Topic: Bitcoin & Electricity: Threat or Blessings - page 2. (Read 15440 times)

Since electricity is sold to people by utility companies, it's simply another sale. That's what they want, don't they? If they need to build more power plants just to sell electricity to miners, why not? More money for the utilities. More money for the various fuel companies that sell fuel to the utilities, right? More sales means better GDP, right?

Some ICO field of operation is alternative energy
Such as WPP energy as well as the project I have its signature
In other words, crypto contributes to
the diffusion of alternative energy on a large scale.

Fundstrat’s Sam Doctor tweeted the below image demonstrating the past performance of Bitcoin as it relates to the P/BE indicator.
https://cryptoiscoming.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/fundstrat-pbe.png

Doctor said:
    “We believe breakeven mining costs provide a support level for $BTC, as #miners – main natural #Crypto sellers – reduce selling at low $BTCUSD price. Based on expected computing hashpower and breakeven cost growth, that could imply #Bitcoin price of $36,000 by 2019 year end.”

Bitcoin mining wasn't generally this costly – it's a focused industry which has advanced from fans mining in their storm cellar on an old CPU to immense stockrooms loaded up with a great many dollars of specific ASIC miners or specially designed mining rigs with illustrations cards. The furor has come to the heart of the matter where gamers have seen illustrations card costs ascend out of their achieve, prompting a large number of them to detest the crypto development by and large.

As mining setups turn out to be further developed and rivalry increments alongside the trouble of the calculations, the value ascends ever higher. It's assessed that before the year's over, Bitcoin mining will devour 0.5% of the world's electricity.Ethereum miners haven't fared much better – in the wake of seeing a 20x increment in esteem, individuals ran to mining the number 2 cryptocurrency, yet falling costs and expanded rivalry have lessened rewards there also. Tom's Hardware discharged a diagram demonstrating the decrease in mining productivity from December to March when costs tumbled from $871 to under $500 where they remain today, bringing about a 10x decrease in mining gainfulness.

Proof of Stake transactions speed can exceed bitcoin current PoW transaction speed ,
but it would hamper the miners ability of profiting by controlling bitcoin,
which is why the miners will never agree to switching consensus methods.

Hmm right but if we use PoS,  and miners are out of network, will it hamper the process

Storing mega mega mega watts of electricity? Are the efficient batteries? Efficient energy storage is one of the world's biggest problems. Why is that electricity must be used right away the moment when it is generated?

If all the electricity supply generated can be stored then it would change that market altogether.

Sorry , there is no way you are going to convince me that Bitcoin Energy Waste is in any way acceptable.

The Crap coin argument about Proof of Stake falls on deaf ears with me,
Many Proof of Stake coins are worth millions so saying they evaded attack because there is no profit in attacking them is false logic.

By 2021 , I believe there will be no denying the issue, so I have no problem letting time be the final arbiter of our discussion.

Later,
ZZ

If Bitcoin continues rapidly, then perhaps in the future it will be the cause of the development of the energy industry. Bitcoin is really a major change in the life of mankind.

You didn't read the study. You answer make no sens because Nuclear isn't cost competitive with coal or hydropower. But if you wanna talk about it here or on private, please be free.

Furthermore, the Bitcoin ledger can only be immutable if and only if it is costly to produce. The fact that Proof-of-Work (PoW) is “costly” is a feature, not a bug. Bitcoin’s public ledger is secured by its collective hashing power. But Bitcoin doesn't need more energy for being censorship resistant. Bitcoin network is already censorship resistant, if the hash rate increase it's only because of the mining industry whose strictly profite motivated But thinking that this increase will be constant is wrong because every four years the reward decreases.

Of course, no one can guarantee this, especially I) But see for yourself, the hashrate is growing steadily, the development is continuing steadily, in spite of the correction, maybe not as fast as we would like, but still. They want to do the same futures and ETFs not at some EOS, but only on Bitcoin (I mean not just paper speculation, but with real buying and selling). When the lightning network will be massively used, it will be possible to quickly and cheaply pay for inexpensive goods and services with Bitcoin. With the further development of Bitcoin, the increasing adaptation of SegWit and the unloading of the network from small and frequent transactions (thanks to non-log linening), the speed of transactions will increase many times and commissions will decrease. Of course, surely some Altcoins will occupy their niche, maybe they can earn a lot more money, but this does not mean that Bitcoin will definitely die out in a vacuum.

Sir , So lame statement , You mean to say Cutting Down trees causes more harm than Bitcoin Mining. Lets clarify again we are not here to bargain which causes less damages or which causes more damages.  In both sense it will harm as well as damage our environment in long term.

We should think it for sustainable growth , who said to forget Bitcoin and trash it. Technology is developing day by day. Nothing is impossible. You are thinking about your lifeterm , 60 - 90 years may be. But here we have to think sustainable growth for next generations.

Don't just fight until winning with your lame argument. Today or tomorrow we have to think this idea.

zinzang

do the math research, not the media research
i really have to laugh at the independant newspaper article... how empty of real content
'he said x by 2018'
'he said y by 2020'
final quote
“But the future estimate? That’s quite debatable,” he said.
it made me laugh


bitcoin mining is not eating past the excess as shown before from actual math. bitcoin is not even 1% of china...
china actually produce 13% excess than demand. so its no where near eating into demand.

buying excess does NOT raise prices of the consumer demand. infact it helps lower prices.
imagine you produce 2000 bananas a day. it costs you $1k to grow that allotment.
but you only sell 1800 ono average. meaning you have to sell each banana for over 55cents
now you know 200 banana are going to waste unpaid for.
but tomorrow a vegetarian group that eats alot of banana wants to buy up your 100 of your excess
yay you are now selling 1900 bananas a day meaning you can sell your bananas at 53cents


as for the production. the asic farms are actually investing in their own power plants too thus wont even touch national/public demand in the future

oh and as for PoS. dont let me bring out the comedy moments of that.
currently because blocks on crap coins are not worth much, people dont care to bother untangling a crapcoin blockchain of PoS
but should something such as bitcoin move to PoS. you will see many people untangle and recombine new higher blockheight of bitcoin data and gain from it.
PoS is not safe, its just evaded attack by how little value can be gained by messing with it because crap coins are crap.

oh as for electric
did you know that cutting down trees to make wood for floorboards. so that wooden desks can sit on the floorboards so that paper can sit on the desks actually causes more environmental damage than a electronic tablet would which can store more pages than the desk and floorboards can

think about it.

can both. become a threat because it requires a lot of electrical energy, can be imagined later when more and more bitcoiner. can be a blessing, because the state electricity company is selling well so that it gets big sales

Your Conclusion is wrong.

The World makes a Limited Supply of Energy , Bitcoin requires an ever growing amount of the limited supply.
Just because they monopolize hydro in one area , does not mean a Coal / Nuclear plant does not need to make up the difference on a electric grid to keep it from collapsing under the strain.  * Many Nuclear Plants also run Giant Diesel Generators when they need to decrease the output from the reactor.*
The World has still not found a way to dispose of nuclear waste safely without it taking 100s of years.

Limited Supply means when one source draws excessive amounts, it raises the price for everyone else.
Simple Economics.
Plus Saying the renewals can handle the load is pure nonsense, bitcoin rate of consumption is exceeding renewals growth by multiple amounts.

  

you are asking the wrong question; You should ask yourself if a technology that consumes energy necessarily have a high carbon footprint? Of course it's not.

For those interested, I share with you a 35-page personal study on Bitcoin's energy footprint;

Difficult since the beginning of the year not to fall on a newspaper article announcing that the Bitcoin network is an ecological disaster due to its high energy consumption. We will soon learn that Bitcoin miners are responsible for the non respect of the Kyoto protocol.

The Bitcoin network uses a large amount of energy. However how I said earlier, does a technology that consumes energy necessarily have a high carbon footprint?

After analyzing the mining sector and the energy sector, this argument does not hold if we take into account the rapid adoption of renewable energies by miners. Better yet, Bitcoin contributes to the development of alternative energy solutions, particularly hydroelectricity

Medium:
https://medium.com/@jicprusnel/bitcoin-as-an-environmental-subsidy-to-alternative-energy-1e91c427ab9e

PPt presentation:
https://www.slideshare.net/JeanChristopheBusnel/bitcoin-and-its-energy-footprint-120144132?qid=f0356e77-e70d-4053-95d9-39d6e7065cc7&v=&b=&from_search=1

I think that can only mean "One great solution for the world with one gib problem".. The elecetricity usage went so high with the bitcoin and the all other altcoin mining in all around the world. The number are terrifiying.. The cryptocurrency brings great things to our lifes yes but that much of usage can harm everything in the world.. I can't say threat or blessing but this could be something very important in near future for the world..

Actually the point to this topic is try to imagine,
if Bitcoin was not an energy hog sucking up excess electricity and causing the price of electricity to increase for general consumers
that have nothing at all to do with the crypto.

IE:
An Energy Efficient Proof of Stake uses less electricity per household than an XBOX and would have ~zero affect on the energy infrastructure.

While Bitcoin Wastes so much electricity that it increase environmental pollution , while raising energy prices ,
while straining local electricity grids, and requiring more natural resources to be drained for it's Limited Transaction Capacity.

Which is why by 2021 either bitcoin is dead or only mined by Government Sanctioned Miners.
Remember Bitcoin Miners have to receive Electric Utility Approval to draw that extreme amount of energy,
therefore at some point , Utility Approval can be used to control or destroy them.

While Proof of Stake can be run on a Laptop in a Coffee Shop , with no one the wiser that you are even doing it.  

The comparison is really just Amazing beyond words.

FYI:
Just to show Bitcoin Energy Waste is Growing Faster than Calculated.
This Article Stated Bitcoin would be using 0.5% of the world energy by the end of 2018.
https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/bitcoin-mining-energy-use-electricity-cryptocurrency-a8353981.html

But this Article points out that Bitcoin has already exceeded that 0.5% and already at 1% of the world's energy and we are not even out of 2018 Yet. 
https://theoutline.com/post/6047/bitcoin-mining-accounts-for-almost-one-percent-of-the-worlds-energy-consumption?zd=1&zi=7ed2ljca

processing efficiency is already happening.. its called asics
imagine doing 55exahash using CPU

(intel  i5/amd phenom ii)

1cpu =14mhash
1000=14ghash
1m cpu = 14thash

yep 1 ASIC is 1million PC's
so the 4million asics = 4 TRILLION PC's

try to imagine bitcoin if we remained CPU mining. requiring 4 trillion PC's

We can also look at a different angle, not just a solution on the side where we optimize the source of energy. We can improve the efficiency of processors so it would take less energy to solve more complicated mathematical puzzles. It might be harder to achieve, but I think this solution for long term.