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Topic: [ANN][YAC] YACoin ongoing development - page 145. (Read 380091 times)

legendary
Activity: 3108
Merit: 1359
June 19, 2013, 11:51:01 AM
It's not an issue when PoS becomes common as there should be more PoS blocks than PoW blocks, so you wouldn't see long consecutive PoW blocks to be orphaned by a malicious PoS minter.

Checkpoint should be enabled for any ppcoin forks.
Actually, it's an issue, because it takes some time to make PoS common for the chain. This makes network vulnerable until there is not enough stake weight in opposition to attacker. And checkpointing is not more than workaround for this.

Also there is another problem... Unlike PoW hashing rate, stake weight could be used multiple times without any overhead. It allows attacker to repeat his attempts to generate consecutive stakes until he will get lucky enough. And there is high probability to success without holding large stake, 20-25% of total weight (not coins) will be more than enough.

You can retry your attempt to generate consecutive stakes 1000, 50000 or 1 million times without any problem, using the same outputs. You should always hold it in the mind. Smiley

So, with the current weighting scheme you should always have checkpointing enabled, even if there is enough total stake weight. You can't remove checkpointing without altering block weighting implementation, because it's dangerous. And you can't alter it without making system less energy efficient...  Wink

But I think that energy-efficiency could be partially sacrificed in favor of security.

// EDIT
sr. member
Activity: 425
Merit: 262
June 19, 2013, 11:36:36 AM
TBH, I don't like the checkpointing thing, it makes things complex & centralized.
sr. member
Activity: 425
Merit: 262
June 19, 2013, 11:34:40 AM
Mmh, would it be possible to know at any moment how many coins are maturing for PoS and say, if a big wallet is maturing in the next hour, require more confirmations than normal?

Edit: Ok, the wallet could be split. Still, could the possibility of a PoS double spend be anticipated by looking at how many coins are maturing in the network?
There is no way to detect active stake holder before his chain will be published. Besides, confirmations amount doesn't matter, malicious stakeholder could overwrite more than more than billion of pow blocks by publishing one stake.

The only solution is enable broadcasted checkpointing immediately to workaround this problem. It will give some time to think about better solution.

How could he overwrite the blocks already confirmed? This is insane!
How is the PoS block appended into the blockchain? If it's appended to the chain, how could he overwrite?
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1010
June 19, 2013, 11:33:18 AM
It's not an issue when PoS becomes common as there should be more PoS blocks than PoW blocks, so you wouldn't see long consecutive PoW blocks to be orphaned by a malicious PoS minter.

Checkpoint should be enabled for any ppcoin forks.
legendary
Activity: 3108
Merit: 1359
June 19, 2013, 11:22:52 AM
Mmh, would it be possible to know at any moment how many coins are maturing for PoS and say, if a big wallet is maturing in the next hour, require more confirmations than normal?

Edit: Ok, the wallet could be split. Still, could the possibility of a PoS double spend be anticipated by looking at how many coins are maturing in the network?
There is no way to detect active stake holder before his chain will be published. Besides, confirmations amount doesn't matter, malicious stakeholder could overwrite more than more than billion pow blocks by publishing one stake.

The only solution is enable broadcasted checkpointing immediately to workaround this problem. It will give some time to think about better solution.
hero member
Activity: 693
Merit: 500
June 19, 2013, 11:04:06 AM
lol i achieved what i set out to do  Wink

Get a sarcastic comment about your post from WindMaster while probably cheesing him off in the process?  Bravo.
sr. member
Activity: 406
Merit: 250
The cryptocoin watcher
June 19, 2013, 10:37:49 AM
Mmh, would it be possible to know at any moment how many coins are maturing for PoS and say, if a big wallet is maturing in the next hour, require more confirmations than normal?

Edit: Ok, the wallet could be split. Still, could the possibility of a PoS double spend be anticipated by looking at how many coins are maturing in the network?
hero member
Activity: 809
Merit: 501
June 19, 2013, 10:30:59 AM
I think yacoin is in a good spot.  If you looked at the amount of work and intelligent thought invested in the coin and compare it to the market cap, I think it is poised for growth.  Imagine if it became more mainstream off the bat... I think you would have seen a lot of people buy-in for a little bit and then drop it for a similar alternative.  Right now, I'm pretty sure OneCoin is the only alt trying to copycat yacoin.  I imagine one might be developed with a higher N value starting off.  I think it is important that yacoin lies relatively low for a few more N-value increases.
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
June 19, 2013, 09:42:51 AM
lol i achieved what i set out to do  Wink
hero member
Activity: 693
Merit: 500
June 19, 2013, 09:20:34 AM
firstly i will apologize for my frustration and im not really pointing my finger at any one person but im about to lose my shit with this coin and its devs or lack of rather.

i really think this is a piss poor effort from alot of you and i think it really, like always boils down to leadership and people trying to keep it quiet so they can mine more
but thats just backwars you make mining proifitable and eco freindly by increasing its value and accesability! (im not attacking anyone in pert so please dont focus on the wrong part of my point here)

Possibly I missed your git pull request with all the contributions and patches you've made to help give back to the community by helping to improve the YACoin client code.  Can you send them again?


 Grin +1

...speaking of.... gotta go remind ali1234 about the pull request on cpuminer...
sr. member
Activity: 347
Merit: 250
June 19, 2013, 09:09:08 AM
firstly i will apologize for my frustration and im not really pointing my finger at any one person but im about to lose my shit with this coin and its devs or lack of rather.

i really think this is a piss poor effort from alot of you and i think it really, like always boils down to leadership and people trying to keep it quiet so they can mine more
but thats just backwars you make mining proifitable and eco freindly by increasing its value and accesability! (im not attacking anyone in pert so please dont focus on the wrong part of my point here)

Possibly I missed your git pull request with all the contributions and patches you've made to help give back to the community by helping to improve the YACoin client code.  Can you send them again?
sr. member
Activity: 425
Merit: 262
June 19, 2013, 07:54:02 AM
There's actually a basic facelift for yacoin.org sent to the admin days ago, but it hasn't gone up yet. So a couple of us are talking of setting up an alternative homepage.

I am the owner of yaco.in and i can host the website on my server. I can also make the web site, but i need help for the content, because i'am not english spoken...
let me know if i can do something to help..

You can host the web and the client as long as the client won't make a fork of the block-chain. Wink
If you need the built of the client, just let us know, we can aid for that.
sr. member
Activity: 335
Merit: 255
Counterparty Developer
June 19, 2013, 05:47:03 AM
There's actually a basic facelift for yacoin.org sent to the admin days ago, but it hasn't gone up yet. So a couple of us are talking of setting up an alternative homepage.

I am the owner of yaco.in and i can host the website on my server. I can also make the web site, but i need help for the content, because i'am not english spoken...
let me know if i can do something to help..
legendary
Activity: 3108
Merit: 1359
June 19, 2013, 04:50:03 AM
Unfortunately, current block weighting implementation has the fundamental flaws. As the result, YaC is vulnerable to Stake-based double-spend. YAC developers must to do something with this as soon as possible. Centralized checkpointing, for example, will workaround this and provide some time to implement the new block weighting algorithm.

P.S. NovaCoin is not affected, it has checkpoints and introduces balanced weighting in 0.4.3. This prevents accidental chain forks and pure PoS double-spend/DoS attacks possibility.
sr. member
Activity: 322
Merit: 250
June 19, 2013, 03:28:52 AM
can't submit work when encrypt wallet.

"proof of stake" always destroy some "proof of work".

Use separate wallet for mining. PoS is more valuable than PoW, check PPC explorer > http://ppc.cryptocoinexplorer.com/chain/PPCoin

Yes, proof of stake is good, but i don't hope it will destroy "proof of work"
sr. member
Activity: 406
Merit: 250
The cryptocoin watcher
June 19, 2013, 03:27:36 AM
There's actually a basic facelift for yacoin.org sent to the admin days ago, but it hasn't gone up yet. So a couple of us are talking of setting up an alternative homepage.
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
June 19, 2013, 03:13:14 AM
I'd like to see yacoin.org frontpage updated more often with better clients. There needs to be official release channel that doesn't include pocopoco anymore.

Are you willing to pay for that or do it yourself? If not, why should someone do it for you? You see, this board and cryptocoin community in general
is full of incompetent people demanding a lot of things and expecting to get them for free. That is not how Open Source projects work. You either
put your time and / or money where your mouth is or you stay quiet.

+1
member
Activity: 112
Merit: 10
June 19, 2013, 02:45:06 AM
I'd like to see yacoin.org frontpage updated more often with better clients. There needs to be official release channel that doesn't include pocopoco anymore.
sr. member
Activity: 425
Merit: 262
June 19, 2013, 02:08:20 AM
sr. member
Activity: 266
Merit: 250
June 19, 2013, 12:33:59 AM
The yacoin network has been 75-100Mhash for a couple weeks now.

I would expect a good price on Yacoin some time after August 13.

 Wink
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