Topic: BitBay OFFICIAL BITBAY Thread Smart Contracts Decentralized Markets Rolling Peg - page 135. (Read 542140 times)

When you post a contract for something you want to sell, you also deposit. Say you are selling a $100 item. Then you deposit $100. How long does it take on average before an item is sold? 20 days? (Remember some items are never sold) Let's say 20 days for now. So that's 20 days that $100 are locked in deposit. Then someone buys it and puts up their $100 deposit. How long does it take to ship the item? 2-3 days domestic? Up to 30 days international? Lets say 10 days on average. And remember the sellers deposit is also locked up during shipping. So that's sellers $100 locked up for 30 days + buyers $100 locked up for 10 days. A total of $100 locked up for 40 days. That means an average turnover of $1000 a day in our market will create a demand for Bay in the value of $40 000. A ratio of 1 to 40!

because it ties up a lot of coins in transactions.

but

tiered pos levels based upon amount held and duration held would be very attractive to investors.

it is probably quite difficult to implement else why would every pos coin not go for this? it encourages saving and accumulating and would require something huge to crash the market. If top level was attained by holding 5M for at least 1 year without spending  could be interesting

Of course the tiers would have to be well thought out.

However david assures me the peg is better still so guess we need to wait and see that in action. Sounds great.

What do you mean by that?
How will double deposit help in that?

We don't need masternodes to keep coins away from the exchanges. The double deposit will do that job nicely once the market gains tracktion 

Because it is a CONFIRMED, PROVEN, scam?

Apparently the rolling peg is expected for Q4 2017, but as it is a piece of technology that is completely new and never made before, it's not 100% certain.

hi bitbay devs, any news on the rolling peg?

Once enough people realize that most of these ICOs are nothing but "hype and hope", they will eventually flock to projects that actually have working tech with real world uses (like BAY). BitBay has one of the most extensive lists of useful features in all of crypto. It is an extremely versatile and multifaceted coin. The amount of real world use cases for it are almost endless. BAY already has a WORKING decentralized market with unbreakable smart contracts. The upcoming rolling peg will just be icing on the cake. I'm not gonna give any names, but can somebody please give me a reasonable reason why other projects that would be considered competition, are worth more than BAY, when BAY is arguably better than all of them? It absolutely makes no sense.

If anybody isn't familiar with BAY, just go check out its "Wall of Features"

Double deposit is really THE shit, arbitrated escrow I find really silly and useless. Nobody except the 2 parties can know who's wrong. The double deposit simply makes stealing disappear, it prevents it.
I think it's really too bad this project didn't have a decent marketing seeing for how long it has been existing up till now, but at the same time I'm glad, because otherwise I would have never been able to buy it at such an undervalued price.

The idea of masternode or staking with duration integrated would be so awesome
Maybe you could also add that people with frozen coins receive even more, thus encouraging more holding and more freezing among buyers.

also keep this thread on page 1 is worth more than you can imagine for attracting new interest.

there is simply no arguing against double deposits it simply makes perfect sense .. especially since it is variable and has a reputation system.
Like david says comparing to the fees you will be saving on ebay the odds simply stack up in the favour of dd. He has listed 10% that is nothing it if far greater than that on many purchases especially with the auto added international scam fees and other additions.

this is a waste of time all you need to do is study it and factor in that it is variable and has reputations system and the fees saved.... it just destroys ebays /paypals current model

even this though is not the main feature with bitbay for me.

the rolling peg and all the other possible usecases for bitbay core are huge.

the speed of development seems slow because david is not good at overselling his product like all other projects that almost have you believe they have these big plans ready to go when in reality they are not even 10% there and probably will never get to 50% ever.
However if david is actually still saying the peg, api and all other road map features will be done by end of year. This is still a huge leap past 99% of shit ico  dreams and talk bullshit worth 100's Millions.

I feel (could be wrong) we are still be pushed lower for those whales to accumulate more. This is good for me because I am kicking myself less for not buying more when it was sub 500 I am gradually stacking more.

I still feel a masternode or tiered pos system based on amount held and duration held is key. The peg will  null that I guess so have to just wait for that.

I can not wait for the day I see a huge green candle for bitbay it will be one of the most freaky REAL green candles we will ever see.

Haha dont know if anyone agrees if the world would be better without goverment but I understand your ideology.
Why not enforce 10% of the pos reward to a budget address? This way you can do markething or whatever and let comminity vote on it. Projects need funding. This is a already wokring product so its lacking adoption bc there is a lack of markething and people dont know or there is something wrong with the idea that people are just not interested in it

I dont think its strange that large deposits for large purchase have been done cause people who are using the platform now in this stage are familiar with the conditions and are willing to use it in this way. That doesnt mean people dont have problems with it cause most people who do dont complain they just move allong.

With the dubbel deposits we dont understand each other I think at least I dont reading your reaction. Now for my understanding this is how I think bitbay dubbel deposit work for example:

buyer 1 wants to buy a product worth of $1000 he has to send the seller $1000 and make a deposit of 1000 in the smart contract with the seller. The seller also have to put in $1000 in the contract. If the buyer dont gets his product he loses the original $1000 (cause he already send those) and he can choose to blow up the contract which hold the shared $2000 and that will get burned. So the seller would lose $1000 and the buyer $2000. This is how its works right? So even if the seller didnt deliver the buyer could lose another $1000 by blowing up the dubbel deposit contract?

So why cant you have 1 contract where the buyer send $1100 to the contract (1000 for the product and 100 for the insurance) and the seller also has to put in $1000 in the contract. Now if the buyer gets no product he loses $1100 and the seller $1000. Maybe you can even put the extra 100 that if the contract blows up the 100 will get back to the buyer? If the buyer does get his product the contract is released the seller gets his $1000 and the buyer gets his $100 back

What do I have wrong since this seems to be more logical to me there must be something I dont understand

I just stumbled upon this project and it looks very promising. I was going to do the survey on the website but the questions were to invasive for me so I decided to share here instead and give my feedback. This project seems to have a solid community and ongoing development with frequent updates with actual software.That itself speaks volumes.

The website is very informative about the features but it is very text heavy if that makes any sense. I think more images of the client itself and/or videos showing how these features can be used/utilized would help with adoption. I saw that the website is or was in the process of being redone so hopefully thats in the works. Also from my research I think a rebranding from BitBay may be necessary and welcome. When newcomers find the project (like myself) they inevitably stumble across the negative events surrounding the project during its inception and that can be off putting. There is also an exchange that is using the same name. I don't know if they are affiliated or not but that can cause confusion. I think a rebranding would help shake some of that stigma from the past, as well as increase usage/adoption , and avoid confusion with other businesses / projects. 

I also think the project is undercapitalized and may struggle to compete especially in this developing market. From my initial research I know the community comes together or the main dev pays for things from his own holdings when things need to get done (Facebook ads, ect) forgive me if I am mistaken. But I think that may become a growing hindrance. Especially as competition intensifies from other quality projects that have working capital (I won't mention those names DYOR). But thats my business and finance background surfacing.

But with that being said, I salute the dev @dzimbeck that kept the project going and continues to deliver. From what I understand, you did alot of the work solo and thats amazing. I picked up some BAY on BITTREX and I'm going to download the client later tonight and test it out. I followed on Twitter as well. I look forward to following this project and watching it grow/develop and being involved in this community. I hope it will be a success.  

It's 1,5 every block now, with the update expected around september, that will become 20
The amount of blocks depends on your amount of bay of course.

Anyone have an idea about the current staking rewards in the Bitbay wallet?
I like the idea of a market but the fundamentals of PoS are still very attractive...

Yea I'm a bit of an anarchist. It was after a realization that laws aren't morals. It is not immoral to be outside naked. It is illegal. And yet it is immoral to go after a person who is naked in public, threaten to shoot them if they don't come with you, then throw them in a jail cell. So the irony is cops and military the the immoral ones. Sure there is exceptions like punishing people who murder but even in that case, how can you prove guilt. Why can't people be taught to be peaceful? Why is the world not peaceful. Why is our media pure violence. Most laws are absurd and even more absurd is the method of punishment used. Two wrongs don't make a right, the jury and judge is usually wrong too. Also their judgement is under the authority of man and let all men be liars.

The world could be very beautiful without government. Things were always better in the past. For a man to trade freedom for security he will soon find he has neither.

The peg should be implemented within a year hopefully 6 months... people anticipate Q1 2018 and this will depend on when i get these templates done.

The budget... well since the founders left we have had to fund a lot of things ourselves. Sometimes the community helps and sometimes I fund from my personal Bitcoins. Sometimes I pay BitBay to bounties we have investors who got in early and they chip in. But there is no standard budget. We are volunteer and bounty driven. Sometimes I pay PR and soon we will start a Facebook ad campaign.

People can donate their POS rewards in the market client. That's already a feature. It's voluntary.

Oddly enough new buyers have put down large deposits on large purchase as we have had cash wires where a hefty deposit was done. I have also personally done an arbitrage contract with a big deposit. We have them and so far nobody has complained. Perhaps if this got really big an insurance company would come in for a fee to cover people who can't afford it.

To include a fee on top, why do that? The buyer should get that back. The thing about these contracts is they can be unilateral. So lets say a buyer has no deposit. The seller can guarantee his end of the bargain letting new buyers into the system. This is used for example on a persons "first" coins. But seller may want to do a little KYC first.

To be honest, this takes some getting used to. It's a major paradigm shift.

I did explain why they can't create burner accounts... there is a reputation system. A new buyer would have to put up equal deposit. If there was news of some fool blowing up their money then people would start requesting higher deposits. In some cases they may want additional contact info. And when is the last time you set fire to $4?

A small $4 deposit isn't illogical, paying 5-10% to give your $4 to a middle man is illogical. Here you SAVE 5-10% easy on fees. Why wouldn't they use it. Granted we are not at the point to get "normies" in but crypto is a paradigm shift, be patient. We very well could see it happen.

Paying a fraction of a deposit on an item worth 4x for example they STILL lose. If the item is 100 dollars and they pay 25 dollar deposit you are forgetting the payment is ADVANCED too. So they had 125 in escrow, now they have overpaid 125 for a 100 dollar item. For them to fake build a reputation just to LOSE 25 dollars is totally retarded in my humble opinion. The second they default the next seller would not let them put 25% deposit the next seller would require 100% and if they did it again the next seller would want 200%... this person would go poor fast.

It's like you are trying to justify a person setting fire to their own money. You realize by the time a seller does 10 deals they have already made 100% on the saved fees if they average 10% the item value? The odds that some crazy person would start kamikaze is like not even 1/10,000

I think you aren't realizing there are still industries that NEED this. For example the cash for coins business, they need it. They get accounts frozen by coinbase, paypals reversed on localbitcoins, they have the money to put for a deposit and they need a trustworthy platform. This solves it. Then there is people who want to barter. They need this! Bartering under the bridge of trust, never having to touch fiat with the insurance of DDE. Also Telcom where people need to wire money from one country to another, the headache of escrow. These people have millions of dollars (I know, I've spoke to some)... finding the escrow and bank between countries is a big deal, insurance and other things is a hassle. We just cut out that cost and they get it all back after a short time doing business. It's like a solar panel, the deposit may be high but they start seeing major benefits in the future.

There is something you might not be seeing. The normies are not necessarily our target market. There is tons of niche markets that truly don't have trust and need this. They don't have other options. That is where this can start and it will evolve to get accepted by normies after the benefits are seen.

Also punishing both kids is justice, because in my analogy I made the mistake of putting you are a parent. But remove the parent. If two people lie, there is only 3 people that know, the culprit the victim and potentially god(depending on your beliefs). No judge or lawyer or jury knows, it is an utter waste of state resources, courts are dumb, cumbersome and their judgement are usually wrong. The punishment hardly ever fits the crime and victim-less crimes are consistently prosecuted usually against the innocent. This system solves that. It's meant to work even in absence of governments. It reduces the problem to only include the parties that matter. The two INVOLVED. This is far superior to including an arbiter who knows nothing literally has to guess. You should see that this is the perfect system and can't be improved. I will bet that an e-bay arbiter is wrong at least 50% of the time.

This isn't a platform just for e-bay sales. It's sales of goods, employment, barter, trade etc. This can enable binary options and hundreds of other things.

What is this about inflation? Crypto doesn't inflate.

I'm asking for a billion dollars??!??!? Wow you are totally wrong there. Dude anyone who knows me already knows I really am not even in crypto for the money. I'm in it for these ideologies. We think the project should be higher because of the feature list and that there is so many vapor products on the top 20. That's the only reason. Investors want to do well and it does make me happy seeing them do well.

Nah keep looking like an ass, it's appreciated. It's okay this type of dissent is how people learn. But like I said before. Play devils advocate only if you mean it because I'm not so sure the devil needs any more help. 

Well very soon there will be a big update concerning the amount of stake reward and exotic spending, bringing a lot of new features.
So I don't worry too much, in fact the price being so low is a good opportunity to buy even more.
People selling now are the ones who are going to cry, they seriously don't realise the potential of this coin, I feel like it's the only one making some advances on a technological level and not only in the UI or the rewards.
Just wish I had enough btc left aside to buy more

Alright thank you for answering. Been reading a but more and listened to some radio interviews with you. You seem quite the anarchist on the pirate radio. So the rolling peg is somewhat more clear to me now. When doe you think the rolling pes will be implemented? I know new tech is almost impossible to give time scales on I only ask bc I think before we need lots of marketing and a period of heavy trading volume so we will get the attention of lots of new people.

Some questions didnt got answered and I got some new question when I thought about bitbay this day. First to come back on previous questions how is the budget? How is this arranged? I think bitbay need some serious marketing and therefore is (a lot)  money needed. I'll be willing to donate some if there is some serious effort but with my donation alone this wont get far. Are there any ways to get funding from the pos blocks? Iam not a coder and I realise that this is not something easy to do but with the voting system already in place it could be used for lots of good things what can be developed and funded this way.

Also I am thinking about the double deposit. I get that this may be the only way to force both parties to be honest. But I think regular customers( who dont know and dont care if its the only fair way or not) will not be happy with the double deposits if the want to buy something expensive.. If you want to buy lets say something worth $500-1000 and you finely saved the money together in the past months they maybe dont have the money for the double deposit, cant miss it at the moment or are afried to lose it (when there not familiar with the platform) I get that the reputation system is making this problem better but will not help a new buyer when he starts on the platform which will make  

So why not make (if possible at all) 1 contract for the money, no double deposits, but with the rules of the double deposit. Besides that the buyer has to deposit 10-20% extra on top of the original amount. If the buyer receives an empty box the funds in the contract get burned and both sides lose the money. If the buyer receives its product he agrees the funds will be released to the seller and the buyer gets his 10-20 % on top of the original amount back as incentive for not screwing the seller over when he got his product. This way you wont have to force the buyer to put in a 100% extra on top of the original amount.

Probably missing some points why my example doesnt work, but this was what I was thinking today. Maybe double deposits are the way to a fair market but will be a strange thing for customers and with higher amounts of money it will get tricky since not everyone can afford the double deposit.



I like the idea of a market for the frozen coins. And I agree what you say but I think before we enter this stage we must have a period of heave trading volume and market swings driving attention and people to bitbay. People dont know bitbay and will not notice if there is nothing done with marketing and if you wont get the snowball effect just once.

The problem is that Bitbay is no longer in the top 100 in terms of the market capitalization of altcoins. If we are not in the top 100, we tend to drift unless there is some major development in the coin.