please:
This GUI is the oficial version ?
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/75013537/PPCoin.7z
Why GUI is missed on official page ?

The gui build in the link is done by xchrix I believe. gui build is not yet officially supported in release due to the complexity of bitcoin's verifiable build system (gitian-builder) that we use and also due to our limited resources. But there is a possibility that an unpolished gui build would be included in the coming 0.3 release (no guarantee though).
full member
Activity: 467
Merit: 100
DIA | Data infrastructure for DeFi
Sunny King tell me please:
This GUI is the oficial version ?
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/75013537/PPCoin.7z
Why GUI is missed on official page ?
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