Topic: [ANN][DASH] Dash (dash.org) | First Self-Funding Self-Governing Crypto Currency - page 1738. (Read 9724017 times)

Amsterdam Meet-up

I am sitting at the airport in Amsterdam right now waiting to go relax for a few days after a very productive Dash work week in Amsterdam and I thought this would be the perfect time to share my experience with the community. It was a really positive and reassuring experience to meet face to face with people and present about Dash.  Everyone was incredibly receptive to what we had to say and there is a lot of interest in what we are doing.

It was reassuring to confirm that networking and doing business in crypto works just like in any other vertical I have participated in the past and has nothing to do with forum discussions. Also working in real life for Dash is extremely effective when done in the right context, it felt really good so we want to do a lot more conferences and meet-ups over the next year.  Face to face contact with people interested in the industry has no comparison with any forum interaction, my conclusion is that the forum can have two negative side effects, either it can give you a false sensation of progress because there may be a wave of community interaction with no real impact on the outside world or it can give a false sense of worry due to all the noise and amplify issues like "trolls" which have no impact in the real world either.

When you meet face to face with people from the industry they want to know if you have a sustainable business model that could work and how you are creating value for users. Areas like governance and funding seem to resonate the most with people that are trying to determine whether we have a long term chance of being successful or not.

All we have to do is continue to focus on creating value for end users and building a platform people want to use because it solves real needs beyond any speculative interest. That is the ultimate goal and we have a well defined road-map to get there that goes beyond anything that has been done before.

It is clear we are moving in the right direction and there is growing support for the project I think as a community we should focus on face to face interactions going forward in a big way. If anyone wants to get active think about a way of doing it in real life. For me it was a great experience meeting with several people from the team and the community and I am more excited than ever to get back home in a few days and continue working on the project.

dashman version 0.1.9 released

https://github.com/moocowmoo/dashman

Added new (beta) command "dashman vote"
 - automates vote submission
 - randomizes vote timestamps up to one day in the past to help disassociate ownership
 - requires:
    - dash-cli in $PATH
    - masternode.conf in $HOME/.dash
    - python 2


This is a beta release.
Worst case it crashes harmlessly, but let me know and I'll push fixes.
For now, it only submits votes. It doesn't know anything about previously submitted votes.
The network only accepts "YES" and "NO" votes, selecting "ABSTAIN" simply doesn't do anything and will not affect a previously cast vote.
This may change in the future to allow for removing a previously cast vote from the network.

Dash Biweekly Digest - 9th October, 2015

https://dashtalk.org/threads/dash-biweekly-digest-9th-october-2015.6374/

If you check bitcoins early history the same shit was happening with people pissed off about satoshi's HUGE stash of coins from early on...Saying it was a massive risk if he decides to dump one day, its centralized, unfair etc etc. There was a period where trolls harped on about this for months and months much more than Dash. We have 2-3 main trolls...they had what seemed like hundreds.

End result...no one gives a shit now. Those trolls could have bought thousands of Dash on exchanges for pittance early on....everyone had the same opportunity. Some people did something about it, others chose to ignore.

Get the PR & Marketing going and this will be a thing of the past.

Check my signature for some perspective and a little exposition of our beloved house troll aSSRAPER.

Also I have a sneaking suspicion that this "DrDeepWeb" is an undercover troll. He keeps regurgitating the same point over and over back at dashtalk in that thread ignoring any explanations given. Plus: No one is "sweeping" anything "under the rug". The bugmine has been explained trillions of times by now.

Edit: Troll #2 also exposed. Definitely worthy a repost:


Trolls these days (had to make my own version with bottles and gun ):

I think that DrDeepWeb is a smoothie's friend. Look how quick he found post which suits him.

Of course do your research and ask questions but be sure no one is trying to hide, sweep anything under the rug.
Ugly DrDeepWeb's insinuations. This is getting ridiculous  

What is this about? I didn't read the whole topic on dashtalk yet...
Is that guy a troll?

Pruning?

Initial funds are A.  A -> B, B -> C, C -> D, D -> E.

Final tx shows only A -> E.

Since B, C, and D are irrelevant because, you know, anonymity? 

I have the same question!
I guess we need to wait for the vid from Amsterdam

That's a pitty, I was looking forward to it.
I've read that there was a presentation in amsterdam. I hope that Evan released some information there on how it will be implemented.
It would be good to at least know it's possible and know the way forward. I hope he reveals his plans a bit...
After all, we are a decentralized currency, no? So if someone wants to help developing, it would be a good idea for Evan to release his plans so others can start working on it, even as volunteers! As far as I know, bitcoin has a lot of volonteers working on the code, not many are paid.

I watched them and thx for the better picture!

This is true but they have to be in a block later. This part is interesting.

My thinking goes this far.  Instant Transactions will have the input funds locked by a set of 10 masternodes chosen deterministically.  There are 3,500 masternodes.  Therefore 350 (3500/10) Instant Transactions (minus overhead) can be locked simultaneously.  If this process can happen a couple of times every second, then 500-1500 is the answer.

If there are any devs watching that want to correct me, please do. 

I watched the vids. I'm still not sure how InstantX manages to be secure though...
I kinda understand how it works, but not sure how the security works.

This is how I think bitcoin works:
the big problem in cryptocurrencies is that there is lag on a network. If there wasn't lag, we could just all send transactions. Everybody would see the first transactions and an attempt at double spend would be automatically ignored.
But there is lag (latency) on a network, so we need some kind of synchronization. Therefore, bitcoin groups transactions in "blocks". These blocks are propagated in the network. Once a block is mined, the transaction has one confirmation. However, it's still possible someone mines on an older version of the chain, so for bigger transactions, it's better to wait for more (2, 3, ...) confirmations to be sure it's included in the longest chain.
(correct me if I'm wrong)

This is how I think DASH works:
There are decentralized oracles that are deterministically chosen and vote on "locking" a transaction. When the oracles decide that a transaction is locked, miners can't mine a double spend because all nodes (masternodes or all nodes?) reject transactions that are in conflict with the locked transaction. If a block is mined with a conflicting transaction, that block is rejected by the nodes and other miners (but how can you force miners to reject a block? ).
Also, I'm not clear on what happens with the double spend transaction if that one also get locked by other masternodes that ignore the first transaction. After all, your masternode get a fee when you vote for a transaction (I think?), so you have an incentive to vote for the double spent transaction. is it possible that there is a competing locked transaction?

So as you can see, I still have some questions about the security of InstantX. i marked them so it's easier to address them.


I don't know about them. I just arrived... I guess any disruptive tech puts some other people at a loss, making them angry
I guess I'll notice them and put them on ignore

Centralized services will always be created. Some will be very useful and valuable. However, the ultimate goal for Dash as a currency should be decentralize, decentralize, decentralize to avoid the single points of failure. This is the whole point of crypto. Development should always continue on the core protocol no matter how convenient centralized services seem.

And decentralized development doesn't have to mean complicated. Masternode maintenance and duties can be made to be easier as Dash refines.

I politely disagree. I don't suggest for one minute that you're an idiot.. Please don't think that my intention is to insult your intelligence   My point is that we shouldn't give up on creating a number of decentralized services within the Dash ecosystem just because we already have 'excellent' centralized services that are available. Dashwhale is great (I'm a happy member), however, any service like this ultimately goes against what we're trying to achieve...

I suppose it's a complex argument but what happens when dashwhale becomes 'the google' for masternode services? It becomes indispensable to us MN owners... Do we - as masternode owners - continue to cede to potential demands in the future for more blockchain funds to ensure these 'vital' services continue to be run? regardless of the marginal cost of producing the service the 'owner' of dashwhale could legitimately demand dash funding in excess of their needs in order to profit - is this acceptable? My post is not to judge either way... It is merely to discuss the complexities of the subject.

Maybe decentralization only matters at the 'top tier' as Evan would say...? the rest of the sub-ecosystem can be as centralized as many real world services with a true market dynamic in place with profit the primary motive?

Discuss.

Walter

Someone has the right idea (DrDeepWeb):

https://dashtalk.org/threads/dash-team-at-bitcoin-wednesday-amsterdam-presentation.6287/page-11#post-70235

If you host a Masternode on vultr and your server is located in Los Angeles

I read that btw  . And I remember when Evan talked about quorums few weeks ago at dashtalk.
What is interesting that those tx have to be in a block later, so...I'm eager to test it 

Hi cryptonewb, welcome to our forum.

There is no ETA known yet and the details are also unknown.

The latest was from Evan and can be read here : https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.12638189  

I either read or heard somewhere that v13 (codename Evolution) is planned to be released in 3 versions (v1, v2, v3) and that only the last version will have the full scalability implemented.
Evan has mentioned he will bring out video's to prepare us for Evolution (i remember hearing him say that 10 video's will come out to deal with it all in detail)

Also what stan.distortion already mentioned in the previous page, its a good idea to watch the introduction video's on page 1
 
edit : i replaced your picture with a higher resolution, i hope you don't mind...
 

Sure, but the devs are busy (obviously) and in the meantime this is an available tool to the less-than-ultra-tech-savvy club of MN owners, which apparently includes toknormal and myself. If you think MN's should only be run by geeks, then not a lot of real investment is going to happen here.

Services like Dashwhale and Node40 demystify and simplify the process of MN ownership/voting and throwing out some Visa quote like I'm an idiot doesn't really move the conversation forward.

I'm only saying: "Give them a chance, they're an excellent service to help bring in new MN owners and to help existing owners to have a voice in the voting process".

EDIT: If Dashwhale is so centralized, then what is lost/exposed by their site getting hacked or going down? Nothing. No information stored on MN owners, no funds to lose, etc. So what is so centralized about it and how does that risk offset the benefits I just described? I'm always learning and willing to hear a real argument.