Topic: {BFL} Bitcoin miners sue Butterfly Labs (Read 9585 times)

Karpeles is trying to make it looking as incompetence the reason of mtgox crash. The same with Zerlan and company. Only investigation may discover the truth. And lawsuits they are very afraid are fist steps to investigation.
As an unfortunate customer of BFL I have two questions:
- how long will BFL keep old gen miners on stock for RMA?
- will BFL offer upgrade to the new gen devices for their customers?
If BFL is trying to maintain proper customer relations as they are stating, they certainly should have an answers for these questions.

And dont dare speak up about BFLs incompetence and their track record and compare what they write on their site to lure you in ....

You will get banned for speaking your mind on their forum....



vBulletin Message

You have been banned for the following reason:
No reason was specified.

Date the ban will be lifted: Never

Butterfly Labs / Josh latest lie will be used in court against them.


More and more promises ("LIE") to manipulate YOU!

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/announcements/4414-monarch-information-2.html#post77863

Actually, you started the attacks and lies Bickski, so you are complaining about reaping what you've sown.  So sad you forget these little details, but then again, you have to or you'd probably be kept up at night by your conscience.  Oh, yeah, forget you don't have one....

A paid cheap shill. Give him a miner and dinner with drinks and he will tell all sorts of lies, attack people's good name all for what? The only thing of value is your reputation. Not that those lying for BFL care about that if they did they wouldn't be willing to lie to this community would they?

If it can mine bitcoins successfully, then it is fully functioning.


Yes there are. I do not trust them to give unbiased reports. I do not read product reviews from reporters that accept gifts due to the conflicts gifts cause.


You are right in one thing, I haven't been given any gifts. Jealous? Not a bit. I've been mining since long before BFL even existed. I don't need gifts.

AS I said, you already knew the answer even though you state it wrong.  It was NOT a fully functioning miner as it was hashing over 20% below the current models being shipped, it was not able to be sold so it was given as a gift with no strings attached.  Bruno was also given a free unit, which he decided to sell, does that mean he was paid off as well, since the trolls on here have insinuated as much several times now.  What I find interesting is that I have never advocated buying ANY miner from ANY company, yet I am 'whiteknighting' for BFL simply because  made it known I purchased from them and disagree with the haters who think they'd have gotten rich.  You and others lied to me repeatedly, telling me my money was gone that BFL was taking it and running and that I'd never see my miner, yet I have my Jalapeno sitting right here hashing away just like the 40,000 other units BFL shipped that you said would never happen.  The trolls say I've lied, which is another lie on their part.

You people are sad and you harp on the same things until the dead horse you're beating gets crushed into powder and you continue beating the ground.  Anyone who doesn't toe the Anti-BFL line is either a shill, a sock-puppet or as *U* puts it has Josh's hand up their rears.  I'm just wonder whose hand is up your rear paying you to make all these posts?  Bickski seems to be a likely source, maybe you are just his sock-puppet/shill and are being offered a free developer board for your hatred.

Unlike the rest of you, *I* have a fair bit of intelligence and I apply it to understand truths that others gloss over, such as the farcical claims about making 5000-7000BTC from a pair of mini-rigs or making 100BTC with a little single.  The math is simple and the data is out there, yet people are blinded, like Mr Meissner, that THEY would be the ONLY one to get a unit running and they'd be fat, dumb and happy with Millions of dollars.  I guess 2 out of 3 ain't bad;)

In addition, using your logic, there are numerous people on this board who have been 'paid off' by being given a unit they did not pay for.  I personally think you are bitter that you weren't one of the lucky ones.  Jealousy is such a terrible thing to hold onto, maybe you should see a councilor.

Whether BFL specifically said "post pro-BFL" or not, he was paid off. He was given a new, fully functional miner at no cost. So when he tries to imply impartiality by claiming "I wasn't paid to post", it's deceitful.


That sounds like an RMA routine, quite reasonable.

And no one was forced by anyone to send in a pre-order. End users chose to send them money, that's life.

That's not relevant unless he was explicitly expected to post things to this thread by BFL. *I* was sent "free hardware" from BFL, yet I post under no impramateur from them.

C

* My free hardware was a single old-style heat sink sent to me so I could see if it cooled better than the AL sinks on Jalapenos. As I posted in my threads, it does work better due to less airflow obstruction. This is completely irrelevant to the question of "did BFL screw people", my independant research showed that they ran into a big problem and bent over backwards to provide equipment that met promised specifications, even to the extent of shipping a lot of extra stuff and taking a loss.

All other equipment in my research was either purchased by me at full price/ebay prices, or was donated to me by other users (chips, a blown board, beer).

BFL was never forced (by random strangers) to accept pre-orders. They chose to accept pre-orders all on their own.


I was giving you the chance to be honest. Not surprised you didn't take it.

bcp19 was given free hardware by BFL. His "I'm not paid to post here" isn't the full truth.

Hmm, let's look at https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.588169

Direct quote: PS.  In the meantime, I would suggest all of you who don't have a pre-existing relationship with the company refrain from making any pre-orders.  We appreciate the interest in our product, but the hostility isn't worth it. Please just wait for off the shelf units to be available.  Thx.

Why ask questions you already know the answer to?

Oh, right, people here *forced* BFL to accept pre-orders. Please explain, how does an anonymous forum poster force a company to accept pre-order funds?



Remind us again, did BFL give you free hardware?

This business model pretty much came out BECAUSE of the miners.  In reading through the old threads, it fairly obvious that BFL was trying to create something with the FGPA and then sell it, but someone found their test page and started screaming scam which kinda forced them to come on here and defend themselves while they were still in development.  They originally did not want to have pre-orders, heck, they didn't even set out to make BTC miners, they were looking at another application of the FPGAs and were approached by miners who started the whole idea rolling.  Once word leaked, so many people on here basically begged for them to take pre-orders, that they relented and offered people the chance to order something that did not yet exist.  Once the door was opened, others came along and did the same thing, so it was basically a vicious cycle, take pre-orders and hope everything goes well or wait and watch as others take those pre-orders.

I personally knew about the BitSafe they talked about at CES back in Sept when Bruno and I visited the BFL facility.  That was something they were able to work on without the pressure of pre-orders cause it wasn't public knowledge and no one was hounding them for it.  So many people on here use the phrase "shut up and take my money" as sarcasm, but in reality, that's what happened as people were more interested in getting THEIR place in line than learning IF or WHEN it would come into existance.

The sad truth in all of this is that the miners brought this about and then turned around and damned them for doing it.

It's kinda lilke the people who think I am being paid to post on here.  I can honestly say that I enjoy a good income and I'd be willing to bet that BFL would not be willing to offer me a job where I am making more than I am now.

I personally wouldnt take the risk on a preorder from any company,  not just BFL.   Why pay for someone to develop product and get nothing but delays and headaches  when you could support a company that actually did it professionally and funded their venture before selling a product. 

This type of business model does not work in the long run.  Im sure they will eventually send out a product.  But you could have been mining already if you stuck with one of the companys that actually had products to ship instead of buying a hope  that you will have something to mine with in a year.  Everyone is so caught up in ROI ,  but how much ROI are you making right now with the delays?

This is strictly my opinion only.  I have not ordered from BFL and never would. 

IIRC Bitfury did have some type of pre-order funding through metabank.  However, it was limited to Russian citizens or something to that effect.  ASICMiner was publicly funded through an IPO which was very successful.  Bitmain did it entirely on their own.

We can also add Gridchip to the list, and I think they funded it entirely on their own too.

Aww, you just like what I have to say and you know it.

Maybe I misread your intent, but it sure sounded like you were inferring only BFL had to use someone else to manufacture their chips while the others did it onsite.  I do tend to zone out when reading your posts, because you do tend to has a lot of useless drivel in them, so I blame you for the misunderstanding.

Did bitfury, ASICMiner or Bitmain need to preorder so they could raise the money to develop their chips? not saying they did or didn't,  its a honest question.

Let's see, I know Bitfury designed his own chip. ASICMiner did too. As did Avalon. I think Bitmain did too. In fact, many ASIC manufacturers designed their own chips.

Neither did any other manufacturer?  Are you sure about that?  Surely you couldn't be wrong with that statement.  

How did you even get off my ignore list anyways?  Your input is the same old useless drivel.  Go out and do something productive with your life.

Using your criteria, neither did any other Bitcoin ASIC manufacturer... so what was your point?