Any other Americans considering a claim against the FBI over SilkRoad? - page 3.

MoonShadow

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Quote from: TiagoTiago on December 05, 2013, 04:11:10 PM

Quote from: MoonShadow on December 05, 2013, 02:55:06 PM

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on December 05, 2013, 01:15:54 PM

The FBI moved the coins. Either they brute forced the wallet password, timed the arrest when the wallet as unlocked, or DPR gave up the password. Either way they coins have been sent to private keys controlled by the government. The block chain is proof of that. Can't move coins you don't have the private key for.

They've moved the coins that were deposited into the server pool addresses, because that wallet.dat was probably on the server itself. Last that I heard, the address that the feds assume was the private wallet of DPR had not been moved; and if it had it would be more likely to be proof that they have a fallguy, and that DPR just moved them to make that point clear. It's hard to access the Internet securely from a jail cell.

Depending on the jail, it's not that hard to get a smartphone with a data plan in, specially if you're loaded.

He's been in a Federal holding jail for most of the time, and the Gmen have been watching him like a hawk for this exact reason.

dank

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You cannot kill love

Quote from: chowderman on December 04, 2013, 12:09:11 AM

Hahahaha, you're as stupid as the dealers, junkies and any other criminal fucktard that used that site. GO for it, file a claim, give them reason to know who you are and arrest your delinquent ass too. With you being a site user, it will certainly make you a suspect if you open your mouth, just go ahead and file your claim, that will be great. hahahaha. Fricken criminal scum and anarchist trash need to be put in prison, it was a great bust Silk Road, so many leads now. Lock all them bastards up.

Well, you're definitely an aware human being that shows empathy and understanding towards other people's freedom and rights.

TiagoTiago

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Firstbits.com/1fg4i :)

Quote from: MoonShadow on December 05, 2013, 02:55:06 PM

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on December 05, 2013, 01:15:54 PM

The FBI moved the coins. Either they brute forced the wallet password, timed the arrest when the wallet as unlocked, or DPR gave up the password. Either way they coins have been sent to private keys controlled by the government. The block chain is proof of that. Can't move coins you don't have the private key for.

They've moved the coins that were deposited into the server pool addresses, because that wallet.dat was probably on the server itself. Last that I heard, the address that the feds assume was the private wallet of DPR had not been moved; and if it had it would be more likely to be proof that they have a fallguy, and that DPR just moved them to make that point clear. It's hard to access the Internet securely from a jail cell.

Depending on the jail, it's not that hard to get a smartphone with a data plan in, specially if you're loaded.

MoonShadow

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Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on December 05, 2013, 01:15:54 PM

The FBI moved the coins. Either they brute forced the wallet password, timed the arrest when the wallet as unlocked, or DPR gave up the password. Either way they coins have been sent to private keys controlled by the government. The block chain is proof of that. Can't move coins you don't have the private key for.

They've moved the coins that were deposited into the server pool addresses, because that wallet.dat was probably on the server itself. Last that I heard, the address that the feds assume was the private wallet of DPR had not been moved; and if it had it would be more likely to be proof that they have a fallguy, and that DPR just moved them to make that point clear. It's hard to access the Internet securely from a jail cell.

FenixRD

sr. member

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I am Citizenfive.

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on December 05, 2013, 01:15:54 PM

The FBI moved the coins. Either they brute forced the wallet password, timed the arrest when the wallet as unlocked, or DPR gave up the password. Either way they coins have been sent to private keys controlled by the government. The block chain is proof of that. Can't move coins you don't have the private key for.

I've obviously not kept up with the happenings on this, then. I was under the impression that DPR had not provided the prikey(s)... I remember, shortly after the arrest of Ulbricht, hearing this cited as circumstantial evidence they may not have caught the real DPR. And that there were also a good number of coins for which they didn't even have an address for, so we didn't know how many there were.

Googling now, I guess, since I've clearly had a severe memory lapse...

DeathAndTaxes

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Gerald Davis

The FBI moved the coins. Either they brute forced the wallet password, timed the arrest when the wallet as unlocked, or DPR gave up the password. Either way they coins have been sent to private keys controlled by the government. The block chain is proof of that. Can't move coins you don't have the private key for.

FenixRD

sr. member

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I am Citizenfive.

Quote from: MoonShadow on December 03, 2013, 09:40:31 PM

I was using SilkRoad only to store a selection of bitcoins offsite. I've never bought any drugs from the site, and I'm sure that I'm not the only one. They took about 30 bitcoins from me when they snatched Silk Road, and I'm considering sueing them now considering their present value. Anyone else thinking about this? Anyone here have any experience with such a claim?

This is relevant to my interests. I have 35 BTC (iirc) in SR, and I too was only there out of curiosity. I wanted to know how the seller interface differed from the user interface, and had plenty of coins, so I paid the (whatever it was) for a seller account. Forgot about it until DPR got nabbed.

In addition to all the other issues, there's still the fact that these are all still encrypted, I assume. The feds appear to assume this too, based on the senate hearing last week. Everyone had a good chuckle about the unique situation (for them) where they had confiscated so much value that couldn't be touched. They can look through records and stuff all they like; I never did anything with my account than look around, but this was back when coins were like $5 or so, and I never bothered to pull the remaining ones of the 50.

If you get any interesting info, shoot me a PM. I'm not pursuing it unless I have reason to believe the PrivKeys can be had, but if I change my mind or find out something, I'll likewise give you a shout...

Hawker

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Quote from: MoonShadow on December 04, 2013, 12:26:54 AM

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on December 04, 2013, 12:16:31 AM

If you succeed the court would return the wrongly frozen assets back to you. I don't think I have to point out how much of an uphill battle that will be and how much the three letter agencies will turn over every aspect of your life to see if there is fire where there is smoke but it is your right as part of due diligence.

Well, I never bought anything on that site, but I sure wouldn't relish the thought of the FBI, ATF etc up my business for a mere $30K; but I strongly suspect that number is going to continue to rise.

Sorry for your loss.

Why not just walk into your local police station, say your property has been taken during someone else's arrest and ask if there is a form to fill in? It might be a good place to start and at least they will know a lawyer who specialises in the area.

jballs

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Quote from: beetcoin on December 04, 2013, 04:15:34 AM

RIP aaron swartz. he, bradley manning and snowden are true fucking martyrs to me. i don't know about julian assange, as he seems like he could be seedy.. but those 3 guys gave up their lives to get the truth out to us.

And the latest, Jeremy Hammond.

Hammond is particularly tragic as there is no grey area in what he exposed. Firms were hired to draw false connections between political activists and terrorists, presumably so they could invoke the NDAA and treat the political activists as terrorists (indefinite detention etc). This all came out in Hedges v. Obama and is on record, only because Hammond released it to the world. Yet instead of that conspiracy even seeing the light of day, Hammond got 10 years to sweep it all under the rug.

beetcoin

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RIP aaron swartz. he, bradley manning and snowden are true fucking martyrs to me. i don't know about julian assange, as he seems like he could be seedy.. but those 3 guys gave up their lives to get the truth out to us.

jballs

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Just a reminder as the anniversary of his passing is nearly upon us.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aaron_Swartz

There is not much in the way of justice in the USA with regards to technology questions. Presuming you did nothing particularly wrong (like violating jstor TOS by exceeding a download quota) does not mean somebody won't decide to put you in prison (for 50 years or less).

What say you, downloading jstor docs or bitcoins at silk road...

jballs

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Quote from: SaltySpitoon on December 04, 2013, 12:58:50 AM

Mmmm, I think its time we set up Bitcoin space nodes. I bet we could buy some launch rights from Greece, fire a high end server or ten into orbit with some Solar panels, and be out of global jurisdiction.

I'm not really a supporter of the Silk Road, nor do I condemn it. I do dislike the U.S ruining everyone's fun though.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/bitcoins-in-space-334701

soon.

SaltySpitoon

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Welcome to the SaltySpitoon, how Tough are ya?

Mmmm, I think its time we set up Bitcoin space nodes. I bet we could buy some launch rights from Greece, fire a high end server or ten into orbit with some Solar panels, and be out of global jurisdiction.

I'm not really a supporter of the Silk Road, nor do I condemn it. I do dislike the U.S ruining everyone's fun though.

jballs

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You will probably be arrested for frequenting a place where drugs are being dealt.

Agree your criminal trial would be interesting to follow as far as jurisdiction (don't know if there are federal frequenting laws but your state would charge you for them), not sure you want to roll those dice though. What the gov wants more than anything with SR is to make an example of the first batch and hope they discourage the concept. You never want to be the example setter for the powers that be. If by some miracle you got a judge to side with you the IRS would be in your living room the next day.

I wouldn't even have posted that you were there and surely wouldn't call them. But let us know if you give it a shot I will make some popcorn.

PS- For future reference, never stash your money at a drug dealer's house. And staring into the sun is a bad idea also.

DeathAndTaxes

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Gerald Davis

Quote from: SaltySpitoon on December 04, 2013, 12:25:54 AM

Not sure how well it would go over for Americans, however I wonder if it is possible for people from other countries to do so? For example, if you were buying drugs in a country that doesn't prohibit said drugs, and the U.S seized your funds, would you not have a claim?

Possibly expect dread pirate was a fucking idiot and put the servers in the US. The US is going to argue jurisdiction. Buying drugs might be legal in far-a-way-istan but I can tell you now the DOJ case will be the sale occurred in the US in violation of US law. Far better to file a claim as MoonShadow indicated that the claimant deposited coins but it wasn't to buy anything illegal. It could work. probably not but a lot depends on how much the coins are worth when that day comes.

BCB

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BCJ

E-gold was indicted on April 27, 2007 and the department of Justice obtained a restraining order to prevent the "dissipation of assets."
http://www.justice.gov/criminal/cybercrime/press-releases/2007/egoldIndict.htm

Legitimate investors are still trying to get their funds back in 2013
https://egoldclaimsprocess.com/

DeathAndTaxes

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Gerald Davis

Quote from: MoonShadow on December 04, 2013, 12:26:54 AM

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on December 04, 2013, 12:16:31 AM

If you succeed the court would return the wrongly frozen assets back to you. I don't think I have to point out how much of an uphill battle that will be and how much the three letter agencies will turn over every aspect of your life to see if there is fire where there is smoke but it is your right as part of due diligence.

Well, I never bought anything on that site, but I sure wouldn't relish the thought of the FBI, ATF etc up my business for a mere $30K; but I strongly suspect that number is going to continue to rise.

Yeah it is kinda an interesting concept. It will be a loooooooooooooooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnng ass time. These kinds of processes usually go far slower than most people expect. If I get a resolution (either a check from the US treasury or denied claim) on the Full Tilt Poker event before 2016 I will be pleasantly surprised.

Now in my case that fiat money is only going to go down in value but Bitcoins on the other hand. In theory that $30K might be worth $300K, $3M, $30M by then. At some price point it starts to make sense to take a stab at it. Hell if the payoff is large enough a lawyer might take it on contingency.

MoonShadow

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Quote from: SaltySpitoon on December 04, 2013, 12:25:54 AM

Not sure how well it would go over for Americans, however I wonder if it is possible for people from other countries to do so? For example, if you were buying drugs in a country that doesn't prohibit said drugs, and the U.S seized your funds, would you not have a claim?

I think that you would, but IANAL.

MoonShadow

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Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on December 04, 2013, 12:16:31 AM

If you succeed the court would return the wrongly frozen assets back to you. I don't think I have to point out how much of an uphill battle that will be and how much the three letter agencies will turn over every aspect of your life to see if there is fire where there is smoke but it is your right as part of due diligence.

Well, I never bought anything on that site, but I sure wouldn't relish the thought of the FBI, ATF etc up my business for a mere $30K; but I strongly suspect that number is going to continue to rise.

SaltySpitoon

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Welcome to the SaltySpitoon, how Tough are ya?

Not sure how well it would go over for Americans, however I wonder if it is possible for people from other countries to do so? For example, if you were buying drugs in a country that doesn't prohibit said drugs, and the U.S seized your funds, would you not have a claim?

Topic: Any other Americans considering a claim against the FBI over SilkRoad? - page 3. (Read 3952 times)