its you who is naive, tell me and everybody here that if bitmain didnt announce an equihash miner would we be changing algo?
as of this writing nicehash has 58mhs available and zencash hash 48mhs, is bitmain to be blamed for this? i think not, just so you know i was pro gpu mining like i told you i was mining btcz and zencash last year add hush zclassic while it was 1usd only and even snowgem i started mining zencash at 3usd my view only changed recently because of the network attack done on btg and verge and i asked myself why btc ltc and dash all have asics isnt being attacked lol as of writing we are already vulnerable to that 51% attack because nicehash has more hash than our network, so why dont you tell the nicehash boys selling theyr hash there that they are worse than bitmain because for the past 2 weeks i have been looking at asics bitmain actually did btc ltc dash a favor by making the network less prone to 51% attack yet i have looked at bitmain as the devil until now looking at zencash that we are also vulnerable to the same attack that btg got and bitmain has nothing to do with it because those hash from nicehash arent asics and yet they have more hash then the total network hash of zencash
and why are we at the mercy of 1 centralized manufacturer there are others, didnt gmo produce the first 7nm btc miner, how about halong miner theyr starting at btc but they will eventually go to other algo, but even with gpu arent we also at the mercy of nvidia and amd, like what i posted until now i have not yet seen any retailer here with a vega56 or 64 but last year there are people who was able to buy 500pcs or more, how is that any better, well at least when bitmain announced the z9 mini it was just 1 unit per customer, and i still dont have any vega56/64, i only have 1080ti, like i said i should have bought the z9 mini but i didnt and theyr out of stock already lol is it that they sold only a few of them of is it that many people who bought it
Topic: [ANN][ZEN] Horizen: Unbounded By Design - page 105. (Read 217252 times)
i didnt buy the z9 mini and having 2nd thoughts now cause i should have, and being anti asic before now im having 2nd thoughts also
Why bother coming here "shilling" for Bitmain? You KNOW ZEN will fork and you're on here lobbying for Bitmain; NOT ASIC's.
WHY do you think all of us GPU miners and developers who are PRO GPU "chose" to create coins that were "supposedly" ASIC resistant? It's because we KNOW how CENTRALIZED mining would be with ASIC's and BITMAIN dominating. We know it full well.
Yes, most developers dropped the ball in regards to ensuring the network REMAINED ASIC RESISTANT. It's a lesson learned and will "hopefully" not occur again.
What's done is done! ZEN WILL FORK and there is NOTHING you can do or say to LOBBY to change the mind of the community.
Yes, there is an issue with a large portion of hash pointed at Suprnova Pool. That's a whole other issue of centralization to deal with. Yet, you actually want us to add ANOTHER centralization issue to the mix by TRUSTING ASIC manufacturers; namely BITMAIN.
NO THANKS!
lol and the nxt time bitmain cracks our new algo and they dont sell what do you think happens to us? and as i researched most of the pools bitmain owns arent really all hash coming from bitmain and since when did bitmain attack any of the networks that they got asics on? just compute nxt time cos unless were gonna be changing algo every 3months a new asic will come for our new algo and we will be at a disadvantage imagine 80mhs coming from 8k units of bitmain from theyr own pool lets say they dont do a network attack but think of how much we have to pay for electricity and how much for them, 10k sols for 1080ti is 3k watts and thats just 300watts for the z9 mini and bitmain can just re tweak again
and you think a fork will stop bitmain from cracking it nxt time? and if that time they dont announce that they have a new zencash miner that can do 20k sols, you think 80mhs total network of zencash is what? lol you think im pro asic? lol i have 1080ti's mining zencash since last year, im just pointing out that forking now is temporary but it might change how bitmain or any other asic manufacturer thinks nxt time, like i said if they didnt announce they got an asic for equihash is there any way for you to know that there is an asic already? well of course we wouldnt know but they could easily have mined in silence, and nxt time they crack our new algo they will stay quiet and when that time comes it wont be a z9 mini, remember there is a mini on that miner so means they have smething bigger and they want us to change algo so they can crack the new one and use that bigger miner there, 80mhs total net hash of zen right now, bitmain only needs 8000units of z9 mini to control the network and ots only worth 16m for them remember they made 4b usd last year thats like loose change and they dont need to sell any to the public
remember also that zencash total net hash is almost same as what nicehash sells on equihash and can be more so what can stop 1 guy from doing a network attack as it is even with gpu only were are still screwed
and what would stop a guy or froup from privately dealing with bitmain after we fork and ask bitmain to develop a new asic but they agree not to sell it publicly and that guy or group makes a 20m usd deal. they only need to tweak the z9 mini and a new miner is out again. my concern here is if they didnt sell it publicly would we know that there is an asic already? ask that to yourself in the future after we fork cos what seemed to be asic resistant is already not asic resistant they cracked everything from ethash to cryptonight to equihash
and if bitmain has miners were in no better situation on gpu because its also monopolized by nvidia and amd, while there are shortage of supplu how come you see other people selling at an insane price and have stock, for me if bitmain will agree to always do a max 1 unit per buyer this might actually be better than gpu mining
This statement alone PROVES the community would be at the mercy of ONE CENTRALIZED MANUFACTURER to "TRUST" they would do what you suggest AND ALSO APPLY THAT RULE TO THEMSELVES.
DON'T BE NAIVE.
Take your BITMAIN SHILLING elsewhere.
This community will NOT stand for it.
The higher hashrate the more secure,so we need the ascis which can provide higher hashrate,saying,more secure system as BITCOIN.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
what a silly and clueless comment.
Man who fears advanced technology is a silly socialist.
Doesn't bitcoin maintain network security with ASCIS miners?ASCIS is not demon, the silly socialist is.The silly socialist weakens everything.SAD。
Where do these cupcakes come from?
He is not a cupcake. Cupcakes are pleasant. He is a fruit fly. As intellectually insignificant as he is pesky and annoying.
Socialist again, sad little kid... The more you comment the dumber/clueless you look. I blame your parents (and Trump).
Pre-sale soft launch on 5 June https://order.xeeda.io/ and excited to provide the ZenCash community a special launch price of $99 USD.
Has the ZenCash network been stable and secure to make transactions ATM?
I would like to send my coins from windows wallet to exchange address. So, what should I do now?
Send them now (due to stability of network) or wait for days later to do those transactions?
I would like to send my coins from windows wallet to exchange address. So, what should I do now?
Send them now (due to stability of network) or wait for days later to do those transactions?
“IS MY MONEY SAFE?”
Increasing required confirmations to 100 makes another attack highly unlikely, however, if you have any specific concerns about the general security of exchange platforms, please contact the exchange directly. As always, we recommend that users store their funds in wallets that they control such as cold storage with something like a Ledger Nano S or paper wallet.
The Zen team will continue monitoring the network and conducting forensic analysis with the affected exchange. All information gathered will be provided to the appropriate authorities.
ZenCash remains committed to ensuring the security of its customers’ funds and recommends that our users contact exchanges directly with any specific security-related questions. ZenCash also remains committed to providing timely customer service to our community and will provide regular updates on the situation as it develops. Please follow us on social media to receive the latest update on this ongoing investigation.
https://blog.zencash.com/zencash-statement-on-double-spend-attack/?utm_source=blog&utm_medium=social&utm_content=ann&utm_campaign=double+spend
i didnt buy the z9 mini and having 2nd thoughts now cause i should have, and being anti asic before now im having 2nd thoughts also
Why bother coming here "shilling" for Bitmain? You KNOW ZEN will fork and you're on here lobbying for Bitmain; NOT ASIC's.
WHY do you think all of us GPU miners and developers who are PRO GPU "chose" to create coins that were "supposedly" ASIC resistant? It's because we KNOW how CENTRALIZED mining would be with ASIC's and BITMAIN dominating. We know it full well.
Yes, most developers dropped the ball in regards to ensuring the network REMAINED ASIC RESISTANT. It's a lesson learned and will "hopefully" not occur again.
What's done is done! ZEN WILL FORK and there is NOTHING you can do or say to LOBBY to change the mind of the community.
Yes, there is an issue with a large portion of hash pointed at Suprnova Pool. That's a whole other issue of centralization to deal with. Yet, you actually want us to add ANOTHER centralization issue to the mix by TRUSTING ASIC manufacturers; namely BITMAIN.
NO THANKS!
and if bitmain has miners were in no better situation on gpu because its also monopolized by nvidia and amd, while there are shortage of supplu how come you see other people selling at an insane price and have stock, for me if bitmain will agree to always do a max 1 unit per buyer this might actually be better than gpu mining
This statement alone PROVES the community would be at the mercy of ONE CENTRALIZED MANUFACTURER to "TRUST" they would do what you suggest AND ALSO APPLY THAT RULE TO THEMSELVES.
DON'T BE NAIVE.
Take your BITMAIN SHILLING elsewhere.
This community will NOT stand for it.
i didnt buy the z9 mini and having 2nd thoughts now cause i should have, and being anti asic before now im having 2nd thoughts also
my points were all just being against bitmain, but with the recent attacks on btg and verge, btg even without asics that attack was possible because nicehash has more hash than btg total hash, goes the same with lyra when verge was attacked yes other part used on verge was scrypt but ltc cant be attacked because nicehash dont have that much hash for someone to buy and attack ltc
2nd thing why im having 2nd thoughts about why resist asic is since last year until this year i havent seen a vega56 or 64 in any store here in our country while nov last year someone from our country posted a container full of vega56 he purchased, so how is pure gpu mining any different from asic if there are people able to buy gpu that others cant, if bitmain sold those z9 at maximum 1unit per custmer then that would actually be more decentralized than gpu since bitmain isnt the problem here but instead its the people who has asics and just pointing it to antpool or whatever pool bitmain owns and that goes to people selling hash to nicehash
why?? lets talk about even before bitmain announced they have an asic for equihash or monero, if they didnt announce that they are selling equihash asics and cn asics would we have been talking about forking? of course not but still nicehash most of the time has more total hash than the netowrk hash of zencash and most equihash coins so even without an asic we still have the centralization issue especially when it comes to pools how many times has 1 pool had more than 50% of the network hash of a coin but people dont care they still go to that pool and mine there and the pool owner dont do anything, ill put supernova as an example when btcz started supernova had 61% for the first 2months while we were telling people to spread the hash alot of people still just didnt care and during that time it was just gpu mining but did anyone say anything about supernova regarding how people are talking about bitmain now?
so in reality asics nor bitmain isnt the issue with centalization, its people or pools not taking action, why pools? ill use litecoin.org as an example, i think it was a few years ago when they were near the 50% mark they closed the pool to new miners and slapped the pool with a hefty pool fee so that people will switch, when did supernova do that but still people just mine there because they say its convenient for them regardless of wheter 51% is reached or not
3rd case why anti fork asic might be wrong, lets say we change algo now, so bitmain just solves it again, but lets say this time they dont announce theyr selling a new asic and just mine arent we in deeper shit than them? lets do an actual count and use zcash as an example, before bitmain announced the asic zcash was around 400mhs which is somewhere around 40,000units of z9 times 2k usd is 80m usd, if bitmain didnt sell the z9 mini and just wrote off 80m usd from the 1-4b usd they made last year thats peanuts and they could have controlled zcash netowrk anyway while were all mining with our gpu
my conclusion asic might actually make it harder for network attacks but we might have to talk to bitmain by limiting purchases of the miner so that its more spread to more people, because we still have this 1 question when we fork and nicehash catches up were still vulnerable to a 51% attack even with gpu only mining and how can that be any good for decentralization
and if bitmain has miners were in no better situation on gpu because its also monopolized by nvidia and amd, while there are shortage of supplu how come you see other people selling at an insane price and have stock, for me if bitmain will agree to always do a max 1 unit per buyer this might actually be better than gpu mining
my points were all just being against bitmain, but with the recent attacks on btg and verge, btg even without asics that attack was possible because nicehash has more hash than btg total hash, goes the same with lyra when verge was attacked yes other part used on verge was scrypt but ltc cant be attacked because nicehash dont have that much hash for someone to buy and attack ltc
2nd thing why im having 2nd thoughts about why resist asic is since last year until this year i havent seen a vega56 or 64 in any store here in our country while nov last year someone from our country posted a container full of vega56 he purchased, so how is pure gpu mining any different from asic if there are people able to buy gpu that others cant, if bitmain sold those z9 at maximum 1unit per custmer then that would actually be more decentralized than gpu since bitmain isnt the problem here but instead its the people who has asics and just pointing it to antpool or whatever pool bitmain owns and that goes to people selling hash to nicehash
why?? lets talk about even before bitmain announced they have an asic for equihash or monero, if they didnt announce that they are selling equihash asics and cn asics would we have been talking about forking? of course not but still nicehash most of the time has more total hash than the netowrk hash of zencash and most equihash coins so even without an asic we still have the centralization issue especially when it comes to pools how many times has 1 pool had more than 50% of the network hash of a coin but people dont care they still go to that pool and mine there and the pool owner dont do anything, ill put supernova as an example when btcz started supernova had 61% for the first 2months while we were telling people to spread the hash alot of people still just didnt care and during that time it was just gpu mining but did anyone say anything about supernova regarding how people are talking about bitmain now?
so in reality asics nor bitmain isnt the issue with centalization, its people or pools not taking action, why pools? ill use litecoin.org as an example, i think it was a few years ago when they were near the 50% mark they closed the pool to new miners and slapped the pool with a hefty pool fee so that people will switch, when did supernova do that but still people just mine there because they say its convenient for them regardless of wheter 51% is reached or not
3rd case why anti fork asic might be wrong, lets say we change algo now, so bitmain just solves it again, but lets say this time they dont announce theyr selling a new asic and just mine arent we in deeper shit than them? lets do an actual count and use zcash as an example, before bitmain announced the asic zcash was around 400mhs which is somewhere around 40,000units of z9 times 2k usd is 80m usd, if bitmain didnt sell the z9 mini and just wrote off 80m usd from the 1-4b usd they made last year thats peanuts and they could have controlled zcash netowrk anyway while were all mining with our gpu
my conclusion asic might actually make it harder for network attacks but we might have to talk to bitmain by limiting purchases of the miner so that its more spread to more people, because we still have this 1 question when we fork and nicehash catches up were still vulnerable to a 51% attack even with gpu only mining and how can that be any good for decentralization
and if bitmain has miners were in no better situation on gpu because its also monopolized by nvidia and amd, while there are shortage of supplu how come you see other people selling at an insane price and have stock, for me if bitmain will agree to always do a max 1 unit per buyer this might actually be better than gpu mining
CNBC media insert of ZenCash
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/04/for-all-the-hype-blockchain-applications-are-still-years-even-decades-away.html
Quote
"We haven't disrupted a single industry yet with blockchain technology yet, but the industries we are disrupting are going to respond," said Robert Viglione, co-founder of ZenCash, a cryptocurrency focused on user privacy.
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/04/for-all-the-hype-blockchain-applications-are-still-years-even-decades-away.html
Great article on ZenCash
https://hodlitbro.com.au/2018/06/02/fighting-the-autocratic-technocracy-zencash-brings-blockdag-privacy-partnership-with-iohk-and-other-big-guns-to-help-humanity/
Quote
Q11. What is the ZenCash teams position on ASIC Mining vs GPU Mining?
The edge case for ASIC mining is that there is a risk of being effectively taken over by a single mining company with asymmetric advantage in hardware. On the flip side, more hash power from powerful machines — if relatively evenly distributed across the community — is a very good thing for system security. In an ideal world, everyone would have a super ASIC, but we don’t live in that world and the reality is that sometimes a single manufacturer can dominate. In this sense, we’re quite sensitive to the network being captured and are actively looking at alternatives to mitigate that risk. Much of our community is in support of changing the hashing algorithm to have it remain optimized for GPU mining, so we take this option seriously and are investigating the best alternatives that weigh risks and opportunities.
Our community is very important to our future and a decision of this nature would have to actively source the opinions of involved parties.
Robert ViglioneThe edge case for ASIC mining is that there is a risk of being effectively taken over by a single mining company with asymmetric advantage in hardware. On the flip side, more hash power from powerful machines — if relatively evenly distributed across the community — is a very good thing for system security. In an ideal world, everyone would have a super ASIC, but we don’t live in that world and the reality is that sometimes a single manufacturer can dominate. In this sense, we’re quite sensitive to the network being captured and are actively looking at alternatives to mitigate that risk. Much of our community is in support of changing the hashing algorithm to have it remain optimized for GPU mining, so we take this option seriously and are investigating the best alternatives that weigh risks and opportunities.
Our community is very important to our future and a decision of this nature would have to actively source the opinions of involved parties.
https://hodlitbro.com.au/2018/06/02/fighting-the-autocratic-technocracy-zencash-brings-blockdag-privacy-partnership-with-iohk-and-other-big-guns-to-help-humanity/
The higher hashrate the more secure,so we need the ascis which can provide higher hashrate,saying,more secure system as BITCOIN.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
what a silly and clueless comment.
Man who fears advanced technology is a silly socialist.
Doesn't bitcoin maintain network security with ASCIS miners?ASCIS is not demon, the silly socialist is.The silly socialist weakens everything.SAD。
Where do these cupcakes come from?
He is not a cupcake. Cupcakes are pleasant. He is a fruit fly. As intellectually insignificant as he is pesky and annoying.
The higher hashrate the more secure,so we need the ascis which can provide higher hashrate,saying,more secure system as BITCOIN.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
what a silly and clueless comment.
Man who fears advanced technology is a silly socialist.
Doesn't bitcoin maintain network security with ASCIS miners?ASCIS is not demon, the silly socialist is.The silly socialist weakens everything.SAD。
Where do these cupcakes come from?
He is not a cupcake. Cupcakes are pleasant. He is a fruit fly. As intellectually insignificant as he is pesky and annoying.
Has the ZenCash network been stable and secure to make transactions ATM?
I would like to send my coins from windows wallet to exchange address. So, what should I do now?
Send them now (due to stability of network) or wait for days later to do those transactions?
I would like to send my coins from windows wallet to exchange address. So, what should I do now?
Send them now (due to stability of network) or wait for days later to do those transactions?
The higher hashrate the more secure,so we need the ascis which can provide higher hashrate,saying,more secure system as BITCOIN.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
what a silly and clueless comment.
Man who fears advanced technology is a silly socialist.
Doesn't bitcoin maintain network security with ASCIS miners?ASCIS is not demon, the silly socialist is.The silly socialist weakens everything.SAD。
Where do these cupcakes come from?
The higher hashrate the more secure,so we need the ascis which can provide higher hashrate,saying,more secure system as BITCOIN.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
what a silly and clueless comment.
Man who fears advanced technology is a silly socialist.
Doesn't bitcoin maintain network security with ASCIS miners?ASCIS is not demon, the silly socialist is.The silly socialist weakens everything.SAD。
fear advanced technology ? Rofl, good one.
The higher hashrate the more secure,so we need the ascis which can provide higher hashrate,saying,more secure system as BITCOIN.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
what a silly and clueless comment.
Man who fears advanced technology is a silly socialist.
Doesn't bitcoin maintain network security with ASCIS miners?ASCIS is not demon, the silly socialist is.The silly socialist weakens everything.SAD。
@dmwardjr
It's one of the strong points Zencash has: the community side. The team really listen to and consider what the Zen community thinks and what it wants. It's not really "I decide alone"
It's one of the strong points Zencash has: the community side. The team really listen to and consider what the Zen community thinks and what it wants. It's not really "I decide alone"
The higher hashrate the more secure,so we need the ascis which can provide higher hashrate,saying,more secure system as BITCOIN.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
what a silly and clueless comment.
Suprnova pool has a major big farm mining with an incredible hashrate, and two more "small" farms... so incredible that does not take to long to have 51% hashrate, in theory...
My guess finger is saying to me that new ASICS from Bitmain are beeing tested on Zencash right now...
This is infamous.... 16.720.549 Sol/s - half of Suprnova hashes... equivalent to about 2000 units of Z9 mini Bitmain ASICS.
https://ibb.co/hPfTv8
If we not get ride of this guys ZEN will be severely hurt...
Suprnova doesnt attack us, on contrary they are very helpful in this process. My guess finger is saying to me that new ASICS from Bitmain are beeing tested on Zencash right now...
This is infamous.... 16.720.549 Sol/s - half of Suprnova hashes... equivalent to about 2000 units of Z9 mini Bitmain ASICS.
https://ibb.co/hPfTv8
If we not get ride of this guys ZEN will be severely hurt...
+1 on that comment.
The higher hashrate the more secure,so we need the ascis which can provide higher hashrate,saying,more secure system as BITCOIN.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
It is a hysterical disease for fearing advanced machine,are we the uncivilized man who use pen and paper to calculate HASH? Ridiculous.
Suppose it's only a coincidence these 51% attacks occur on coins that:
#1: Declared they will fork away from ASIC's.
#2: All within a short time after CONFIRMING they will fork away from ASIC's.
#3: BITMAIN has a "motive" to implement a 51% attack based on developers of Equihash coins making a declaration they will fork.
#4: The fact that BITMAIN revealed they have a Z9 (not "mini") proves it would be VERY easy to implement a 51% attack. Which would ALSO prove they have mined with them for quite some time.
By you coming on here with your comment as a NEW ACCOUNT only suggests to me you're part of a FALSE FLAG 51% attack. Meaning, BITMAIN implements the 51% attack then sends proxy accounts out on social media to say we need their ASIC's to protect coins from attacks while they were the ones implementing the attacks all along. We're NOT stupid. Tell it to someone who's new to mining and doesn't know any better.
Once these coins are forked, we'll see BITMAIN LIED to Zooko in regards to not private/secret mining AND about not having a larger Equihash rig that's been mining for a LONG time. Hell, it's quite obvious they had the Z9 (not mini) BEFORE announcing their Z9 mini for sale.
How will we see BITMAIN lied? Once everyone notes how much the network hash rate drops. Especially, if ZEC actually forks and we witness their hash rate drop. BITMAIN, currently has their hash rate distributed somewhat equally among BTG, ZEN, BCP and ZEC.
Deleted...
What is the problem with Bittrex with ZenCash wallet. It's under maintenance for the second day. I can not send my ZEN 
The ZenCash network was the target of a 51% attack on 2 June at approximately 10:43 pm EDT.
The ZenCash team immediately executed mitigation procedures to significantly increase the difficulty of future attacks on the network. We are conducting forensics and will forward our findings to the appropriate authorities.
https://blog.zencash.com/zencash-statement-on-double-spend-attack/
It was taken down as a precaution and will be up again soon. The ZenCash team immediately executed mitigation procedures to significantly increase the difficulty of future attacks on the network. We are conducting forensics and will forward our findings to the appropriate authorities.
https://blog.zencash.com/zencash-statement-on-double-spend-attack/
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