[ANN][KMD][dPoW] Komodo - An Open, Composable Smart Chain Platform, Secured by B - page 785.

KomodoPlatform

sr. member

Activity: 784

Merit: 253

Set Your Ideas Free

Quote from: Thenoticer on October 21, 2016, 03:13:00 PM

Quote from: KomodoPlatform on October 21, 2016, 02:38:18 PM

More info about the trusted setup / parameters

https://z.cash/blog/generating-zcash-parameters.html

Quote

To reduce risk, Zcash has designed a multi-player protocol where pubkey will be generated. The protocol has the property that privkey now corresponds to the concatenation of all participants' secret randomness. Thus, privkey will be destroyed unless all of the participants are dishonest or compromised.

Might I enquirer as to who the participants will be? Will it be the three ICO fund holders or others? Also how do you (will you) prove that the priv key is destroyed, or rather even easier just one piece of it? Is this done on camera? or will witnesses be present?

[Not trolling, just really interested]

Hello!

Like previously stated, we won't create those parameters ourselves, but rather use the parameters created by Zcash. We could never do the process as securely as they do.

Thenoticer

sr. member

Activity: 332

Merit: 250

Quote from: KomodoPlatform on October 21, 2016, 02:38:18 PM

More info about the trusted setup / parameters

https://z.cash/blog/generating-zcash-parameters.html

Quote

To reduce risk, Zcash has designed a multi-player protocol where pubkey will be generated. The protocol has the property that privkey now corresponds to the concatenation of all participants' secret randomness. Thus, privkey will be destroyed unless all of the participants are dishonest or compromised.

Might I enquirer as to who the participants will be? Will it be the three ICO fund holders or others? Also how do you (will you) prove that the priv key is destroyed, or rather even easier just one piece of it? Is this done on camera? or will witnesses be present?

[Not trolling, just really interested]

KomodoPlatform

sr. member

Activity: 784

Merit: 253

Set Your Ideas Free

More info about the trusted setup / parameters

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16257692
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16352842
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16636554

https://z.cash/blog/generating-zcash-parameters.html

jl777

legendary

Activity: 1176

Merit: 1134

Quote from: Thenoticer on October 21, 2016, 01:14:49 PM

Quote from: jl777 on October 21, 2016, 11:18:37 AM

Quote from: Thenoticer on October 21, 2016, 11:10:25 AM

Quote from: jl777 on October 21, 2016, 07:45:04 AM

Quote from: Thenoticer on October 21, 2016, 07:37:10 AM

Quote from: jl777 on October 21, 2016, 05:56:04 AM

there is a small chance that this testnet can become the actual mainnet

it was a very remote chance before, but now there are just the bugfixes and the 5% APR left to add

if we can get that and also verify that election ratification works, then there is no need to reset the chain

still a lot of if's, just wanted to post about the increasing chances. what I like about it is that it rewards the people who have been helping the test process. it also makes the mainnet a bit more secure as it starts with an established history.

It would also make KMD the longest running zero knowledge blockchain

Would this mean that a genesis block has already been created? And how does this effect the trusted setup argument?

Thanks.

The genesis block is unrelated to the zcash parameters. the trusted setup argument requires assuming that ALL participants in creating the zcash parameters are colluding.

And if there is such a collusion and it is used to inflate the currency supply, it will be discovered and ALL the participants would be found out that they colluded. Also, market value of zcash will plummet, so it seems that smart people wouldnt collude together to be exposed as a colluding group, even if they were unethical and open to stealing.

Does anybody really believe that Matt Green, et. all will all be colluding to steal zcash? ALL of them? knowing that if they utilize the ability to steal the coins that they will be caught and that there is no doubt as to who did the stealing?

Because of this I do not worry about the trusted setup argument

I guess I just don't quite understand. " The genesis block is unrelated to zcash parameters"

My thinking is getting hung up on this statement.

Quote

if we can get that and also verify that election ratification works, then there is no need to reset the chain

I assumed reset the chain meant create a new genesis block, as wouldn't a "chain" imply it is using a genesis block. Is the testnet chain using a genesis block?

Thanks for the clarity.

All blockchains have a genesis block, it is just the first block that all nodes start from.
If we reset the chain, we will likely change the genesis block, but that is independent as you can reset the chain (start over from genesis) without changing the genesis.

My last comment.

Is the komodo genesis block bullet proof? Ie: are there future arguments that someone could make that it wasn't done in a fair or transparent manner? I've read somewhere that setting up the genesis block for zcash style system would need assurances that the (master key?) be properly destroyed. What assurances does komodo community have that the genesis block + master key was and or will be setup correctly? I believe that I understand the colluding arg, (all participants would have to be corrupt) is that the assurance? Can you elaborate on the process used to create the genesis block and the handling of the master key. (Who are the people with the M K, the notaries?)

Thanks

Edit. Heres where my info came from
https://forum.z.cash/t/trusted-setup-phase/68/4

https://m.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/3p31lj/wait_so_with_zerocash_you_have_to_trust_a_third/

the parameters have nothing to do with the genesis block.
there is no "master key", it only exists if all the parameter creators collude.
to avoid any such issues, we will just use the same parameters as zcash
the notaries have nothing to do with the zcash parameters

Thenoticer

sr. member

Activity: 332

Merit: 250

Quote from: jl777 on October 21, 2016, 11:18:37 AM

Quote from: Thenoticer on October 21, 2016, 11:10:25 AM

Quote from: jl777 on October 21, 2016, 07:45:04 AM

Quote from: Thenoticer on October 21, 2016, 07:37:10 AM

Quote from: jl777 on October 21, 2016, 05:56:04 AM

there is a small chance that this testnet can become the actual mainnet

it was a very remote chance before, but now there are just the bugfixes and the 5% APR left to add

if we can get that and also verify that election ratification works, then there is no need to reset the chain

still a lot of if's, just wanted to post about the increasing chances. what I like about it is that it rewards the people who have been helping the test process. it also makes the mainnet a bit more secure as it starts with an established history.

It would also make KMD the longest running zero knowledge blockchain

Would this mean that a genesis block has already been created? And how does this effect the trusted setup argument?

Thanks.

The genesis block is unrelated to the zcash parameters. the trusted setup argument requires assuming that ALL participants in creating the zcash parameters are colluding.

And if there is such a collusion and it is used to inflate the currency supply, it will be discovered and ALL the participants would be found out that they colluded. Also, market value of zcash will plummet, so it seems that smart people wouldnt collude together to be exposed as a colluding group, even if they were unethical and open to stealing.

Does anybody really believe that Matt Green, et. all will all be colluding to steal zcash? ALL of them? knowing that if they utilize the ability to steal the coins that they will be caught and that there is no doubt as to who did the stealing?

Because of this I do not worry about the trusted setup argument

I guess I just don't quite understand. " The genesis block is unrelated to zcash parameters"

My thinking is getting hung up on this statement.

Quote

if we can get that and also verify that election ratification works, then there is no need to reset the chain

I assumed reset the chain meant create a new genesis block, as wouldn't a "chain" imply it is using a genesis block. Is the testnet chain using a genesis block?

Thanks for the clarity.

All blockchains have a genesis block, it is just the first block that all nodes start from.
If we reset the chain, we will likely change the genesis block, but that is independent as you can reset the chain (start over from genesis) without changing the genesis.

My last comment.

Is the komodo genesis block bullet proof? Ie: are there future arguments that someone could make that it wasn't done in a fair or transparent manner? I've read somewhere that setting up the genesis block for zcash style system would need assurances that the (master key?) be properly destroyed. What assurances does komodo community have that the genesis block + master key was and or will be setup correctly? I believe that I understand the colluding arg, (all participants would have to be corrupt) is that the assurance? Can you elaborate on the process used to create the genesis block and the handling of the master key. (Who are the people with the M K, the notaries?)

Thanks

Edit. Heres where my info came from
https://forum.z.cash/t/trusted-setup-phase/68/4

https://m.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/3p31lj/wait_so_with_zerocash_you_have_to_trust_a_third/

Scott J

legendary

Activity: 1792

Merit: 1000

What calculation is made for the predicted balance?

KomodoPlatform

sr. member

Activity: 784

Merit: 253

Set Your Ideas Free

Quote from: someone111 on October 21, 2016, 12:00:02 PM

How many more notaries you need?

How many can be hosted by the same person?

I am thinking back and forth about helping out, but I don't like the idea that I might be investing money and time to set up one or multiple notaries and then be voted out by dolphins and whales for no other reason then they wanting to host the notary themselves. Any assurance?

There will be total of 64 notary nodes. It looks like there are currently 18 persons running in the election. It is crowded in EU, but I think there's still free space in the other regions.

You can run 4 notary nodes max, one in each region.

The investors want to elect those who they know to be capable of running a node. For that we encourage everyone to run a test notery node, join #notarynode channel for more info

Also here are some useful links:
Setup Komodo Notary Node https://github.com/SuperNETorg/komodo/wiki/Setup-Komodo-Notary-Node
https://www.komodoelection.com/
https://steemit.com/komodo/@komodoplatform/notary-node-elections
https://steemit.com/komodo/@komodoplatform/komodo-zcash-pow-with-dpow-consensus-mechanism
https://komodoplatform.useresponse.com/topic/can-you-give-me-information-about-the-notary-nodes-election-process
https://komodoplatform.useresponse.com/knowledge-base/article/do-we-need-to-have-the-dedicated-server-already-in-place-for-the-vote-or-is-it-enough-to-describe-the-server-which-will-be-ordered-after-a-successful-candidacy

jl777

legendary

Activity: 1176

Merit: 1134

Quote from: someone111 on October 21, 2016, 12:00:02 PM

How many more notaries you need?

How many can be hosted by the same person?

I am thinking back and forth about helping out, but I don't like the idea that I might be investing money and time to set up one or multiple notaries and then be voted out by dolphins and whales for no other reason then they wanting to host the notary themselves. Any assurance?

max of 4 by same person, one per region

from what I can tell, most whales wont bother with running notary nodes, but rather would just vote for the established testnet notaries who have proven they know what they are doing.

So I cant guarantee that you will be elected, but if you dont run a test node i dont think you would get many votes. What a lot of notaries that want to run multiple notaries is to get one of them working during the testnet and then they can run as candidate for multiple slots

someone111

sr. member

Activity: 453

Merit: 250

How many more notaries you need?

How many can be hosted by the same person?

I am thinking back and forth about helping out, but I don't like the idea that I might be investing money and time to set up one or multiple notaries and then be voted out by dolphins and whales for no other reason then they wanting to host the notary themselves. Any assurance?

jl777

legendary

Activity: 1176

Merit: 1134

Quote from: Thenoticer on October 21, 2016, 11:10:25 AM

Quote from: jl777 on October 21, 2016, 07:45:04 AM

Quote from: Thenoticer on October 21, 2016, 07:37:10 AM

Quote from: jl777 on October 21, 2016, 05:56:04 AM

there is a small chance that this testnet can become the actual mainnet

it was a very remote chance before, but now there are just the bugfixes and the 5% APR left to add

if we can get that and also verify that election ratification works, then there is no need to reset the chain

still a lot of if's, just wanted to post about the increasing chances. what I like about it is that it rewards the people who have been helping the test process. it also makes the mainnet a bit more secure as it starts with an established history.

It would also make KMD the longest running zero knowledge blockchain

Would this mean that a genesis block has already been created? And how does this effect the trusted setup argument?

Thanks.

The genesis block is unrelated to the zcash parameters. the trusted setup argument requires assuming that ALL participants in creating the zcash parameters are colluding.

And if there is such a collusion and it is used to inflate the currency supply, it will be discovered and ALL the participants would be found out that they colluded. Also, market value of zcash will plummet, so it seems that smart people wouldnt collude together to be exposed as a colluding group, even if they were unethical and open to stealing.

Does anybody really believe that Matt Green, et. all will all be colluding to steal zcash? ALL of them? knowing that if they utilize the ability to steal the coins that they will be caught and that there is no doubt as to who did the stealing?

Because of this I do not worry about the trusted setup argument

I guess I just don't quite understand. " The genesis block is unrelated to zcash parameters"

My thinking is getting hung up on this statement.

Quote

if we can get that and also verify that election ratification works, then there is no need to reset the chain

I assumed reset the chain meant create a new genesis block, as wouldn't a "chain" imply it is using a genesis block. Is the testnet chain using a genesis block?

Thanks for the clarity.

All blockchains have a genesis block, it is just the first block that all nodes start from.
If we reset the chain, we will likely change the genesis block, but that is independent as you can reset the chain (start over from genesis) without changing the genesis.

Thenoticer

sr. member

Activity: 332

Merit: 250

Quote from: jl777 on October 21, 2016, 07:45:04 AM

Quote from: Thenoticer on October 21, 2016, 07:37:10 AM

Quote from: jl777 on October 21, 2016, 05:56:04 AM

there is a small chance that this testnet can become the actual mainnet

it was a very remote chance before, but now there are just the bugfixes and the 5% APR left to add

if we can get that and also verify that election ratification works, then there is no need to reset the chain

still a lot of if's, just wanted to post about the increasing chances. what I like about it is that it rewards the people who have been helping the test process. it also makes the mainnet a bit more secure as it starts with an established history.

It would also make KMD the longest running zero knowledge blockchain

Would this mean that a genesis block has already been created? And how does this effect the trusted setup argument?

Thanks.

The genesis block is unrelated to the zcash parameters. the trusted setup argument requires assuming that ALL participants in creating the zcash parameters are colluding.

And if there is such a collusion and it is used to inflate the currency supply, it will be discovered and ALL the participants would be found out that they colluded. Also, market value of zcash will plummet, so it seems that smart people wouldnt collude together to be exposed as a colluding group, even if they were unethical and open to stealing.

Does anybody really believe that Matt Green, et. all will all be colluding to steal zcash? ALL of them? knowing that if they utilize the ability to steal the coins that they will be caught and that there is no doubt as to who did the stealing?

Because of this I do not worry about the trusted setup argument

I guess I just don't quite understand. " The genesis block is unrelated to zcash parameters"

My thinking is getting hung up on this statement.

Quote

if we can get that and also verify that election ratification works, then there is no need to reset the chain

I assumed reset the chain meant create a new genesis block, as wouldn't a "chain" imply it is using a genesis block. Is the testnet chain using a genesis block?

Thanks for the clarity.

jl777

legendary

Activity: 1176

Merit: 1134

We are past the block 34000 hardfork and also it looks like all the crashes and mining issues are solved.

I found a little complication I need to solve in addition to the 5% APR, but since the 5% APR will be another hardfork best to leave that till next week. I think I see how to do it, but prefer to have a more general approach that will apply to PAX.

So, dont worry if there arent many updates over the weekend. We have dPoW aware komodod and iguana notary dapp both running. The 5% APR is totally independent of dPoW, but it is part of the BTCD coin parameters.

jl777

legendary

Activity: 1176

Merit: 1134

Quote from: Thenoticer on October 21, 2016, 07:37:10 AM

Quote from: jl777 on October 21, 2016, 05:56:04 AM

there is a small chance that this testnet can become the actual mainnet

it was a very remote chance before, but now there are just the bugfixes and the 5% APR left to add

if we can get that and also verify that election ratification works, then there is no need to reset the chain

still a lot of if's, just wanted to post about the increasing chances. what I like about it is that it rewards the people who have been helping the test process. it also makes the mainnet a bit more secure as it starts with an established history.

It would also make KMD the longest running zero knowledge blockchain

Would this mean that a genesis block has already been created? And how does this effect the trusted setup argument?

Thanks.

The genesis block is unrelated to the zcash parameters. the trusted setup argument requires assuming that ALL participants in creating the zcash parameters are colluding.

And if there is such a collusion and it is used to inflate the currency supply, it will be discovered and ALL the participants would be found out that they colluded. Also, market value of zcash will plummet, so it seems that smart people wouldnt collude together to be exposed as a colluding group, even if they were unethical and open to stealing.

Does anybody really believe that Matt Green, et. all will all be colluding to steal zcash? ALL of them? knowing that if they utilize the ability to steal the coins that they will be caught and that there is no doubt as to who did the stealing?

Because of this I do not worry about the trusted setup argument

rocketsTmac

member

Activity: 91

Merit: 10

Quote from: jl777 on October 21, 2016, 05:56:04 AM

there is a small chance that this testnet can become the actual mainnet

it was a very remote chance before, but now there are just the bugfixes and the 5% APR left to add

if we can get that and also verify that election ratification works, then there is no need to reset the chain

still a lot of if's, just wanted to post about the increasing chances. what I like about it is that it rewards the people who have been helping the test process. it also makes the mainnet a bit more secure as it starts with an established history.

It would also make KMD the longest running zero knowledge blockchain

It means moon, thanks.

Thenoticer

sr. member

Activity: 332

Merit: 250

Quote from: jl777 on October 21, 2016, 05:56:04 AM

there is a small chance that this testnet can become the actual mainnet

it was a very remote chance before, but now there are just the bugfixes and the 5% APR left to add

if we can get that and also verify that election ratification works, then there is no need to reset the chain

still a lot of if's, just wanted to post about the increasing chances. what I like about it is that it rewards the people who have been helping the test process. it also makes the mainnet a bit more secure as it starts with an established history.

It would also make KMD the longest running zero knowledge blockchain

Would this mean that a genesis block has already been created? And how does this effect the trusted setup argument?

Thanks.

jl777

legendary

Activity: 1176

Merit: 1134

there is a small chance that this testnet can become the actual mainnet

it was a very remote chance before, but now there are just the bugfixes and the 5% APR left to add

if we can get that and also verify that election ratification works, then there is no need to reset the chain

still a lot of if's, just wanted to post about the increasing chances. what I like about it is that it rewards the people who have been helping the test process. it also makes the mainnet a bit more secure as it starts with an established history.

It would also make KMD the longest running zero knowledge blockchain

jl777

legendary

Activity: 1176

Merit: 1134

Quote from: boomboom on October 20, 2016, 10:06:59 PM

On the knomodo election site is says positions for Europe have been filled, but how can they be filled before the election has happened?

there are currently more nodes in europe than everywhere else combined. So that means the election process will be very competitive. You are certainly free to become a candidate in Europe, but better to run unopposed anywhere else.

we get more geodiversity and you would have a much higher chance of being elected

yassin54

legendary

Activity: 1540

Merit: 1000

Komodo Dev Blog: dPoW Progress Report: It Is Working!

https://komodoplatform.com/dpow-progress-report-it-is-working/

Tweet : https://twitter.com/KomodoPlatform/status/789394355588993024

Reddit : https://www.reddit.com/r/komodoplatform/comments/58mbdo/komodo_dev_blog_dpow_progress_report_it_is_working/

Facebook : https://www.facebook.com/KomodoPlatform/posts/350284958651415

News SuperNET : http://news.supernet.org/posts/mH2sWBAoS37onCDYp/komodo-dev-blog-dpow-progress-report-it-is-working

KomodoPlatform

sr. member

Activity: 784

Merit: 253

Set Your Ideas Free

The Current dPoW Status

If you guys have been reading jl777's posts with care you should be aware of the great progress the team is making! We are actually ahead of our schedule.

Quote

I dont think many people reading this thread realize that every day there are a dozen notary node operators updating to the latest build and helping troubleshoot any issues with the latest versions. Without all this effort there is no way that dPoW would have come together so fast as debugging is a time consuming process.

Having so many different servers testing it all at once… well it is hard for bugs to hide for long. They are all so busy with the servers, they hardly ever post here and are the unsung heroes

Cheers to all the notary node operators! Cheesy

Read the good news from jl777:

dPoW Progress Report
dPoW Progress Report: It Is Working!

grewalsatinder

full member

Activity: 186

Merit: 100

Blockchain Technology Enthusiast, IT Pro

Quote from: retardsystem on October 20, 2016, 10:10:26 PM

Quote from: KomodoPlatform on October 20, 2016, 03:13:41 PM

Quote from: coingirl87 on October 20, 2016, 03:02:22 PM

Quote from: KomodoPlatform on October 20, 2016, 02:26:03 PM

Quote from: flowjob on October 20, 2016, 12:58:12 PM

What is the correct data for the ICO calculator so far?

Should be something like this
35% 500
30% 250
25% 1000
but i am unsure about the 250 BTC with 30% bonus.

35% 500
30% 0
25% 980

And Swapped BTCD is fixed? so all BTCD (1,288,862) will swap?

Yes, that is correct.

So after komodo launch, no btcd in the world any more? Btcd is the history, the new btcd is komodo, right?

Not so fast. BTCD is still the currency used as txfee in SuperNET projects like InstantDEX/EasyDEX, and will be used for quite some time. The change will happen gradually as Komodo mainnet goes stable for some time and also EasyDEX platform goes a bit more stable. The process of using Komodo in places where BTCD is implemented is a gradual process, not sudden process.

Topic: [ANN][KMD][dPoW] Komodo - An Open, Composable Smart Chain Platform, Secured by B - page 785. (Read 1192398 times)