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Topic: Bitcoin IS basically DESTROYED - page 28. (Read 47245 times)

newbie
Activity: 28
Merit: 0
May 12, 2016, 04:12:07 AM
I'm not sure it is mathematically/logically possible that half the human population be dumber than the average

Ahem. Did you not learn about the Gaussian distribution in high school like the rest of us did.



The few posters with a brain stem, prevent the thread from being turned into a disinformation campaign by those who are either of only average intelligence (thus not adroit with logic) or those intentionally disingenuous trolls. Which classification do you reckon applies to DooMAD?

Given that half of the human population are dumber than average, and if we estimate 25% of the population are dishonest (feel free to adjust this number, my view might be too cynical), he has 12.5% chance of being intentionally disingenuous.

Lol. But in order for your logic to work, you need to assume that he is dishonest with himself, i.e. blinded by their own ideologies, which I find to actually be the case with ideologues.
legendary
Activity: 2604
Merit: 1036
May 12, 2016, 02:46:14 AM
Well it's obvious that China owns most if not all of the hashing power in the world and that Bitcoin mining has basically become centralized but do you think the Chinese government might try to exert control over all the mining farms in order to mess with the Bitcoin network? I hope China realizes that tinkering with the network or trying to strong-arm changes in the core client that will favor miners more may cause an irreparable damage to the Bitcoin market.
legendary
Activity: 1148
Merit: 1000
May 12, 2016, 02:26:50 AM
The few posters with a brain stem, prevent the thread from being turned into a disinformation campaign by those who are either of only average intelligence (thus not adroit with logic) or those intentionally disingenuous trolls. Which classification do you reckon applies to DooMAD?

Given that half of the human population are dumber than average, and if we estimate 25% of the population are dishonest (feel free to adjust this number, my view might be too cynical), he has 12.5% chance of being intentionally disingenuous.

Your math here made me smile, I'm not sure it is mathematically/logically possible that half the human population be dumber than the average  Cheesy But I do get what you're trying to say.
Anyways what I really wanted to comment about is your extremely optimistic estimate of only 25% being dishonest  Huh  I'd say it's probably closer to 99.9% if not a full 100%.
hero member
Activity: 966
Merit: 1003
May 12, 2016, 02:03:33 AM
The few posters with a brain stem, prevent the thread from being turned into a disinformation campaign by those who are either of only average intelligence (thus not adroit with logic) or those intentionally disingenuous trolls. Which classification do you reckon applies to DooMAD?

Given that half of the human population are dumber than average, and if we estimate 25% of the population are dishonest (feel free to adjust this number, my view might be too cynical), he has 12.5% chance of being intentionally disingenuous.
legendary
Activity: 1148
Merit: 1000
May 11, 2016, 11:35:20 AM
I mentioned this a couple of years ago in one of those Bitcoin will kill the Dollar threads. The 51% attack is a very real concern. A lawless Bitcoin network means that all we have as guarantee that everyone will abide by the rules is trust. We rely on the word of mining farms to pull back if they get close to owning too much of the network hash. Any single country owning so much hashing power is bound to cause unease.
AGD
legendary
Activity: 2070
Merit: 1164
Keeper of the Private Key
May 11, 2016, 10:47:46 AM
Bitcoin is basically destroyed now with 70% of the mining controlled by China, soon to be 98+%, and with Blockstream implementing their SegWit soft fork Trojan Horse so as Matonis admits can end up increasing the 21 million coins limit.

The entire ecosystem is headed for a clusterfuck.

I honestly believe this is the truth.  What is there to add ?

~CfA~

BTW, you are talking about this Matonis guy, who has no doubt about Craig Wright is Satoshi Nakamoto? Sorry to dig that up, bud.
full member
Activity: 228
Merit: 100
May 11, 2016, 10:12:37 AM
There are some companies working at China outside the country the ownwers,soo isnt controlled,sure they hold several has and several bitcoins and are able to manipulate the market ,but no one has full control of bitcoin we keep being able to work and earn with bitcoins soo till the moment the money around bitcoin stop circulate i would consider it very alive.
sr. member
Activity: 280
Merit: 250
May 11, 2016, 10:06:39 AM
it can never be destroyed
newbie
Activity: 28
Merit: 0
May 11, 2016, 08:29:08 AM

Great to read you have an IQ higher than 115 and some logic skills.


Another sucker in the "IQ is a thing" scam eh?  Always sad to see people fall for that.  One thing we all know for sure: those who call other idiots regularly (without the necessary context for that to have meaning) have the opinion of themselves that they are unlikely to do well on any test involving imagination, empathy, or self discipline.  What one calls others reflects what one thinks of ones self.

What other kind of nonsense do we have here in this thread, deniers of the anthropocene age, claims that centralization of mining is equivalent to private issuance (huh?), and of course  十五岁的外国人真的知道中国人是谁。

What conclusions?  We should all get some sleep, read some books and stay out of the forums for a bit.  

I am just frustrated with your illogical replies, including the quoted one above. You think you are smart, but you wrote nonsense again.

But I'll drink a beer to your last sentence. Cheers.

I hope you guys can keep the thread rational.
newbie
Activity: 28
Merit: 0
May 11, 2016, 08:25:13 AM
Anonymint, you've lately been saying Bitcoin is doomed because of mining concentration in China, so my post was entirely focused on that point.  We all know China specifically is not an actual threat to Bitcoin for the long term.

Huh  Huh

It doesn't matter where the ASIC mining farms are located, but that doesn't mean China isn't a long-term threat to Bitcoin's decentralization.

As for the other decentralization issues, yea, maybe Bitcoin is 100 pools in the future, or maybe it's 10; regardless, it will likely be beneficial in the fight against fractional reserve, debt based currency.  If you claim it will be captured by regulators, oh well, people would just start using a new cryptocurrency or fork of Bitcoin if they attempt to increase the coin limit.

The threat is not just from pool concentration, it is from ASIC mining farms of which just one owner plans to be mining about 30% of all Bitcoins, another one 10%, etc.. These owners absolutely will obey any government edicts which require they institute capital controls on Bitcoin transactions. They would be crazy to risk their mining farm being padlocked and confiscated for disobeying.

Once the masses are using Bitcoin, they will not switch. Please stop writing delusionary nonsense.

The bankers who have captured the state are going to end up losing power somewhere down the line through this.  In other words, no matter what happens with Bitcoin, you can't make a system worse than what we already have.

The bankster elite never lose power. They didn't lose power during the French revolution. The political figureheads lose their heads, but the banksters are eternal. Sorry man. You are living is some delusion that doesn't agree with 6000 years of recorded history.

The globalist elite are moving us towards a one world reserve currency new world order of control (and Bitcoin won't be the world's reserve currency, but rather is a digital totalitarian currency of global exchange not a reserve currency). China and Singapore will take over power from the West. We are entering a more totalitarian Technocracy world. There will be a smart meter on every home, etc..

Please wake up from your stupor.

That's why I do not buy into your statement that all cryptocurrency systems are pointless because you don't think they're decentralized enough or some other metric.  I do not believe unprofitable PoW will be a valid solution either (especially in the case of IOTA). 

The system is going to collapse and Bitcoin will play a role as a vital life raft to get to whatever is on the other side.  Think of it as a eugenics program, or the first welfare system for Caucasian and Asian computer science students.

Bitcoin will trap your capital and be confiscated. Enjoy.

I am not saying someone might not invent a solution, but it is unlikely.

Pray. Clusterfucked world coming.
newbie
Activity: 42
Merit: 0
May 11, 2016, 08:24:55 AM
...
No, I'm pretty sure even people in the US should be recognising this as the toxic, paranoid, prejudiced, xenophobic drivel it is.  I can assure you I feel no non-American angst, nor am I attempting to instil it in others.  You can't rationally claim that a certain group of people within a set border are a problem whilst also stating that geographic location is irrelevant.  Unless, y'know, you're insane, which I'm not ruling out as a possibility.

Don't particularly care about this guy's sanity, but sure, he can state that "a certain group of people within a set border are a problem whilst also stating that geographic location is irrelevant." He'd be right, too Smiley

Great to read you have an IQ higher than 115 and some logic skills.

The few posters with a brain stem, prevent the thread from being turned into a disinformation campaign by those who are either of only average intelligence (thus not adroit with logic) or those intentionally disingenuous trolls. Which classification do you reckon applies to DooMAD?

Also, fun fact, not everyone in China is a communist, you stereotyping screwball.

Did he suggest that all Chinese were Communists?

DooMAD and others build strawman arguments based on claims I never made. That is the typical behavior of an idiot who isn't adroit with logic and/or a disingenuous troll.

In fact, I wrote upthread that China's ideological revolution has starved some 57 million peasants to death, because the Communist Party fucked up the mechanisms of agriculture. That means I am not implicating all the Chinese people. In fact, at least 1.5 million Chinese were executed during the 1960s purge because they refused to declare allegiance to communism.

However, it is a fact that many Chinese have a predisposition to favor top-down control. In fact one of the key members of the Chinese Bitcoin miners cartel recently admitted that in a direct quote. I don't have time to dig it up, but perhaps one of you can.

I am not blaming the problem of Bitcoin's centralization on China. The centralization is unavoidable due to the flaw in the economic design of Satoshi's profitable proof-of-work. It centralizes and eventually becomes a fiat, by-design. Satoshi (knowingly or not) designed it to do that.

It just so happens that China is a very conducive place to form an oligarchy, because the Chinese economy is largely overlorded by oligarchies. China has nearly always throughout its history had a culture of warlordism.

I don't hate Chinese people. China and Singapore are rising and will be the new financial capital of the world by 2033, taking that role away from New York and London respectively.

I am just speaking factually. Every culture+society has its attributes and we shouldn't be afraid to speak the reality.

But why? China has nationalized the means of production in the past, that's pretty much the core tenet of Communism.
Are you saying that's not a concern, or that you simply don't like the word "Communism"? I'm a bit irked by the "Fascist" bit, but Communism is pertinent, especially with China flipflopping all over the place re. legality of Bitcoin itself.

What part about corporate-fascism irked you? Do you think I am predicting a return to Nazi holocaust?

Examples of corporate fascism include for example how this absolute lie and propaganda of man-made climate change (as opposed to environmental destruction which is a scientifically unrelated issue) was foisted on the world so that for example Obama could shut down the coal electrical generation plants who are not his cronies and award carbox tax exclusions to his cronies:


But what is more interesting to me is your generation is so ideologically preoccupied. Perhaps you believe in the lie of anthropogenic global warming as well. I hate to bust your bubble but it was a propaganda constructed to put in a place a global governance and taxation system. The scientists have confirmed we are headed into a Mini Ice Age and our global temperature is modulated by the sun, nothing else. Period.


No wonder why noone takes you seriously.

I didn't take him seriously before but that quote is priceless.

Especially because after I embarrassed Gmaxwell upthread on the technical points, now I am going to embarrass you guys with some facts (but I realize your AGW religion ignores facts):

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.14688442

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.14660362

"Corporate fascism" is simply a loaded, pejorative phrase. The term "Fascism" itself is so ill-defined that it carries no meaning outside of "do.not.want," at least when used without a qualifier.

Here's what wikip has to say:
"One common definition of the term focuses on three concepts: the fascist negations of anti-liberalism, anti-communism and anti-conservatism; nationalist authoritarian goals of creating a regulated economic structure to transform social relations within a modern, self-determined culture; and a political aesthetic of romantic symbolism, mass mobilization, a positive view of violence, and promotion of masculinity, youth and charismatic leadership.[25][26][27] According to many scholars, fascism—especially once in power—has historically attacked communism, conservatism and parliamentary liberalism, attracting support primarily from the far right.[28]

Yeah, not much there. And no one seems to agree on what it is.
legendary
Activity: 2436
Merit: 1561
May 11, 2016, 08:24:46 AM
Why would the fact that China is basically controlling mining do anything to Bitcoin?

The whole concept of bitcoin was based around decentralization.

If China controlls a large % of the hash power then it would only take the collaboration of a few to hit the dreaded 51% control point

why they should destroy their own business? 51% will never happen, with their cheap electricity they are earning a shitload of money...

There's another downside of it. Chinese gov could easily take control over (vast) majority of hashing power (or shut just shut it down) if they only wanted to for whatever reason. It would require minor operations and, unlike western countries, they wouldn't even have to justify it (search for legal grounds etc).

It's bit weird how many people are accusing others of being CIA/NSA agents and of trying to take control over Bitcoin, but refuse to see big, Chinese elephant in the room.
legendary
Activity: 1066
Merit: 1050
Khazad ai-menu!
May 11, 2016, 08:21:24 AM

Great to read you have an IQ higher than 115 and some logic skills.


Another sucker in the "IQ is a thing" scam eh?  Always sad to see people fall for that.  One thing we all know for sure: those who call other idiots regularly (without the necessary context for that to have meaning) have the opinion of themselves that they are unlikely to do well on any test involving imagination, empathy, or self discipline.  What one calls others reflects what one thinks of ones self.

What other kind of nonsense do we have here in this thread, deniers of the anthropocene age, claims that centralization of mining is equivalent to private issuance (huh?), and of course  十五岁的外国人真的知道中国人是谁。

What conclusions?  We should all get some sleep, read some books and stay out of the forums for a bit.  

newbie
Activity: 28
Merit: 0
May 11, 2016, 08:09:45 AM
Well, if it ain't China then those white devils look like they'll do a pretty good job too - https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4isxjr/petition_to_protect_satoshis_coins/d30we6f

Lol, thanks for that!

Theymos defacto in effect admits TPTB_need_war might be correct with his technical allegation upthread that Bitcoin could possibly have a back door that could be cracked:

Edit: To be absolutely clear: I am not proposing (and would never propose) a policy that would have the goal of depriving anyone of his bitcoins. Satoshi's bitcoins (which number far below 1M, I think) rightfully belong to him, and he can do whatever he wants with them. Even if I wanted to destroy Satoshi's bitcoins in particular, it's not possible to identify which bitcoins are Satoshi's. I am talking about destroying presumably-lost coins that are going to be stolen, ideally just moments before the theft would occur.

This issue has been discussed for several years. I think that the very-rough consensus is that old coins should be destroyed before they are stolen to prevent disastrous monetary inflation. People joined Bitcoin with the understanding that coins would be permanently lost at some low rate, leading to long-term monetary deflation. Allowing lost coins to be recovered violates this assumption, and is a systemic security issue.

So if we somehow learn that people will be able to start breaking ECDSA-protected addresses in 5 years (for example), two softforks should be rolled out now:

Vindicated!
legendary
Activity: 2590
Merit: 3014
Welt Am Draht
May 11, 2016, 07:56:42 AM
Well, if it ain't China then those white devils look like they'll do a pretty good job too - https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4isxjr/petition_to_protect_satoshis_coins/d30we6f
newbie
Activity: 28
Merit: 0
May 11, 2016, 07:50:37 AM
...
No, I'm pretty sure even people in the US should be recognising this as the toxic, paranoid, prejudiced, xenophobic drivel it is.  I can assure you I feel no non-American angst, nor am I attempting to instil it in others.  You can't rationally claim that a certain group of people within a set border are a problem whilst also stating that geographic location is irrelevant.  Unless, y'know, you're insane, which I'm not ruling out as a possibility.

Don't particularly care about this guy's sanity, but sure, he can state that "a certain group of people within a set border are a problem whilst also stating that geographic location is irrelevant." He'd be right, too Smiley

Great to read you have an IQ higher than 115 and some logic skills.

The few posters with a brain stem, prevent the thread from being turned into a disinformation campaign by those who are either of only average intelligence (thus not adroit with logic) or those intentionally disingenuous trolls. Which classification do you reckon applies to DooMAD?

Also, fun fact, not everyone in China is a communist, you stereotyping screwball.

Did he suggest that all Chinese were Communists?

DooMAD and others build strawman arguments based on claims I never made. That is the typical behavior of an idiot who isn't adroit with logic and/or a disingenuous troll.

In fact, I wrote upthread that China's ideological revolution has starved some 57 million peasants to death, because the Communist Party fucked up the mechanisms of agriculture. That means I am not implicating all the Chinese people. In fact, at least 1.5 million Chinese were executed during the 1960s purge because they refused to declare allegiance to communism.

However, it is a fact that many Chinese have a predisposition to favor top-down control. In fact one of the key members of the Chinese Bitcoin miners cartel recently admitted that in a direct quote. I don't have time to dig it up, but perhaps one of you can.

I am not blaming the problem of Bitcoin's centralization on China. The centralization is unavoidable due to the flaw in the economic design of Satoshi's profitable proof-of-work. It centralizes and eventually becomes a fiat, by-design. Satoshi (knowingly or not) designed it to do that.

It just so happens that China is a very conducive place to form an oligarchy, because the Chinese economy is largely overlorded by oligarchies. China has nearly always throughout its history had a culture of warlordism.

I don't hate Chinese people. China and Singapore are rising and will be the new financial capital of the world by 2033, taking that role away from New York and London respectively.

I am just speaking factually. Every culture+society has its attributes and we shouldn't be afraid to speak the reality.

But why? China has nationalized the means of production in the past, that's pretty much the core tenet of Communism.
Are you saying that's not a concern, or that you simply don't like the word "Communism"? I'm a bit irked by the "Fascist" bit, but Communism is pertinent, especially with China flipflopping all over the place re. legality of Bitcoin itself.

What part about corporate-fascism irked you? Do you think I am predicting a return to Nazi holocaust?

Examples of corporate fascism include for example how this absolute lie and propaganda of man-made climate change (as opposed to environmental destruction which is a scientifically unrelated issue) was foisted on the world so that for example Obama could shut down the coal electrical generation plants who are not his cronies and award carbox tax exclusions to his cronies:


But what is more interesting to me is your generation is so ideologically preoccupied. Perhaps you believe in the lie of anthropogenic global warming as well. I hate to bust your bubble but it was a propaganda constructed to put in a place a global governance and taxation system. The scientists have confirmed we are headed into a Mini Ice Age and our global temperature is modulated by the sun, nothing else. Period.


No wonder why noone takes you seriously.

I didn't take him seriously before but that quote is priceless.

Especially because after I embarrassed Gmaxwell upthread on the technical points, now I am going to embarrass you guys with some facts (but I realize your AGW religion ignores facts):

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.14688442

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.14660362
newbie
Activity: 28
Merit: 0
May 11, 2016, 07:29:39 AM
But fine, go ahead and give credence to Chicken Little.  It's not the first time he's gone off on some half baked rant about how we're all doomed and it certainly won't be the last time that he's been completely wrong about it.  Credibility.  Equals.  Zero.

The paid propagandists such as DooMAD will come here...

We are always being turned against each other and take our eyes off the true source of the our problems.

DooMAD I don't know how you can look at yourself in the mirror.

...One for each personality disorder you suffer from?) likely to contain unrealistic and purely hypothetical scenarios that may be closer to fiction than any semblance of reality, along with false logic and copious amounts of clutching at straws.

Please do continue to destroy yourselves with your socialist delusions, while the Minsky Moment of global collapse approaches:

2018 Kaboom!

https://www.docdroid.net/file/download/i3f8uVF/stanley-druckenmiller-the-end-game.pdf (<-- see page 7)

http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21698240-it-question-when-not-if-real-trouble-will-hit-china-coming-debt-bust

With fondest memories Roll Eyes of your banned spiritual leader who I hope was hit by door on his way out.

Butt is a bit sore, but it is from sitting in the programming chair 18 hours a day.

Oh and remember during 2013 to 2015, I was sharing the predictions of Martin Armstrong which called for a massive lurch towards global clusterfuck on 2015.75 (Sept 30/Oct 1 2015), we'll the prediction was entirely correct (click the following Quote to read more):

[...]

Something important does always happen on the ECM turn dates. For example:

1. On March 13/14 2016, the deadcat bounce of Baltic Sea index (measure of the world's trade activity) rolled over and started to decline again.

2. On 2015.75, was precisely the event that began WW3 and the stage of the conflict that sent the migrants invading Europe:

Putin invaded Syria precisely on September 30, 2015, which was to the day of 2015.75. That warned that whatever takes place right on the day becomes the main focus. Putin then withdrew precisely on pi day. So what is taking place from the Middle East will break the back of Europe economically as governments seek to raise taxes to pay for the pretend “refugees” as well as extremists who have infiltrated Europe and destabilized its borders and security. This is unwinding the entire freedom of movement within Europe which was the cornerstone of the EU concept. With borders resurfacing, Brussels begins its decline.

Even 9/11 took place right on our pi target from the peak in the ECM. This is starting to demonstrate that there is, in fact, a cycle to this type of activity that is following the 8.6 frequency. The Madrid attack on the train was March 11, 2004, or 2004.19. If we project target dates from the USA 9/11 incident, we arrive at 2004.16, which was March 1 or 10 days earlier before the attack. We have been running various terrorist attacks through our models. The list is indeed long (see Wikipedia). Nonetheless, it appears that certain groups do fall into unique cycle frequencies. This appears to enable one to determine which group was behind what.

2002.780 Indonesia Bali Oct 12, 2002
2002.810 Moscow October 23, 2002
2003.372 Morocco, Casablanca May 16, 2003
2003.361 Riyadh Saudi Arabia May 12, 2003
2003.887 Turkey, Istanbul November 20, 2003
2004.191 Madrid March 11, 2004
2004.668 Beslan, Russia September 1 – 3, 2004


Let’s face the facts. The Economic Confidence Model works with such precision it is often mind-numbing. This is monitoring human activity as a coherent, collective economic entity of “civilization” that materializes by people coming together. I suppose it makes sense that we are influenced collectively to respond with a cyclical rhythm. It appears the same is reflected in terrorist activity.

3. From my March, 2009 essay:

I don't know if anyone else has commented already, that Martin Armstrong's "It Is Just Time" prediction made back in October 2008, for a major turn event on March 19, nailed the exact day (after) the Fed announced to start buying government bonds directly.

He had also predicted ahead of time the turn that coincided with the peak in the precious metals prices last March 2008.

Google "Martin Armstrong", for the remarkable story about how accurate his computer model predictions have been, and him being in the maximum security prison without a trial, together with the Shoe Bomber and the Unibomber, alledgedly because of his unwillingness to share his model with the CIA.
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1072
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.
May 11, 2016, 07:18:54 AM
Bitcoin is basically destroyed now with 70% of the mining controlled by China, soon to be 98+%, and with Blockstream implementing their SegWit soft fork Trojan Horse so as Matonis admits can end up increasing the 21 million coins limit.

The entire ecosystem is headed for a clusterfuck.

I honestly believe this is the truth.  What is there to add ?

~CfA~



BitcoinObituaries.com   Cry
newbie
Activity: 28
Merit: 0
May 11, 2016, 07:04:56 AM
Does anyone agree or disagree with this presumption of mine?

Of course I disagree with it, otherwise I wouldn't own any Bitcoin.  The marginal cost over time of Bitcoin shows an ever increasing percent being energy costs.  This means sha256d will likely be commoditized.  There is no Chinese monopoly after that happens.

r0ach I like you, but you wrote nonsense.

Amazing to me that you still don't understand why Satoshi's design will always centralize.

One crucial point you are not getting your mind wrapped around, is that the need to set a block size to control the level of transaction fees earned, is a power vacuum that forces an oligarchy to take control over the mining. ArticMine and I had explained that in great detail. I also I summarized that point again in the "Bitcoin IS basically DESTROYED" thread.

Orthogonal to the prior paragraph, you also don't seem to understand that commoditization and leveling the access to ASICs can't stop the centralization and concentration of Bitcoin mining into an eventual oligarchy of a dozen or so ASIC mining farms. Even if we assume that ASIC mining farms in China don't enjoy an unfair advantage due to ostensibly receiving State subsidized cheap (or free) electricity due to corruption, the centralization of Satoshi's profitable proof-of-work design remains inexorable and unavoidable (and regardless of geographical location of its occurrence). I had already explained why in great technical detail in the my decentralization and your "Satoshi didn't solve the BGP" threads, and here follows an incomplete summary quoted from the "Bitcoin IS basically DESTROYED" thread:

Most of these Chinese mining firms are pools, so like most pools that are extremely big, if they get too big, miners will hop to a different one.

It isn't just the pools that are the problem, but that the mining farms are large and concentrating the 51+% amongst a few oligarchs. This will only grow more centralized over time, because TPTB_need_war explained in his technical analysis, that profitable proof-of-work always accrues over time to maximum economies-of-scale. There are several reasons for that including propagation advantages of being the first to win more blocks, so don't waste hashrate mining on the wrong fork for a short period, which over time gradually depletes the other miners of relative profits. It is more complex than that. You need to read his entire analysis to understand.


From the beginning, this has always been a possibility: A banker who can effectively create unlimited fiat money can easily acquire all the mining infrastructure and control the network hash power (Of course he don't need to do so through one single entity, it will look like that many people control the mining infrastructure, but when a vote happens people will discover that over 90% of hash power is controlled by a few entity and can go against majority of people's will)

PoW method is vulnerable to large capital taking over. This is the nature of PoW, so some people have suggested to use a PoW+PoS hybrid model for the future mining, but without major hash power, how do you implement this change into the network? Why miners should give up their dominance power today? It seems only a fork or re-design of a new coin can start afresh

There are several technical factors you need to take into account. For example, the greater the hashrate (of the pool if not solo mining), the more often the miner is mining on the block that won't be orphaned. The propagation delay of block announcements (or any group with 33+% of the hashrate colluding to delay block announcements, which was explained the research paper Majority is not Enough: Bitcoin Mining is Vulnerable), means that those with more hashrate are more profitable given the same unitized hardware and electricity costs. Ditto that every miner (or pool) has the same cost of validation regardless of their hashrate. This means that even if everything is fair and equal, naturally over time the mining will centralize to an oligarchy. This is a property of profitable proof-of-work and there is nothing that can be done to fix it. TPTB_need_war made an entire thread about this to discuss it in detail. The flaws of proof-of-stake are also discussed in that thread and I urge Minecache and others not to turn this thread into a PoS vs. PoW discussion. Bring the PoS vs. PoW debate over to that other thread, other such thread if you want to debate that.

What TPTB_need_war concluded is that the only design that can remain economically decentralized is UNprofitable proof-of-work. This means that every spender would send some PoW share with each transaction. The details are complex and it can't work the same as Satoshi's design. Most of the details are already explained in various posts that TPTB_need_war has made spread out over many different threads. But he is not implementing this design right now, because he is busy on the other programming priorities I mentioned.

Any way, there is no solution to that will remain immune to the fact that humans are manipulated like a herd when it comes to politics. And they are lazy. And they are easily duped by the elite. So even if TPTB_need_war implements his solution, it is likely that the people will still end up sending their PoW shares to an oligarchy of "pools" even though unprofitable PoW means no one gains by using a pool. People are just dumb. But we might have a fighting chance with this redesign of Satoshi's flawed design. Many people have criticized this UNprofitable PoW thinking it won't work because there is not the proper incentives and Nash equilibirum. TPTB_need_war says they are wrong and he will eventually publish a whitepaper to better explain all the details.

I don't know where we will end up with all this. But my guess is the elite will win and the people will lose. But some people are working on hard. Please don't disrespect TPTB_need_war. His is working as furiously as he can, and no one helps him. Maybe one day he will get some assistance and be recognized for his efforts. But he doesn't care! He is doing what he is doing as a labor of love and because he loves the challenge.




Of course, China being the top producers of Bitcoin isn't even a Bitcoin problem in the first place.  It's a symptom of China controlling manufacturing for everything on earth as corporations use their slaves for global labor arbitrage.

China being the current location of the centralization and concentration of Bitcoin mining is irrelevant to the point that profitable proof-of-work will always centralize into an oligarchy and thus offers us no long-term advantage to remove the evils and risks we normally have with fiat. The powers-that-be will be able to enforce capital controls even more effectively on Bitcoin transactions with the oligarchy control over mining, as compared to cash fiat transactions. So don't assume your Bitcoin can't be confiscated by the government. With control over the protocol with the oligarchy on mining, the powers-that-be can do what ever they wish. If the masses who are using Bitcoin don't stop using Bitcoin, then no one will be able to stop the-powers-that-be from doing what they want to Bitcoin's protocol given the oligarchy control over mining. No rational person is arguing that Bitcoin will stop functioning or that the price will collapse to 0 (although the chance of that happen does exist but quite small chance), but rather we are saying that Bitcoin as a decentralized asset which could be relied on as being impervious to control by any one, is "basically destroyed". All the clueless n00bs (or disingenuous trolls) who build strawmen arguments accusing of us saying that Bitcoin is destroyed and won't function, are just inane arguments which deflect the focus away from our factual point about the aspect of Bitcoin that is actually destroyed.

What Europe typically did in the past was cancel the fiat currency quite often, as way to force the existing cash under mattresses to come back to the banks for exchanging to the newly issued currency, wherein the State could confiscate most of it. At least we always had gold as a money that the government couldn't cancel, but now the pervasive "Big T false flag" police state spreading all over the globe means one can't even transport gold any more without it at great risk of being confiscated under the false allegation of money laundering or terrorism.

We are headed into a clusterfucked world. I sure hope you all stop deluding yourselves.
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
May 11, 2016, 04:58:41 AM
What is wrong with bitcoin. It has not been destroyed but just died like 90 times. It is still not gone corrupt or anything like that. I like bitcoin as it is and i believe it is not destroyed.
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