Topic: Bitcoin & Electricity: Threat or Blessings - page 3. (Read 15444 times)

im laughing at the OP's stats
ireland uses 3.2gw a year!!?(seems low)

hmm
3.2million kw
imagine a pc, house lighting. fridges, washing machines.. screw it lets call it 6kwH a day minimal (£1 a day @16p/kwh)
(yea im using a yearly electric bill of £365 which seems low end for most people. but you will see why)

so low end 2190 kw a year per house
so ireland only has 1461 houses at low end or less houses if they used mor than £1 a day of electric..
(simple math anyone can do can see 3.2gw is not irelands entire yearly usage)
ireland uses 3.2gw AN HOUR!!

but lets go check how accurate even 3.2 is.. whether yearly or hourly
https://www.worlddata.info/europe/ireland/energy-consumption.php
"The most important measure in the energy balance of Ireland is the total consumption of 23.79 billion kWh of electric energy per year"
(23790gw a year, =65gwh per day,= 2.7gw per hour)
so its 2.7gw a hour....


now lets take bitcoin mining
~55exahash = 3928571 s9 asics (14terra hash. 1.3kwh)
3928571 asics=5107142kw per hour (5.1gw an hour)

yes bitcoin uses more gwh than ireland by a factor of nearly 2x
but a 2 seater car uses more fuel than a 2 seater motorbike by a factor of 3x
(omg shock horror destroy all cars!!!!(sarcasm))

an entire global currency uses more electric than a small island..... thats called twisting facts(comparing an international currency to an island of sheep, fields and.. Guinness)
now lets not twist things to create a propaganda shock drama
compare how much CHINA uses.. seeing as most of the mining propaganda is about "china own bitcoin".

https://www.worlddata.info/asia/china/energy-consumption.php
"The most important measure in the energy balance of China is the total consumption of
5,920.00 billion kWh of electric energy per year."

yep china uses 675gw per hour
but now compare that to the bitcoin mining of 5gw per hour

wait. the china own 51% of mining.. so using the propaganda against the propagandists..
2.4gw per hour mining vs 675gw general usage


.. but hell lets be extreme lets say all bitcoin mining was in china and go back to the 5gw per hour mining
5gw/h mining vs 675gw/h general usage (just for china... not whole world)
yea extreme numbers.. still amounts to bitcoin mining using LESS than 1% of just china

Your topic seems fully legit for me. I swear i think implementing PoS might solve the problem. But is it viable to think to restructure the Bitcoin Process.

I might be wrong but this article is delivering strong point of the adverse effect for bitcoin mining. Mining with is not profitable sir,  i am the worst sufferer of that.

Bitcoin + electricity = mining.
This is the way making profit in bitcoin I think bitcoin miners earn a lot of money from now and many year we already reach for mining Some people get rich for this method's of making profit. Until now mining is very profitable for them if they get lot of gpu miners.

FYI:
Electricity can be stored,

1. Batteries
2. Flywheels
3. Gravitational potential energy using a pumped hydroelectric facility.
4. Compressed Air Energy Storage
5. Rail Energy Storage
6. Molten Salt Storage
7. Thermal Energy Storage

Reference: http://discovermagazine.com/2015/july-aug/26-power-stash

 

Plus electricity cannot be stored. Once its generated it should be used or else it goes to waste. There are some areas in the world that give big discounts to people to use more electrcity because the supply is more than the demand.

"Bitcoin's wasteful use of electricity" is propaganda to diabloize it.

I've got a feeling that this topic does not even belong to a bitcoin discussion board because what OP is talking about is not about bitcoin and electricity despite the title. it is instead about electricity and the ways it is produced!
the "green" energies and the way you produce the electricity other than burning fossil fuels is a very good discussion but it is about electricity production and there is nothing bitcoin can do about it. bitcoin is a consumer of that energy and the consumer can not force the producer to change its ways. you have to focus on the producer instead of the consumer.

I know the outcome of Bitcoin is gigantic and we cant over respond the reality. In any case, for the survival we have to comprehend the result. We can't remark on this reality as a native of a developed nation. We have restricted measure of vitality , so why not think to spare it for our future. In the event that it isn't conceivable , we need to think this with sustainable power source. It is imperative for Bitcoin's Survival.

Because Green mining is possible, we have to change the way.

What is really funny , is how all of those people that ignore bitcoin's energy waste
always seem totally clueless that Proof of Stake can provide an energy efficient method with a onchain transaction capacity higher than bitcoin.

Bitcoin has not been decentralized since the Chinese miner exceeded almost 70% over 2 years ago.
Bitcoin is now and will forever more be Centralized.

The problem with bitcoin is the rate it has been requiring more resources, it is exponentially growing at a rate that exceeds current energy infrastructure. And the current energy infrastructure is growing at less than 15% per year, Bitcoin is exceeding that % and will drive up prices or be banned depending on the Electric Utility's Choice. Some such as China are starting to Ban already and the miners used hydro-electric in China.
The places where mining is profitable is decreasing every few months.
It really does not matter whether you believe it or not, by 2021 the reality will be inescapable to all.
By that time Bitcoin Mining will be done only by the government sanctioned few or died because it was crushed by it own growing electricity input costs.

actually the irony is that a lot more energy is wasted each time someone brings up this topic that has been discussed a million times and is wrong. and it is funny that the theme of it is always the same but the discussion is seemingly different. basically you all are ignoring the unimaginably huge utility that bitcoin is offering as a decentralized currency. you with your statements such as "bitcoin is taking away energy that could be used elsewhere" as if the energy production is capped and bitcoin is taking away from it! and others with similar statements.

There is an increase in green energy miners who will help to change the way miners consume energy. Most use solar energy but newer projects are looking at bigger alternatives like geothermal

In Proof of Stake,
The larger the number of coins per block the better your chance to stake.
Some calculate a coin weight = # of coin * days since last staked
(Their are multiple implementations with varying specs.)

Big Difference
in PoW your ASICS can try and mine every block,
in PoS  your coins go inactive for a defined period of time after the stake (varies with different coins)
This keeps a Proof of Stake Majority Coin Holder from dominating the block generation unlike a Majority Proof of Work Miner that could dominate a PoW network constantly.

Pooling is not as important in Proof of Stake as Proof of Work.
In some Proof of Stake coins it helps and in others no real difference , just depends on their specs.

* In Proof of Stake the blocks creation difficulty increases if the blocks are being found too fast,  and decreases if the blocks are not being found fast enough,
so pooling can't make more blocks be found than the daily limit set in the program code.*


 

Sir i just got your words, but in case of PoS the New block is found through a deterministic way ( i read in google) , and it depends upon the stake and records. Does it mean the pool with maximum assets will find the block faster ?

Bitcoin can only go Green by dropping the Proof of Work and moving to an alternative such as Proof of Stake.

The PoW miners have centralized control of bitcoin thru their PoW Mining Equipment, giving that up would give up their control.
They will never do it.

If you want energy efficiency, look into the alts as bitcoin is dead in the water on ever fixing their energy waste problem.

Yep we can't play with the environment for sure. But i think finding the green way will be the most sustainable solution we can ever have.

Bitcoin mining used electricity and by doing mining we used more electricity, but there are more activity that used more electricity, and we can used another electricity source to mine bitcoin, so I don't see how bitcoin mining could jeopardise the environment, everything in this world uswd electricity and the factory used more electricity than bitcoin mining, the bank also used more electricity than bitcoin, so I don't see this as problem

A lot of thing already be threat for environtment, and that is humanity. But if bitcoin mining can give something to fix it, maybe to build another alternative electricity will be very good. I not support or agree if we destroy with environment, but blame if only bitcoin which make our environment destroyed, it is totally wrong.

here we ago again the lies of wasting electric

so here goes
bitcoin mining farms (the smart ones) are not wasting electric.
power companies dont just produce to demand. they produce with EXCESS so that there is a buffer so that when homes turn on lights or cook something. the sudden change of electric draw doesnt cause brown outs

many big mining farms buy up some of this excess in a year long contract. because the excess cant be re-used/stored. so would go to waste otherwise.

by actually using the excess and having funds come from it allows power companies to expand and upgrade their facilities faster to be ready for future demands.

the math some have reported as being atleast 1% of world usage is a fallacy. the real numbers are around 10x less than that. (under 0.1%)
the article that reported the 1% were using 2015-6 hardware but with 2018 hashrate stats. which is like saying it takes an hour to get 3 miles because they base it on the speed of walking and not realise current tech is cars, trains, planes which are faster.

take the s9 antminer. 14thash using as much electric as 2 gaming PC's but producing as much hash power as double digit thousands of gaming machines

I know you have done a lot of Research,  but this forum has become so much scammy i cant believe. People will die with sMerits and will use it in heaven. Even one of my friend told me he got merit from a friend. So find friend with merits. Lots of merit,  there is no one cares for you,  for your content,  whatsoeve.  Anyway nevermind friend your content is good,  if i had merit i would give you.

I also think Bitcoin is consuming more power,  we have to think green.  

Considering how much energy the whole banking system of fiat-currencies uses, the amount bitcoin needs is more than fair.
If we think further in an idealistic way and consider a widespread replacement of fiat throuh crypto in the next decades, there will be even less energy needed.

In this context, the idea of proof-of-capacity (PoC) is also an interesting thing, as it already offers the technology without waiting.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proof-of-capacity