Topic: [ANN] Take a Stand with EBT ★ Reject Paid Voting on Exchanges ★ (Read 6213 times)

I concur with your opinion. Paid voting should never be supported. If the coin is worthy enough and there is demand among people, it will naturally find its way to a exchange sooner or later.

And that's why it's so important to not pay for votes.  If you believe in a coin and want to see it successful, it's better to spend money/btc on building marketplace infrastructure so people can use the coin to buy and sell goods than paying to get listed on another exchange for everyone to dump the coin for btc.

They keep it, simple as that! That's why they allow paid voting, to scoop money while they can.

More and more exchange sites are adopting the paid voting system.  I wonder how much money these exchange sites are raking in from paid votes and either won't ever launch or will never list the coins?

What happens to all the money from those paid votes?

You aer right about following the example. Change will happen if enough people believe in it.

Everyone takes bribes and will always continue to do so, but many of us only support coins that take the stand.  People commit murder, rape women, beat children, these things will never stop, but we can choose not to support or use the services of those who do.

The challenge is that most of those in the crypto markets are just out for a quick buck, mine a coin in the beginning and dump it right away for a trade up to BTC, then cash out to dollars.  With that type of community, most people don't care about bribe votes going on at the larger exchanges, as long as they're still making a buck, it's fine with them.

You can't change the world, only hope that by your example others will follow.

What's up with this? Cryptorush is still taking bribes in the form of paid votes. That's sounds like the voting in Ukraine. There was nothing fair about that.
They even take coins in there without voting. One example is spaincoin.

This conversation is a good way to see this thing from different angles and vent some frustration these paid votes have caused.

This guy from allcrypt it's brain stupid you know that guys right ? Did you saw what he wrote ? He really enjoy taking bribes . Why the hell would remove the code isn't nothing hard about that .   SIMPLY REMOVE ALL ADDRESSES AND PAGE ! Simple as that . Anyway it will be activity against such exchanges and maybe authorities will hear .  

"For example, in 2006, German prosecutors conducted a wide-ranging investigation of Siemens AG to determine if Siemens employees paid bribes in exchange for business." Gone in prison . That's your faith and the others too . Everything that has too do with pay off for getting up in front of everyone it's a BRIBE & ILLEGAL .

Like the Beatles sing "money can't buy me love" it also can't buy love for a coin. If you remove all paid votes from the voting list, it would not look the same. I believe the top 5 coins on those lists would be totally different.

No need for justification to me.  Like I said, I agree with you.  Every week dozens of coins are being thought up (dog, cat, heavy, lite, moon, saturn, red, green) all with the single goal of mining in the beginning, hitting an exchange and being dumped in an effort to trade up to BTC.

What happens when the real business world realizes this and catches on?  Trying to get an exchange to list you is only one small step in development of a coin.  If someone wants EBT badly enough, sell me a watch, or a car, or clean my house for EBT.  If I want your goods and services badly enough I need to be willing to part with my rare EBT for them at a price we both agree on.

That's the type of thinking the crypto community needs to return to, that's the type of thinking (and usage) which will make a coin valuable.

If it takes abrasiveness to get that point across, I'm all for it.  Even if EBT gets destroyed in the process, they've taken a stand and given the crypto community a much needed wake up call.

However, considering the boom EBT's seen since this little disagreement between the dev team and the exchanges I don't see EBT going anywhere but up in the near future.  I may be wrong, just ask my 3 ex-wives, but we'll see.  My bet is on EBT.

I'm more interested in accuracy than delicacy, and bullshit doesn't merit a soft touch. Yes, I obviously agree with you that energy would best be redirected toward genuine prosperity rather than expending itself in lotto-ticket style desperation. Taken in context, it was an appeal to start thinking in a more winning manner, which includes calling out loser-think for what it is.

Good point although a little abrasive.  Every exchange will jump onto a coin, votes or not if they see it being actively used for buying and selling goods/services, without the need for votes, free or paid.

This is where EBT and every other coin needs to focus their energy, getting it actively being used.

Just stumbled into this discussion thread and felt much relief at the presence of some like-minded individuals. The altcoin ecosphere has gotten into a pretty polluted state, such that it feels like a hard rain's gonna fall, sooner than later. I'd like to repost a comment I made elsewhere a few days ago (post-launch on another thread) in reaction to the grovel-beg-bribe sucker mentality that has spread like bubonic plague throughout the land of crypto:

Take a moment to step back from the frenzy of the launch and all the hope, fear and emotionalism over the future of this coin. Since we are all presumably interested in wealth-creation, how about a few words on the psychology of abundance vs the psychology of poverty. Not a place for an essay here, so I'll cut to the chase and point out that all the manic competition lately over whose (most often) shitcoin will be fastest onto an exchange, and in particular this imbecilic voting bs with the exchanges 'selling' votes as a commodity -- all this reflects the mindset of poverty. Poverty, victimhood, and the golden opportunity for exploitation that goes with them. It works like this: You secretly fear you have 'little' and therefore must compete for scraps of approval meted out by beings above you who seemingly have a say in your future. It's a sorry state of affairs that the exchanges actually can pull-off this cheesy scam of taking your money in exchange for these pathetic 'votes'. Lol, for the privilege of possibly being allowed in their doors. I would not debase myself, or my coin, to mentally (let alone financially) buy into this horseshit. Just as an exercise in positive visualization: how about picturing the exchanges kissing your ass and competing to be the big volume player in the great action of your awesome coin. Just a thought, folks.

5byZvfJY8hhH2QpfGoYi531xNiVn1BenRr bump for the cause!

allcrypt,

Don't take it bad. It's clear that there are very strong and different views on this subject.

I for one was very interested in reading your posts to understand a bit more were both sides are coming from and thank you for posting. I have my own opinion and although I would very much like to share them I know that it would pretty much cost me a lot of time and fill pages and will not change anything at the end so I resist. 

The whole thing rises other questions for me...why for example did the exchanges start adding every trash coin? The whole voteing idea has something of: we don't care what coin we will add they are all crap... which is true..

I see from your name allcrypt that you probabily plan to add as many as possible so ok thats a good reason maybe but then why is cryptsy and others starting to convert their well established exchanges into crap exchanges!?
But yes thats another topic. And no I don't know how to evaluate what a good coin for an exchange is.
I certainly hadn't done a you can pay for votes system. It's not a good idea at all if you think long enough about it. I self wouldn't pay for any coin to add to an exchange and in a way I like those coins that haven't paid. I also however think that the "take a stand" movement is a bit extrem.  But yes I don't want to start my 10 pages explanations.

I just typed a pretty long winded response, but it's quite clear that with the intelligence level of some here - it's just not worth the time. If you'd like me to remove EBT from the voting page I will - I cannot imagine that with the mature, educated and stand-up community some of you appear to be that anyone would use AllCrypt.com anyway - after all, it's clearly run by a public official who takes bribes. It's too much work to remove the donations from it and after the way I was just spoken to here, I've no desire to recode the voting page.

Or I can donate 100% of all BTC that comes into that address to charity. Which I expect to be zero anyway, given how obviously corrupt a paid voting system is. Up to you.

The dev has my email - he can email me his decision. Not worth my time to come back to this friendly and open minded corner of the net.

hahahahaha 20% donation .


You and the others that take bribe i really , really hope you will go in JAIL . This is a clear proof of bribe . e-bribe for putting up a copy-pasta coin . 20 % ALL OF THEM 100% . SERIOUSLY ? With 20% you brag ? WITH THAT YOU DARE TOO BRAG ?! Buying votes = FRAUD in all countries possible . All exchanges like you will be screwed the same way this are dishonest money ! Yes BRIBE ! . Good bye hope it will come and knock off your door down tomorrow morning .



The bribe is the gift bestowed to influence the recipient's conduct. It may be any money, good, right in action, property, preferment, privilege, emolument, object of value, advantage, or merely a promise or undertaking to induce or influence the action, vote, or influence of a person in an official or public capacity.[1]

"We publicly pledged 20% of all vote donations would be going to charity."

Enough said, and they're not "donations".  Call them what they really are...

http://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoMarkets/comments/1zas97/allcryptcom_launched_last_night_donated_359_btc/

Our marketing guy hasnt gotten the blog up, so I'm doing that today. In the meantime - there is the post we made about it. Including addresses, links, as well as a message signed with the address used to make the donation, clearly visible on blockchain.info as being Sean's Outpost's donation address.



No, the word sleazy was not used, but it was implied. Using the words bribes and corruption are pretty much synonyms. And speaking of the word corruption - it really ticks me off when people use inflammatory words to incite an emotional  response, when it's not even remotely true.

cor·rup·tion
kəˈrəpSHən
noun
1.
dishonest or fraudulent conduct by those in power, typically involving bribery.
"the journalist who wants to expose corruption in high places"
synonyms:   dishonesty, unscrupulousness, double-dealing, fraud, fraudulence, misconduct, crime, criminality, wrongdoing; More

AllCrypt.com has never been dishonest, unscrupulous, fraudulent, or any of the above. We have gone above and beyond to maintain our ethos of transparency and integrity.

So yes, I do, personally, get very defensive when I'm told, even indirectly, that we are corrupt. The whole tone of this thread is "bribes are corruption and it's underhanded and terrible and you're bad people for doing it."


Do you want the supporters of EBT to have to sign up to a site and trade something else, coins they don't care about, to have to vote? A minimum balance is easily faked. You deposit, vote, withdraw. Rinse, repeat. Maybe two of you sign up, one deposits doge, the other BTC, and they do a bunch of 1 satoshi trades back and and forth... both skewing the market volume and trade price numbers (thats a hell of a lot closer to corruption than we've ever come), to meet those minimum trade numbers?

Each user can only vote a limited number of time total? Only on one coin a certain number of times? So they make a new account. And another. And another. Ok, wait, stop them from doing that by imposing trade restrictions. Let us now infinite loop back up to the previous paragraph.

10 Make Account
20 Deposit BTC
30 Make another account
40 Deposit Doge
50 Ruin orderbook with fake trades
60 Vote
70 Withdraw BTC and DOGE
80 Log Out
90 Goto 10

Don't condemn what we do because you don't like the fact that others CHOOSE to vote with supportting currency.

By your philosophy, everyone on kickstarter is taking bribes and corrupt.

Seriously - think about it. Say we instead ran a kickstarter campaign. And as a Perk at the $20 level you got a tee shirt - and as a perk at the $500 level you got a no-fee account, and as a perk at the $1000 level we guaranteed to add any coin you chose at launch.

Is that bribery?

Is that corruption?

Is that ANY DIFFERENT than what we did? I really need to hear a well thought out explanation as to how taking crypto donations as low as 8 cents to help your coin is ANY different whatsoever than running a kickstarter campaign, and taking $1000 to add your coin.

If our coin voting is bribery and corruption, so is every kickstarter out there.

And again - it's OPTIONAL. If we REQUIRED payment, we'd be some pretty slimetastic douchebags. Right now we have 66 coins on AllCrypt.com. Of those 64 coins (BTC and LTC were immune from voting and donations), and I am pulling the data live from the database there were:

• 33 of the 64 received a grand total of 0.000 BTC in donations.
• Of the 31 that received donations, only 12 received more than .059 BTC ($37)
• Of the 31 that received at least .0003 BTC (the lowest amount of any coin thats been added so far, not counting 0 donation coins), there were 537,353 votes cast. When you add in the votes from donations, the total score of those coins was 663,515 votes. That means of the 31 coins that recceived any donations at all, only about 19% of all votes were from BTC
• Counting ALL coins currently listed on AllCrypt, a total of 1,137,637 votes were cast. We already know that 126,162 were paid votes. Meaning about 10-11% of all votes from all coins on AllCrypt were paid votes.

Shocking levels of corruption.

I keep coming back to that word because it really pisses me off.

We pledged 20% of all donations would go to charity. And it did.

But it's just so WRONG.

One last point before I get back to coding today - If you don't want EBT to gain votes through money, then have your community just... gasp... not donate? Politely state that you want EBT to be "above that, and while I realize we're all not like that, I ask that we don't stoop to that level." I never understand the tendency of people to want to legislate other people's actions. Don't want to pay for votes? Then DONT PAY. Why "pass a law" stopping others from doing so?

I really do want to hear the argument as to why what we did is so corrupt, but if we did it on kickstarter it wouldnt have been. Of if it was, I want to hear why EVERY campaign on kickstarter isn't bribery and corruption.

(As for OpenEx - god no. Build an exchange based on software everyone else has the source code to? Are you daft? Let's publish any possible security hole, and even if it has the community to shore it up, hackers still have a REALLY good starting point to find those holes. No way.)