Ban from a Casino for Nothing Other Than Winning Too Much Money - page 4.

erep

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Quote from: uneng on October 01, 2023, 12:37:02 PM

About Dana White, maybe he is playing too high and casinos can't or don't want to cover a loss if the gambler wins the bet. It might be too painful for the house's bankroll to afford a loss against him. On the other hand, I think it's a dumb measure. Instead of banning him, they should just decrease the maximum bet size allowed.

I also thought the same thing, usually gambling bankroll houses target whale gamblers who place high bets on gambling, white plays a real casino so there are no bugs exploited to harm the casino bankroll and he probably has a special trick to increase the winnings from each bet, I didn't expect it he had won $7 million for the night and the casinos were not ready to empty their bankrolls for one skilled gambler.

We already know the reason he is not allowed to gamble at the hotel, the casino is not ready to bear big losses if he can win millions of dollars again in the next gambling, the right solution as you said above is that the casino must determine the maximum betting limit to avoid high winnings for the gambler.

Cookdata

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Quote from: alastantiger on September 30, 2023, 09:12:51 AM

Let's take a moment to think about this and tell me if I am correct. All of the people whom I have observed getting banned from gambling at casinos by the casino management, aside from misconduct and other offenses, are individuals who keep winning significant amounts of money. For instance, consider Dana White.

Quote

He has been prohibited from playing at some of the city’s best casinos, including the Wynn and the Palms, due to his high-stakes gambling habits. The UFC president is an avid gambler who has won substantial sums of money while spending hours at the tables in his chosen state of Nevada. But after some of his spectacular winning streaks, large hotel and casino locations like the Wynn have previously given him trouble. https://www.insidesport.in/accused-of-bankrupting-hotel-dana-white-explains-getting-banned-racking-up/#:~:text=He%20has%20been%20prohibited%20from,his%20chosen%20state%20of%20Nevada.

The way I perceive it is that if a person who is not cheating or engaging in illegal gambling activities consistently wins, the casino is highly likely to ban that person, just as they did with Dana White.

Banning look harsh, if there is an allegations of cheating, the casino must explain the evidence of cheating if not, the player reserve the right to sue except their is a terms and conditions attached that was accepted willing or unwilling that says when a player is found winning multiple time, then there is chances of disabling the said user from coming back to the casino but even with that, it's not ideal to ban user from playing because they want to preserve the player from winning.

It's not nice, but casino might also be logical to do so because it's not possible for a gambler to be winning everytime, the casino understood the system better and they know how the algorithm work, they know you weren't supposed to win. Infact, this actually define what gambling companies want all the time, you need to lose so they can make their money continuesly and they don't ban when you lose but it become a problem when you win, it's a real gambling when you lose but cheating when you win, clownish right. Undecided

uneng

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What I can say is that casinos usually ban players who are winning too much money when they suspect these players are cheating somehow. But if the player is playing legitimately, they have no reason to ban him, because at some point he will hit the long term, consequently losing money to the house. About Dana White, maybe he is playing too high and casinos can't or don't want to cover a loss if the gambler wins the bet. It might be too painful for the house's bankroll to afford a loss against him. On the other hand, I think it's a dumb measure. Instead of banning him, they should just decrease the maximum bet size allowed.

crwth

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It shows that he is a fortunate person and would be hard to replicate. It's always going to be on a case-to-case basis and the casino has that kind of power and it's their choice. Winning too much is either they can't prove his cheating or they don't want people like him to dominate and overcome the house edge.

darkangel11

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A number of things comes to mind after reading the story.
This is actually a way for Dana to boast and promote himself because he was banned due to being too good. I felt like that when I was being banned froim battlefield servers because they felt like I was cheating, but I wasn't. This is one of the situations where you feel good being kicked out by these pussies.

The casino had the right to ban him. They can allow or kick out whoever they like, but doing that comes with some negative press.

If a casino goes bankrupt because a player was good it's their fault for not being able to manage their bankroll.

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Quote from: Crypt0Gore on October 01, 2023, 08:29:01 AM

...
I like thinking about the other people, even when I am at an advantage, what would you have done if you own the casino? You will surely kick someone like that out, isn't it? Casinos have every right to always be the winner, they can kick you out if you win too much.

Casinos can deny services to anyone they want or feel to be an inconvenient to their operations mostly because in the eyes of the law, they are private companies which reserve the right of admission, etc.

I wonder what would happen if someone could win in a consistent way at a casino which was (somehow) owned by the government and was not considered to be a private entity but rather a private one. Would they still have the right to kick out a citizen and ban them from ever playing again there? Probably, there has never been such precedent ever.

irhact

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Quote from: alastantiger on September 30, 2023, 09:12:51 AM

The way I perceive it is that if a person who is not cheating or engaging in illegal gambling activities consistently wins, the casino is highly likely to ban that person, just as they did with Dana White.

Most casino that I know of don't do this, the only time I have heard of casino banning individual from playing in their casino is when they have done some things that are prohibited by the casino policy. For example, when they cheat the casino or destroy property or the peace of the casino by getting into a fight with other individual that came to gamble or doing other things that the casino don't like, that's when I know they'll banned you from coming to gamble.

If you're a frequent winner in my country, the casino might make you there ambassador so they can attract more customers because they'll use you to make others know that they can become winners too. Casino are making alots of money and they can pay out all winners.

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Quote from: Crypt0Gore on October 01, 2023, 08:29:01 AM

I like thinking about the other people, even when I am at an advantage, what would you have done if you own the casino? You will surely kick someone like that out, isn't it? Casinos have every right to always be the winner, they can kick you out if you win too much.

Yes, that's right and actually this can also be used as evidence if casinos limit things like that and prohibit someone from betting on their site, whether online or offline, it seems good to show that bookies can also be defeated to dispel the assumptions of people who have always thought that casinos and bookies always win, I'm sure if people who oppose this will definitely do the same thing where their money will continue to be drained to pay gamblers who win continuously.

Usually what I find is that there are often casinos that limit the user's bets because he keeps winning in those bets, for example sports betting, so maybe he is an expert in his field or is considered an insider who fixes the scores, I think other casinos will definitely limit and prohibit that too, even if someone else were a casino owner they would definitely do the same thing.

Woodie

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Quote from: alastantiger on September 30, 2023, 09:12:51 AM

Let's take a moment to think about this and tell me if I am correct. All of the people whom I have observed getting banned from gambling at casinos by the casino management, aside from misconduct and other offenses, are individuals who keep winning significant amounts of money.

I kind of agree with this!!
And with several cases that have found themselves in the reputation thread against casinos/sportsbooks, showing beyond reasonable doubt that winning players always get banned or funds frozen due to the huge wins... sends out a message of winners aren't welcome and it's no coincidence!!
They might not say it like I did, but they hit players with all these flimsy excuses just to try and reduce payouts by offering to give back their deposits and forget about the other coins in trying to reduce their payouts(expenses).

Quote from: Don Pedro Dinero on October 01, 2023, 08:31:26 AM

It also reminds me of the story of the Pelayos brothers, who discovered some mathematical imperfections in the physical roulette wheels in casinos, whereby some numbers tended to come up more in the long run, and they bet on it, winning a lot of money. As soon as the casinos realised this, they also banned them, but the brothers took the case to court and won. I can't find a good summary of the story in English but here is something:

The fabulous story of the Pelayos (La fabulosa historia de los Pelayo)

Thought this was written in Spanish and didn't bother opening the link, but this kind of proves that winners are indeed not welcome!!

YOSHIE

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Quote from: alastantiger on September 30, 2023, 09:12:51 AM

The way I perceive it is that if a person who is not cheating or engaging in illegal gambling activities consistently wins, the casino is highly likely to ban that person, just as they did with Dana White.

But at the end of the conversation written in the source, Dana White, stated like this.

Quote

Dana White said “It’s not that I’m banned from casinos, it’s just that they don’t want me to play there.”

As far as I know, cases like Dana White's, apply in physical casinos, the story is different if Dana White plays in an online casino, it could be that he doesn't have the opportunities that happen in the physical casino.

An incident like what happened to Dana White is exactly what happened in the James Bond film, he became a target for bandits to kill, because he won consecutive bets, yes, it is normal for the casino to forbid Dana White from betting at the casino, because the actions taken by Dana White could be detrimental to the casino owner, they anticipated this action, in my opinion this is one of the anti-loss measures for the casino.

Don Pedro Dinero

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I've heard this a lot from sports betting winners in Spain, that they limit their account or even prevent them from playing any more, which I don't know how legal it is.

It also reminds me of the story of the Pelayos brothers, who discovered some mathematical imperfections in the physical roulette wheels in casinos, whereby some numbers tended to come up more in the long run, and they bet on it, winning a lot of money. As soon as the casinos realised this, they also banned them, but the brothers took the case to court and won. I can't find a good summary of the story in English but here is something:

The fabulous story of the Pelayos (La fabulosa historia de los Pelayo)

The way I see it, the casino can't ban you because you win a lot, and it seems to me that it has a difficult defence in court, but I guess casinos can also spend a lot on law firms, which can defend pretty much anything.

Crypt0Gore

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Yes this habit isn't new again, and sorry for being the victim, the truth is anyone will do the same thing if the online casino is yours, casinos can never be friendly to someone who only knows how to win the house, I used to tell people that online casinos know what they are doing, they take more money from gamblers and give you few wins, it is what it is.

If your winning is getting too much they will block you from using their platform again and it's expected lol, why must you be that always lucky? Maybe you are using something powerful to place the bet? Believe it or not, this is what will be going on in their heads, they will try to find every clue and look through your past gambling strategies, if they can't find anything and the casino is a well reputable one, they will allow you to withdraw your funds and that's it, there is no coming back.

I like thinking about the other people, even when I am at an advantage, what would you have done if you own the casino? You will surely kick someone like that out, isn't it? Casinos have every right to always be the winner, they can kick you out if you win too much.

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Quote from: ethereumhunter on October 01, 2023, 07:00:33 AM

Maybe it's normal for a casino to prohibit someone from gambling and getting big winnings at its place continuously because it could harm the casino's finances. The casino does not want to suffer losses from this person so it must prohibit him from gambling at its casino. And this person should know that he can no longer gamble at that casino and move to another casino. They don't cheat, but the big wins they get can pose a risk to the casino and the casino owner certainly wants to avoid seeing his business get into trouble.

The problem is most of the casino is connected to each other so they share information about certain customers that gives them a hard time then later on him too. The person we are talking about here is a high roller with a very good analysis skills which means this person is a threat to casino industry.

Not only physical casino but also online casino is banning user or limiting their bets if they are winning too much. No business will allow someone to continuously drain their bankroll while they have a lot of customers contributing to the profit which they can focus on.

ethereumhunter

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Maybe it's normal for a casino to prohibit someone from gambling and getting big winnings at its place continuously because it could harm the casino's finances. The casino does not want to suffer losses from this person so it must prohibit him from gambling at its casino. And this person should know that he can no longer gamble at that casino and move to another casino. They don't cheat, but the big wins they get can pose a risk to the casino and the casino owner certainly wants to avoid seeing his business get into trouble.

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Quote from: Kakmakr on October 01, 2023, 04:59:35 AM

I think the key word here is .."high-stakes gambling habits" .... and that is a reputational risk for them, if Dana White continue that behavior and then get addicted to gambling. You do not want to be the casino that gets the bad reputation that you allowed a potential gambling addict to gamble at your casino.

"White revealed that he was banned from the Palms Casino after winning $1.6 million on a single night. It is worth noting that the Palms resort and casino is now owned by the former owners of the UFC, the Fertitta brothers, which has enabled White to gamble at the Palms again." - Source : https://www.sportskeeda.com/mma/news-my-anxiety-s-roof-joe-rogan-breaks-silence-viral-gambling-video-dana-white-losing-600-grand-blackjack

Who cares about a gambler getting addicted? Casinos implementing bans on users is like going against their main purpose, which is to generate money. In the article, it wasn't mention that he lost money; it's the opposite. He is into high-stakes gambling, as evidenced by winning millions of dollars in his gambling sessions. I don't want to speculate a lot, but according to my own understanding, casinos will likely ban gamblers if they are taking too much of the profits, and I think that's the case here.

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Are they protecting themselves or are they protecting Dana White?

They are protecting themselves.

Kakmakr

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I think the key word here is .."high-stakes gambling habits" .... and that is a reputational risk for them, if Dana White continue that behavior and then get addicted to gambling. You do not want to be the casino that gets the bad reputation that you allowed a potential gambling addict to gamble at your casino.

"White revealed that he was banned from the Palms Casino after winning $1.6 million on a single night. It is worth noting that the Palms resort and casino is now owned by the former owners of the UFC, the Fertitta brothers, which has enabled White to gamble at the Palms again." - Source : https://www.sportskeeda.com/mma/news-my-anxiety-s-roof-joe-rogan-breaks-silence-viral-gambling-video-dana-white-losing-600-grand-blackjack

Are they protecting themselves or are they protecting Dana White?

Peanutswar

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Theres alot of news related on it because of the prominent people who excels in playing gambling once a player makes a good consecutive wins the management will look closely for this person to check if they are cheating or abusing the current system of the gambling casino, as far as I know they make a conduct of interview to that person if they thing its too much on them and possible reason is to get banned them, it has a big risk to their business of course imagine winner always taking a thousand bucks to your pocket, other reason why they banned too is the people who have a lot of debts and cant pay anymore and make a penalty under the casinos house rules.

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Quote from: alastantiger on September 30, 2023, 09:12:51 AM

Let's take a moment to think about this and tell me if I am correct. All of the people whom I have observed getting banned from gambling at casinos by the casino management, aside from misconduct and other offenses, are individuals who keep winning significant amounts of money. For instance, consider Dana White.

Quote

He has been prohibited from playing at some of the city’s best casinos, including the Wynn and the Palms, due to his high-stakes gambling habits. The UFC president is an avid gambler who has won substantial sums of money while spending hours at the tables in his chosen state of Nevada. But after some of his spectacular winning streaks, large hotel and casino locations like the Wynn have previously given him trouble. https://www.insidesport.in/accused-of-bankrupting-hotel-dana-white-explains-getting-banned-racking-up/#:~:text=He%20has%20been%20prohibited%20from,his%20chosen%20state%20of%20Nevada.

The way I perceive it is that if a person who is not cheating or engaging in illegal gambling activities consistently wins, the casino is highly likely to ban that person, just as they did with Dana White.

There's nothing wrong with that. Casinos are in the business, so their main concern is profit. It's only unjustifiable if they ban a player without compensating him for his winnings, as that's a complete scam. Dana White is a popular personality; he could create a bad image for a casino by banning him, as he is sure he is not cheating at all. It's just that he has the skills to make casinos bankrupt. So either the casino allows its reputation to be ruined or it goes bankrupt. Of course, they will choose the lesser damage, which is banning a gambler.

With that said, I think the advent of crypto casinos has become an answer to that. However, if his skills are only applicable through face-to-face gambling in an actual casino, then he can't find any solution to his problem.

CODE200

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Quote from: alastantiger on September 30, 2023, 09:12:51 AM

Let's take a moment to think about this and tell me if I am correct. All of the people whom I have observed getting banned from gambling at casinos by the casino management, aside from misconduct and other offenses, are individuals who keep winning significant amounts of money. For instance, consider Dana White.

Quote

He has been prohibited from playing at some of the city’s best casinos, including the Wynn and the Palms, due to his high-stakes gambling habits. The UFC president is an avid gambler who has won substantial sums of money while spending hours at the tables in his chosen state of Nevada. But after some of his spectacular winning streaks, large hotel and casino locations like the Wynn have previously given him trouble. https://www.insidesport.in/accused-of-bankrupting-hotel-dana-white-explains-getting-banned-racking-up/#:~:text=He%20has%20been%20prohibited%20from,his%20chosen%20state%20of%20Nevada.

The way I perceive it is that if a person who is not cheating or engaging in illegal gambling activities consistently wins, the casino is highly likely to ban that person, just as they did with Dana White.

This is actually a measure done by the casino to avoid their business from collapsing, as someone like Dana White can cause their business to end. Because not only gamblers can lose huge amount of money, but also the casino itself. But I don't think it's right to ban someone just because they were that "good" in gambling.
Unless if they had won dishonestly and that they committed any cheating activities or offensive considering the terms and conditions of the casino, I think it’s fair to ban them if they have done something like these. Maybe casinos can think of other ways to regulate this kind of matters, because I believe that banning someone is not an answer to this as it can deprive someone from engaging in such activities.
But again, it is the decision of the casino as they still have the power to ban and prohibit someone from engaging in gambling.

len01

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anything that threatens gambling bankruptcy will certainly immediately take action such as prohibiting gamblers from gambling at the gambling site. but if a casino is already established and already has a very large bankroll, I am sure the ban is just like giving a maximum betting limit so that gamblers not be able to exceed the winning limit that has been determined by the casino bankroll and this is just my opinion, usually on gambling sites online has a maximum betting limit so the possibility of a ban occurring due to another offense. I mean nowadays popular casinos rarely ban gamblers unless they cheat.

Topic: Ban from a Casino for Nothing Other Than Winning Too Much Money - page 4. (Read 930 times)