Topic: [ANN][ZEN] Horizen: Unbounded By Design - page 103. (Read 217252 times)

Rob wrote an article that will be published in about 1 hour.

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Edited



https://blog.zencash.com/zen-is-antifragile-beyond-a-51-attack/

the real problem here is the lack of vision from the devs.

They should have had another algo with a procedure ready to go a long time ago.

I suspect that my rigrentals gpus was rented before ZenCash 51% attack:

Maybe it could help to trace the user and their identity?

2018-06-02 14:03:09   2018-06-03 00:01:09    0.00041256   jaaybs

Robert explains what happened during 51% attack and how Zen Team is going to solve this problem in near future.

Start at 10:17



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWJTC55tk-s  

I would like to add some aspects to the anti asic and protection against 51% attack discussion.

More concretely I would like to address the questions:

Is is the upcoming fork the reason for the attack?
In my opinion unlikely but may be. I think the fork and bitmain could be kind of a catalyst.

Was the attack possible because a fork did not take place long time ago?
Yes, definitely!

Why do I think so:
An attack is nothing that happens spontaneously. When you want to attack a network with a double spend attack you have to accumulate the currency before and not too many people noticing it. Also must ensure you got a manipulated node that builds its own chain and so on. This is nothing you do in few minutes, it requires knowledge and preparation. What I meant is: it may be that this as well as the past BTG attack was planned for a long time. Therefore I do not think it was a direct reaction to bitmain or the upcoming fork but it may be that the fork did determine the time point for the attack because once the fork happened the vulnerability is gone or mitigated.

Why that? Well the vulnerability is that the ratio of potential hash rate for the network over the actual net hash is too high. Zcash is the largest coin with Equihash 200.9 and has more then 10 times the net hash rate of ZEN. So it is natural that 10 to 15% of Zcash net hash are avail for rent just on one provider. While this is no problem for the big fish Zcash itself it is one for every small coin that uses the same algorithm. 51% Attack is available for rent! And it will be as long as Zen is not the largest coin of those sharing its algorithm.

Therefore the Zen team should have reacted long time ago - maybe when starting the coin - by forking to another algorithm - one that is unique for Zen! IMAO that is the only way to get rid of such attacks because as long as we stay on this it can happen again and it will happen again if the ratio between the price for doing the attack and the outcome for the attackers is positive. So either they bomb Zen price down to 1$ or the netHash increases high enough that the avail Equi 200.9 hash rate is no problem - then it will also not be one when the ASICS come.

More easy would be a fork to another algorithm. But please: be creative! Why do most now forking coins announce they want to use 144.5? When all do, then still the Zen network hash may be a problem for BTG or BTCP or others. Just the same on a different scale. Why not be more creative and do something unique for the coin? 192.7 has similar requirements regarding memory but already used by a small coin called Zero. Hmm .. but in between 168.6 could be an option.

Or why not pick something that also prevents large mining farms to be build for mining. Already 144.5 causes problems for GPUs with 2G of ram. 150.5 would almost be not possible to mine with 4G GPUs, 156.5 would rule out 8G cards. Going to  162.5 or 168.5 would mean that - except for extremely expensive server GPUs like Tesla V100 32G -  there are no GPUs with large enough memory to mine the coin. The only way to do it is on CPU in RAM (making large farms expensive) or swapping memory from GPU to host computer during the computation to ensure enough memory is on the card to continue. The latter would require GPUs to be connected by fast PCIE connector (so no riser) and to have enough swap space on the system to put the data there.

Of cause that also may rule out many private miners, but in fact it makes the coin non-profitable for huge data centers and huge mining farms that can easily swap their whole hash power quickly to wherever they like making it dangerous again.

So my conclusion: to prevent this happening again it is better to fork as soon as possible and please not to an algorithm already used by any coin with more value then  Zen. Doing this to protect the network from more attacks should be the main priority for the Zen team.

What is the influence of the ZenCash formation for the economy of a country? What is the advantage of ZenCash for the world of cryptocurrency?

We were in Frankfurt not long ago and Berlin just recently. Hamburg is a great city, find a decent event and we'll happily come along. 👍

I hope there's gonna be a crypto meetup with zen around Hamburg in Germany someday 🙃

I'm representing ZenCash team here on this forum, you can find details here: https://zencash.com/team/
 Robert also loves to chat here but in most cases he is very bussy - travels a lot, spreads the word of Zen. https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/finpunk-957495

My bad, I thought you were "Rob."  I thought that's what the letter "R" at the end of your user name stood for.

Thank you for your service!

I must correct you I'm not Air Force, but yes I've been in the army (Rober Viglione @finpunk is military officer).


Anyway, this is for all: I will tolerate everything while it is on topic and while it is non-offensive for participants and others..So please stay polite.
Also notice that im not moderator here on this forum.
Better stay on topic, rules are strict, don't mess with moderators..

Well, it is up to you to choose what method you prefer. I have practice to do both, just in case. Also in my case I'm doing this after every transaction  I have made. Yes, store it on the safe place!

If that's the way you feel... Maybe you want to find another coin that's pro-asic where you can fit in.

CPU is more equal?  Hmmmmmm

Let's see...  We have AMD and INTEL for CPU's who do not private/secret mine...  Is that any different than AMD and NVIDIA with GPU's who do not private/secret mine with large farms like a particular ASIC manufacturer of the Z9?  No, it's not.

ZEN is a project with good idea,unfortunately it is full of stupid Socialists who cannot understand that the advanced and efficient ASCIS is the guarantee of network security in any case.They choose to escape from the problem with centralization of socialism,they choose to conspiracy and hate the great company,and they choose to an algorithm that will eventually be cracked again,so ridiculous,I wonder why they accept GPU rather than CPU,CPU is more equal, isn't it?The uncivilized socialist is so ridiculous

I'm quite confident MedaR will respect freedom of speech.  I knew there was no need to get into details (specific) with MedaR to inform him HOW to respect freedom of speech if posts were to be deleted.  Especially, repetitive posts by me and someone else repeating the same thing.  

MedaR and I are both veterans [He, Air Force and me, Marine Corp].  If you know his credentials, you would know he needs no "specific" instruction regarding how to respect freedom of speech when monitoring a forum.

I apparently had to get "SPECIFIC" with you regarding HOW to respect freedom of speech to avoid being labeled a "communist."  However, I honestly don't give ANY "merit" or "weight" of this "label" from you, pitt59.  I doubt anyone else with an unbiased mind would either.

You did not read my SECOND edit above in that same quote:

here it is:

Also, I'm referring to MedaR deleting REPETITIVE POSTS.  Not all of them.  ONLY posts that constantly repeat the same thing.

Who wants to read posts that say the same thing back to back to back?

your post specifically says delete this trolls post lol happy that you ignore me because im just defending my opinion

lol im not talking about you ignoring me, which you should have, and im not trolling if im logically pointing out my opinion, this is decentralized we are all free to speak out, but you did just tell medar, probably a forum mod to delete my posts its all over the place dude you specifically told him to delete my posts your a dictator and preeching freedom at the same time

Not reading your post but you can read my previous one:  

and if it was bitmain doing attacks they could have just set a new pool up and no one would be any wiser till it gets outa hand, but on the other hand the other devil is gonna try to attack zencash network again you think that hacker would stop attacking, and whatever algo we change to we will be attacked if rented hash sites has alot more hash than our network THIS IS A FACT