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Topic: [ANN][KARM] Karma / ₭ / X11 - page 210. (Read 583120 times)

full member
Activity: 184
Merit: 100
August 06, 2014, 10:13:57 AM
What are your thoughts on exchange pricing per 100 Karma?

I believe this would make each block currently worth about USD 0.001, which would give us some room for growth in price (with a price target of anywhere between 1 cent to 10 cents per Karma block in the next year or so).

This would, of course, in no way impact users wallets but may make it easier for users to purchase (from a psychological perspective) similar to how pre-paid phone cards or debit cards are re-charged in blocks of units (instead of individual units), You can't re-charge your phone with 1 minute worth of time but perhaps you could with 100 minutes' worth.

When you go to the grocery store to buy meat or fish, pricing may be per 100 grams. The grocery store owner knows that people will buy more when they think of buying multiples or fractions of 100 grams instead of multiples of 1 gram.

I think right now we are just doing what every other coin is doing and not really thinking of how we can be pioneers. Anything different is seen as a "trick". But how about the first grocery store that thought to price their perishables differently?

If change makes sense and has more upside than downside, then I say let's go for it. There will always be people who want to use their horses in an age of the "horseless carriage". But we are leaders, not followers.

Thank you for recognising the importance of this and giving it your support.

To me price per 1,000 is more logical than price per 100. To use your metaphor, fish is priced per kilogram not per 100 grams. The weight is measured in grams. All I'm suggesting is we price our fish in kilograms. You can still by 127 grams of fish even when it is priced in kilograms.

It is price per 1,000 Karma on exchanges, not per block of 1,000 Karma. The way I described it obviously needs work, I'll make one large post with everything tomorrow if I have time. You don't need to buy 1,000 Karma at a time, like how now you don't need to buy a whole 1 Karma at a time. You can buy 0.00000001 Karma at a time now. The change would make it so you could buy 0.00001 Karma at a time.

I have made an example transaction below that may better illustrate how the user would see the change:


On Mintpal all you need to do is type in the amount you want to buy and press buy. That won't change. You still want to buy the same amount, just type that same amount in the box. The current price will automatically be filled.

Chargin.
full member
Activity: 184
Merit: 100
August 06, 2014, 08:44:46 AM
now just to change the topic slightly.. has anyone seen airtasker?

I just saw this on tv and checked out the site.

https://www.airtasker.com

a site like this for Karma (or any other crypto) where you can task people to do small jobs and good things.. that would be awesome.

consider this for a concept.

just say there is a granny living alone and she needs her garden cleaned.
just say nobody in the Karma community lives near her.
just say there was a website where she could post an advert that she needs help.
just say some generous Karma people offer to support her Task and donate some karma to the cause.
just say some local kids from the neighborhood see the job posted online and need some pocket money.

the kids sign up accept the job.. they clean the grannies garden. Once the job is complete the Granny marks the job well done online and the kids get paid.
now the kids can do whatever they want with their karma. they could swap it for BTC on an exchange, they could buy online goods like Games, or they could use to pay someone else to do a job for them.

everyone is happy and good Karma is bestowed upon all.


well you might say.. what is to stop the kids from doing a crappy job and ripping off the granny...

well just say you had a 5 star system ... if the kids do a good job (5 stars) they get all the money.. 4 stars and they only get 80% of the money etc etc.
and whatever Karma is left over goes back to the donors.

whats to stop the granny from taking advantage of the kids and giving them only 1 star (ie only 20% if the pay) even if they do an awesome job...
well the money left over doesn't go back to the granny and she has a star rating too.

Damn those sneaky grannies, you have to watch out for them.

I've seen the site before.

It's good but we don't have the developers to do everything at the moment. I think it is best to focus on other initiatives. I'd prefer we do a few things well instead of several things poorly.

Chargin.
sr. member
Activity: 532
Merit: 250
August 06, 2014, 07:50:36 AM
@ptman, how's the development of the game elephant? Your game has become a favorite game of my son who is 4 and he only now to be several million miles he!  Grin Grin It's good money to be transferred directly to the donation and development of KARMA!
On a good way to attract more miners to create some small quests to solve and true original decision to donate KARMA's. Also from time to time to give away as a bonus KARMA's for something! The truth is that everyone wants to get as much as possible without giving something of themselves .... the idea is simple quests and a little KARMA for everyone! It will not be a big expense, but the idea going to come out and lead many investors. This is the psychology of many banks ... give you vouchers worth € 100 in your hands and not like them, have them spend it without thinking how it will come back. But this creates clients and work.
Excuse my bad English and I hope I understood!

Cool.

I like the idea that someone likes the game.
Even at this early stage Tongue

Things that I think we need to focus:
  • Working online wallet that can work as a normal Karma wallet, and is integrated with LILL.com and other Karmashares services (Webspond, Hireplex, Karma game).
  • Give programmers access to an easy API (can be built on top of existing APIs) that allow Karma integration in their websites, mobile apps, etc.
  • Market Karma like crazy.
sr. member
Activity: 257
Merit: 250
August 06, 2014, 07:40:43 AM
Recommended post.
10,000 Karma sent to you for your work. Thank you!


Kosmos&CO, I finished the migration of Bitpay Insight API into KARMA coin. The block explorer is fully functional with real-time updates via RPC. You can find it here: http://162.243.209.71:3000/

The next task is to rename BTC into KARM/KARMA in GUI. - should be easy

Most of people do not realize how important is Insight API, it is amazing wrapper on bitcoin wallet. It allows people to easily create web wallets and web services. With this API hosted on trusted server web developers can easily implement KARMA into their web pages without need to run own KARMA wallet. When I was searching how to port it, I realized there were many other alt coins trying to port it which failed. Insight API does not work for POW/POS or POS coins. Many POW coins tried and failed to implement it. Very few were successful.

Check https://github.com/bitpay/insight-api for more info.

I will write some JS code to test the API if it work with KARM well.

The next task is to run CoinPunk wallet: https://coinpunk.com/, it is awesome web wallet written in JavaScript, browser based. So anyone lazy to download and sync KARMA wallet can go to coinpunk server, create his JS wallet in seconds and use it thanks to Insight API.

I will take care of it later, when I do the tests with JavaScript transactions if they work correctly.



Great!
Can this be used to get distribution, rich list shares?


I am afraid not, as I mentioned before I start to work on it. Insight API explorer solves the problem of searching compared to old explorer. It does not solve the rich list. If we want Rich List, we should still go and pay those 0,25 BTC / year(It is way cheaper than to develop it by us).

Insight API is backbone for easy payment system implementation, Insight explorer is just cool explorer.   Anyway, my opinion is there are so many new web pages about alt coins created daily, sooner or later someone will take care about rich list feature and other stats.  Karma should work on increasing value than someone will come and create as many stats as you can imagine. If we give people easy tools how to play with KARM, they will create games, services anything they can imagine. Every non crypto service can be ported into crypto service. Lets make tools well documented, so even noob devs can use it. If people can embed KARM into web just by few rows of JS, lets work on it. Do not focus on creating all the services yourself, let common people to start their own KARMA business easily. Lets create plugins for wordpress and other CMS frameworks, so they can implement KARM by few clicks. The easier this process is, the more web devs you get. Every Web has visitors/customers. KARM can increase 100x value just by creating such easy to use web services.
hero member
Activity: 1022
Merit: 501
Creator of the ICO
August 06, 2014, 07:29:12 AM
Digital Ocean have only snapshots. I can create snapshot and transfer it to another Digital ocean user. I don't know how to transfer it to linode.  Server has to run on SSD drive, it will be very slow on classic HDD. I checked linode SSD servers, the cheapest is , (Linode 2G   48 GB   2 cores   3 TB   250 Mbps   $0.03/hr | $20/mo), so it is $20/month. Digital ocean has $10/month for 1 GB ram server. $20 for 2 GB ram. So 2 GB server has same price. Since it would be great to run there Coinpunk wallet and if it is possible to port Copay (https://copay.io/) than Copay too, 2 GB ram server will be better.

The problem is, I am running it on server, where I am hosting some other web pages, so I can't create and transfer you snapshot anyway. So the options are I will run new image, install everything on clean server and than transfer droplet to your digital ocean account. Than you can think about how to move it to linode, if you really need that.

Or you give me access to some ubuntu clean server and I will install it there.

But first, I will finish GUI conversion (BTC-> KARM), test API , and install Coinpunk web wallet. It will take me few days, I do not have much spare time right now.



Digital Ocean is fine. I will wait for you to finish and then provide you with the  information so you can transfer the droplet.

Thanks for your work on this. I'm sure lots of users will appreciate it!
sr. member
Activity: 532
Merit: 250
August 06, 2014, 06:50:40 AM
Exciting stuff, thanks for the good work socoban! Karma could benefit greatly from an easy to use API service for websites and apps. Maybe that's even something ptman and I could use for the Karma game, we're kinda stuck implementing the backend/payout system. Will need to read up on this API, thanks for the links and info.

I was thinking about exactly the same stuff during a bus trip after reading socoban's post about the API.

After we make some small adjustments to the game mechanics and we sort out a (secure) way to pay the game player based on his/her performance playing the game we can launch a first version of the game in the Android Play Store.
sr. member
Activity: 425
Merit: 250
August 06, 2014, 06:11:59 AM
@ptman, how's the development of the game elephant? Your game has become a favorite game of my son who is 4 and he only now to be several million miles he!  Grin Grin It's good money to be transferred directly to the donation and development of KARMA!
On a good way to attract more miners to create some small quests to solve and true original decision to donate KARMA's. Also from time to time to give away as a bonus KARMA's for something! The truth is that everyone wants to get as much as possible without giving something of themselves .... the idea is simple quests and a little KARMA for everyone! It will not be a big expense, but the idea going to come out and lead many investors. This is the psychology of many banks ... give you vouchers worth € 100 in your hands and not like them, have them spend it without thinking how it will come back. But this creates clients and work.
Excuse my bad English and I hope I understood!
hero member
Activity: 559
Merit: 500
August 06, 2014, 05:42:40 AM
Exciting stuff, thanks for the good work socoban! Karma could benefit greatly from an easy to use API service for websites and apps. Maybe that's even something ptman and I could use for the Karma game, we're kinda stuck implementing the backend/payout system. Will need to read up on this API, thanks for the links and info.
sr. member
Activity: 314
Merit: 250
August 06, 2014, 05:29:32 AM
Kosmost&CO, I finished the migration of Bitpay Insight API into KARMA coin. The block explorer is fully functional with real-time updates via RPC. You can find it here: http://162.243.209.71:3000/

The next task is to rename BTC into KARM/KARMA in GUI. - should be easy

Most of people do not realize how important is Insight API, it is amazing wrapper on bitcoin wallet. It allows people to easily create web wallets and web services. With this API hosted on trusted server web developers can easily implement KARMA into their web pages without need to run own KARMA wallet. When I was searching how to port it, I realized there were many other alt coins trying to port it which failed. Insight API does not work for POW/POS or POS coins. Many POW coins tried and failed to implement it. Very few were successful.

Check https://github.com/bitpay/insight-api for more info.

I will write some JS code to test the API if it work with KARM well.

The next task is to run CoinPunk wallet: https://coinpunk.com/, it is awesome web wallet written in JavaScript, browser based. So anyone lazy to download and sync KARMA wallet can go to coinpunk server, create his JS wallet in seconds and use it thanks to Insight API.

I will take care of it later, when I do the tests with JavaScript transactions if they work correctly.



Wonderful. This is very good stuff!

Please let us know when it is fully functional. I suppose you can use Digital Ocean (as you suggested) and copy the image over or perhaps Linode (what I am using now). I will then order it and change the DNS record for explorer.karmacoin.me to the appropriate (new) location.

Once it is fully-functional I will encourage our community to donate some Karma or BTC your way for your efforts. It's good to see people step up to the plate.

Thanks again!

Digital Ocean have only snapshots. I can create snapshot and transfer it to another Digital ocean user. I don't know how to transfer it to linode.  Server has to run on SSD drive, it will be very slow on classic HDD. I checked linode SSD servers, the cheapest is , (Linode 2G   48 GB   2 cores   3 TB   250 Mbps   $0.03/hr | $20/mo), so it is $20/month. Digital ocean has $10/month for 1 GB ram server. $20 for 2 GB ram. So 2 GB server has same price. Since it would be great to run there Coinpunk wallet and if it is possible to port Copay (https://copay.io/) than Copay too, 2 GB ram server will be better.

The problem is, I am running it on server, where I am hosting some other web pages, so I can't create and transfer you snapshot anyway. So the options are I will run new image, install everything on clean server and than transfer droplet to your digital ocean account. Than you can think about how to move it to linode, if you really need that.

Or you give me access to some ubuntu clean server and I will install it there.

But first, I will finish GUI conversion (BTC-> KARM), test API , and install Coinpunk web wallet. It will take me few days, I do not have much spare time right now.

hero member
Activity: 1022
Merit: 501
Creator of the ICO
August 06, 2014, 05:08:35 AM

I am afraid not, as I mentioned before I start to work on it. Insight API explorer solves the problem of searching compared to old explorer. It does not solve the rich list. If we want Rich List, we should still go and pay those 0,25 BTC / year(It is way cheaper than to develop it by us).

Insight API is backbone for easy payment system implementation, Insight explorer is just cool explorer.   Anyway, my opinion is there are so many new web pages about alt coins created daily, sooner or later someone will take care about rich list feature and other stats.  Karma should work on increasing value than someone will come and create as many stats as you can imagine. If we give people easy tools how to play with KARM, they will create games, services anything they can imagine. Every non crypto service can be ported into crypto service. Lets make tools well documented, so even noob devs can use it. If people can embed KARM into web just by few rows of JS, lets work on it. Do not focus on creating all the services yourself, let common people to start their own KARMA business easily. Lets create plugins for wordpress and other CMS frameworks, so they can implement KARM by few clicks. The easier this process is, the more web devs you get. Every Web has visitors/customers. KARM can increase 100x value just by creating such easy to use web services.

I love the way you think. This is so true. Once we add more value a lot of these other things will take care of themselves.
hero member
Activity: 1022
Merit: 501
Creator of the ICO
August 06, 2014, 05:04:39 AM
Kosmost&CO, I finished the migration of Bitpay Insight API into KARMA coin. The block explorer is fully functional with real-time updates via RPC. You can find it here: http://162.243.209.71:3000/

The next task is to rename BTC into KARM/KARMA in GUI. - should be easy

Most of people do not realize how important is Insight API, it is amazing wrapper on bitcoin wallet. It allows people to easily create web wallets and web services. With this API hosted on trusted server web developers can easily implement KARMA into their web pages without need to run own KARMA wallet. When I was searching how to port it, I realized there were many other alt coins trying to port it which failed. Insight API does not work for POW/POS or POS coins. Many POW coins tried and failed to implement it. Very few were successful.

Check https://github.com/bitpay/insight-api for more info.

I will write some JS code to test the API if it work with KARM well.

The next task is to run CoinPunk wallet: https://coinpunk.com/, it is awesome web wallet written in JavaScript, browser based. So anyone lazy to download and sync KARMA wallet can go to coinpunk server, create his JS wallet in seconds and use it thanks to Insight API.

I will take care of it later, when I do the tests with JavaScript transactions if they work correctly.



Wonderful. This is very good stuff!

Please let us know when it is fully functional. I suppose you can use Digital Ocean (as you suggested) and copy the image over or perhaps Linode (what I am using now). I will then order it and change the DNS record for explorer.karmacoin.me to the appropriate (new) location.

Once it is fully-functional I will encourage our community to donate some Karma or BTC your way for your efforts. It's good to see people step up to the plate.

Thanks again!
sr. member
Activity: 314
Merit: 250
August 06, 2014, 04:28:17 AM
Kosmos&CO, I finished the migration of Bitpay Insight API into KARMA coin. The block explorer is fully functional with real-time updates via RPC. You can find it here: http://162.243.209.71:3000/

The next task is to rename BTC into KARM/KARMA in GUI. - should be easy

Most of people do not realize how important is Insight API, it is amazing wrapper on bitcoin wallet. It allows people to easily create web wallets and web services. With this API hosted on trusted server web developers can easily implement KARMA into their web pages without need to run own KARMA wallet. When I was searching how to port it, I realized there were many other alt coins trying to port it which failed. Insight API does not work for POW/POS or POS coins. Many POW coins tried and failed to implement it. Very few were successful.

Check https://github.com/bitpay/insight-api for more info.

I will write some JS code to test the API if it work with KARM well.

The next task is to run CoinPunk wallet: https://coinpunk.com/, it is awesome web wallet written in JavaScript, browser based. So anyone lazy to download and sync KARMA wallet can go to coinpunk server, create his JS wallet in seconds and use it thanks to Insight API.

I will take care of it later, when I do the tests with JavaScript transactions if they work correctly.



Great!
Can this be used to get distribution, rich list shares?


I am afraid not, as I mentioned before I start to work on it. Insight API explorer solves the problem of searching compared to old explorer. It does not solve the rich list. If we want Rich List, we should still go and pay those 0,25 BTC / year(It is way cheaper than to develop it by us).

Insight API is backbone for easy payment system implementation, Insight explorer is just cool explorer.   Anyway, my opinion is there are so many new web pages about alt coins created daily, sooner or later someone will take care about rich list feature and other stats.  Karma should work on increasing value than someone will come and create as many stats as you can imagine. If we give people easy tools how to play with KARM, they will create games, services anything they can imagine. Every non crypto service can be ported into crypto service. Lets make tools well documented, so even noob devs can use it. If people can embed KARM into web just by few rows of JS, lets work on it. Do not focus on creating all the services yourself, let common people to start their own KARMA business easily. Lets create plugins for wordpress and other CMS frameworks, so they can implement KARM by few clicks. The easier this process is, the more web devs you get. Every Web has visitors/customers. KARM can increase 100x value just by creating such easy to use web services.
sr. member
Activity: 348
Merit: 250
August 06, 2014, 04:08:49 AM
Kosmos&CO, I finished the migration of Bitpay Insight API into KARMA coin. The block explorer is fully functional with real-time updates via RPC. You can find it here: http://162.243.209.71:3000/

The next task is to rename BTC into KARM/KARMA in GUI. - should be easy

Most of people do not realize how important is Insight API, it is amazing wrapper on bitcoin wallet. It allows people to easily create web wallets and web services. With this API hosted on trusted server web developers can easily implement KARMA into their web pages without need to run own KARMA wallet. When I was searching how to port it, I realized there were many other alt coins trying to port it which failed. Insight API does not work for POW/POS or POS coins. Many POW coins tried and failed to implement it. Very few were successful.

Check https://github.com/bitpay/insight-api for more info.

I will write some JS code to test the API if it work with KARM well.

The next task is to run CoinPunk wallet: https://coinpunk.com/, it is awesome web wallet written in JavaScript, browser based. So anyone lazy to download and sync KARMA wallet can go to coinpunk server, create his JS wallet in seconds and use it thanks to Insight API.

I will take care of it later, when I do the tests with JavaScript transactions if they work correctly.



Great!
Can this be used to get distribution, rich list shares?

PS: Need to change units from BTC to KARMA
sr. member
Activity: 314
Merit: 250
August 06, 2014, 03:48:56 AM
Kosmost&CO, I finished the migration of Bitpay Insight API into KARMA coin. The block explorer is fully functional with real-time updates via RPC. You can find it here: http://162.243.209.71:3000/

The next task is to rename BTC into KARM/KARMA in GUI. - should be easy

Most of people do not realize how important is Insight API, it is amazing wrapper on bitcoin wallet. It allows people to easily create web wallets and web services. With this API hosted on trusted server web developers can easily implement KARMA into their web pages without need to run own KARMA wallet. When I was searching how to port it, I realized there were many other alt coins trying to port it which failed. Insight API does not work for POW/POS or POS coins. Many POW coins tried and failed to implement it. Very few were successful.

Check https://github.com/bitpay/insight-api for more info.

I will write some JS code to test the API if it work with KARM well.

The next task is to run CoinPunk wallet: https://coinpunk.com/, it is awesome web wallet written in JavaScript, browser based. So anyone lazy to download and sync KARMA wallet can go to coinpunk server, create his JS wallet in seconds and use it thanks to Insight API.

I will take care of it later, when I do the tests with JavaScript transactions if they work correctly.

hero member
Activity: 1022
Merit: 501
Creator of the ICO
August 06, 2014, 03:08:37 AM
You are right about users being the most important variable of the equation.

But right now we have a problem.

Around 70% of our hash rate comes from a multipool, that is driving the price down by auto selling for BTC.

Even if we do not care about the price, it makes the network insecure to an attack.

While I agree in principle I think we can only attract significantly more miners if we focus more on the user value proposition. This will create value and drive the price up, increasing exposure (which attracts a greater variety of miners).

Right now we have about all the miners that we "deserve" , per market forces. We simply introduce new value-adds to those market forces to attract new miners.

When we were hovering under 100 MH/s a few months ago we had a similar problem. So, in order to help solve this problem we created Karmashares. This was a long-term value-add, and within a month or so our hashrate had increased 3,000%

Add value ----> attract more miners -----> problem solved (until new ones arise)

Putting out a call for more miners may help, but if 70% of hashing power comes from multipool-A then we would need to increase the non-multipool-A participants by about 300% in order for multipool-A's hash to comprise 30% of the network. (not considering all the miners who sell Karma for BTC or LTC on the same day, which judging by the posts on this forum seems to be about the same size problem before and after the multipool-A problem. So if we solve this problem and 70% of our usual miners sell Karma for BTC the next day, then it's kind of the same thing though it's not automated)

Without our working towards a functioning economy we are just going round in circles. Unknowingly, we are creating a ditch that drives us further and further under.

There will always be mining challenges (big and small) and we've seen them before. But as we lose focus on the more valuable part of the equation we become just like 99% of altcoins.
legendary
Activity: 1274
Merit: 1000
August 06, 2014, 02:58:49 AM
We need to attract more miners.

Any idea on how to do it?

We need 50+ GH/s net hash rate to be taken seriously.
At least 5 times more in relation to what we have now.

I would humbly disagree on that. While miners are important our focus should definitely be users.

Our #1 need right now is to attract more users.

Without actual users, Karma is nothing and will be nothing but a novelty token like 99% of altcoins.

That begs the question, "Why would someone use Karma for?"

Before we figure it out, we need to find out who our biggest market will be in 5 years (or can be) and test our assumptions. Help us here: http://redd.it/2cg8kg

It is our most important question and something that we all need to be helping out on.


You are right about users being the most important variable of the equation.

But right now we have a problem.

Around 70% of our hash rate comes from a multipool, that is driving the price down by auto selling for BTC.

Even if we do not care about the price, it makes the network insecure to an attack.





what are our options ?

Will these option we come up to improve the situation temporarily ?

Doesn't price increases demand? 

Kos is right. Increasing user base will help more then worrying about abusive sell orders from miners.

Would cutting down the mining rewards by half stop multipools from abusing us?

hero member
Activity: 1022
Merit: 501
Creator of the ICO
August 06, 2014, 02:41:20 AM
To elaborate on the above re exchanges trading Karma against BTC in sets of 1000.

Exchanges: Price Karma in lots of 1,000 in Bitcoin


What does this mean?

Instead of Karma being put on the market as a single Karma it could be sold in sets of 1,000. This still means you can sell units of 0.00001 Karma, just not 0.00000001 Karma.

This is very distinct from decreasing the number of Karma via a hard fork although it has the same advantages and could be done around the same time without actually having to change the amount of Karma in existence.

The 0.00001 Karma (being the minimum tradable fraction) of Karma under the proposed change is worth approximately $0.0000000015USD at today’s market rates.

When I last checked there was an actual minimum limit on Mintpal for Karma sales of around 10,000 Karma however this may be based on price and could be there as a transaction spam / exchange fee avoidance countermeasure.

Basically instead of exchanges listing Karma for sale as follows:
Amount: 0.00000000 (limit 8 decimal places)
Price per Karm: 0.00000000 (limit 8 decimal places)
Total: 0.00000000 (limit 8 decimal places)

It would be:
Amount: 0.00000 (limit 5 decimal places)
Price per 1,000 Karma: 0.00000000 (limit 8 decimal places)
Total: 0.00000000 (limit 8 decimal places)

Under sell orders/buy orders this would change from:
Price (BTC) / Karm / BTC
To:
Price per 1,000 Karma (BTC) / Karma / BTC

The amount of Karma displayed in accounts should be kept the same.

Why the change?

As at the time of writing this 1 Karma is selling for 0.00000002 to 0.00000003 Bitcoins. The smallest fraction of a Bitcoin is called a Satoshi. Karma is trading at 2 to 3 Satoshi. This means theoretically, on the spread, you can either sell your Karma then rebuy 50% more or you can buy Karma and then sell it for 50% more or similar. This will occur no matter the price of Karma, just as the price goes up the margins will get slimmer as the market becomes more granular, ie the difference between prices is less. Even at 40 to 41 Satoshi there is a margin of 2.5%, roughly 10 times more than the exchanges themselves take.

This isn’t healthy for the market. The only way these orders can work is if the price is stable enough for you to both complete your sell order and your rebuy order.

This encourages people to attempt to lock in Karma between a certain price range and also encourages the creation of wall. This is because some people may be putting up a sale expecting that they can then rebuy at a fraction of the price, which may even be on alternate market, for example a Litecoin market.

When price movement is hampered there is less volume in the markets and less interest in Karma.

Benefits of change, buyers/sellers:
Can buy or sell higher at market rates without having to either “wait in line” or sell at far less than it would cost to buy or vice versa.

Benefits of change for exchanges:
More market activity caused by the change means more turn over and more exchange fees.

As one of the first adopters, your exchange will both have Karma for sale at cheaper rates and people will be able to sell Karma for more. This will increase volume on your market for people that want to trade at market rates and not have to wait “in line” for their trade to be executed a decent price.

Implementing the change may be subsidised by the Karma community.

Limitations to current countermeasures to the problem:
Under the current system alternate markets (primarily Litecoin) are being used to trade Karma at a more granular rate while the price is being locked in on the Bitcoin market.

However, this is considered by many to be an inconvenience and still only offers limited protection against sell and buy walls that form on the Bitcoin market.

Suggested implementation for exchanges:
1. Make the relevant notices to customers;
2. Suspend trading on the Karma/BTC market;
3. Back up data;
4. Make the relevant changes to the displays on the market order page;
5. Cancel all orders on the market;
6. Make changes to the order database if required; and
7. Put the buy/sell orders back onto the market to 5 decimal places instead of 8. This should result in a very small decrease to buy/sell orders on the market.

Other solutions:
Mintpal is the only major exchange for Karma that would have trouble implementing this because they have already opened the Bitcoin/Karma market. New exchanges (or exchanges without Karma markets) could implement this system without having to worry about current orders.


What are your thoughts on exchange pricing per 100 Karma?

I believe this would make each block currently worth about USD 0.001, which would give us some room for growth in price (with a price target of anywhere between 1 cent to 10 cents per Karma block in the next year or so).

This would, of course, in no way impact users wallets but may make it easier for users to purchase (from a psychological perspective) similar to how pre-paid phone cards or debit cards are re-charged in blocks of units (instead of individual units), You can't re-charge your phone with 1 minute worth of time but perhaps you could with 100 minutes' worth.

When you go to the grocery store to buy meat or fish, pricing may be per 100 grams. The grocery store owner knows that people will buy more when they think of buying multiples or fractions of 100 grams instead of multiples of 1 gram.

I think right now we are just doing what every other coin is doing and not really thinking of how we can be pioneers. Anything different is seen as a "trick". But how about the first grocery store that thought to price their perishables differently?

If change makes sense and has more upside than downside, then I say let's go for it. There will always be people who want to use their horses in an age of the "horseless carriage". But we are leaders, not followers.
sr. member
Activity: 532
Merit: 250
August 06, 2014, 02:31:26 AM
We need to attract more miners.

Any idea on how to do it?

We need 50+ GH/s net hash rate to be taken seriously.
At least 5 times more in relation to what we have now.

I would humbly disagree on that. While miners are important our focus should definitely be users.

Our #1 need right now is to attract more users.

Without actual users, Karma is nothing and will be nothing but a novelty token like 99% of altcoins.

That begs the question, "Why would someone use Karma for?"

Before we figure it out, we need to find out who our biggest market will be in 5 years (or can be) and test our assumptions. Help us here: http://redd.it/2cg8kg

It is our most important question and something that we all need to be helping out on.


You are right about users being the most important variable of the equation.

But right now we have a problem.

Around 70% of our hash rate comes from a multipool, that is driving the price down by auto selling for BTC.

Even if we do not care about the price, it makes the network insecure to an attack.



hero member
Activity: 1022
Merit: 501
Creator of the ICO
August 06, 2014, 01:59:59 AM
now just to change the topic slightly.. has anyone seen airtasker?

I just saw this on tv and checked out the site.

https://www.airtasker.com

a site like this for Karma (or any other crypto) where you can task people to do small jobs and good things.. that would be awesome.

consider this for a concept.

just say there is a granny living alone and she needs her garden cleaned.
just say nobody in the Karma community lives near her.
just say there was a website where she could post an advert that she needs help.
just say some generous Karma people offer to support her Task and donate some karma to the cause.
just say some local kids from the neighborhood see the job posted online and need some pocket money.

the kids sign up accept the job.. they clean the grannies garden. Once the job is complete the Granny marks the job well done online and the kids get paid.
now the kids can do whatever they want with their karma. they could swap it for BTC on an exchange, they could buy online goods like Games, or they could use to pay someone else to do a job for them.

everyone is happy and good Karma is bestowed upon all.


well you might say.. what is to stop the kids from doing a crappy job and ripping off the granny...

well just say you had a 5 star system ... if the kids do a good job (5 stars) they get all the money.. 4 stars and they only get 80% of the money etc etc.
and whatever Karma is left over goes back to the donors.

whats to stop the granny from taking advantage of the kids and giving them only 1 star (ie only 20% if the pay) even if they do an awesome job...
well the money left over doesn't go back to the granny and she has a star rating too.

It's a good idea and goes in line with our needs to create a small economy to get the economy part of Karma started. I have been working on a similar idea but our first need is discovering who our biggest market will be.

(Donating the first few hundred million Karma to the users and setting a minimum may also help to kickstart it)

Though the last part (not being refunded for a job not well done) may not sit well with users.
hero member
Activity: 1022
Merit: 501
Creator of the ICO
August 06, 2014, 01:50:50 AM
We need to attract more miners.

Any idea on how to do it?

We need 50+ GH/s net hash rate to be taken seriously.
At least 5 times more in relation to what we have now.

I would humbly disagree on that. While miners are important our focus should definitely be users.

Our #1 need right now is to attract more users.

Without actual users, Karma is nothing and will be nothing but a novelty token like 99% of altcoins.

That begs the question, "Why would someone use Karma for?"

Before we figure it out, we need to find out who our biggest market will be in 5 years (or can be) and test our assumptions. Help us here: http://redd.it/2cg8kg

It is our most important question and something that we all need to be helping out on.
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