This position was eventually closed at $15.88 on the second dip with a handsome profit (No way was I going to pull a meelba
) My only regret? Not shorting more. 
Topic: Bitcoin is the most dangerous item to short. (Read 4505 times)
I must disagree with this topic! I like to think of shorting as a sort of "checks and balances" system for keeping the overwhelming exuberance in check
This position was eventually closed at $15.88 on the second dip with a handsome profit (No way was I going to pull a meelba ) My only regret? Not shorting more.
This position was eventually closed at $15.88 on the second dip with a handsome profit (No way was I going to pull a meelba
) My only regret? Not shorting more. 
The amount of circle jerking ITT is gargantuan. 
If you are holding any other assets and not in bitcoins you are by definition short bitcoins.
No you are not. Shorting is being lent an asset and selling it (to buy it at lower price later and give back to lender).
Thnx for the lesson in trading terminology ...
... short is also used to mean "not long".
when you say short bitcoin when you are not holding it, you were use bitcoin as benchmark, in that way, yes, you are shorting bitcoins by not long.
Your underlying assumption is natural position is holding all your assets in bitcoin.
... and we have a winner.
The guy who is obsessed with mucus and nasal emissions must have pulled out some brains at some point I think.
Measuring your worth in bitcoins should be the new norm for anybody who is serious about this little experiment .... all others are short by definition ... there are no 'neutral' positions, that is a fallacy peddled by fiat-meisters, all assets are in play. All wealth assets are measured with respect to something else, when you can realise that you have begun your journey to wealth and understanding money.
Being "in" dollars is the same thing to being long dollars and being in bitcoin is the same thing as being short dollars, there is no difference (some quibble about leverage but leverage of 1 is still short). If you sell any asset you are a natural short since if you were to ever buy that asset back again you would either gain or lose on the round-trip, so all trades include a long and a short component, it is inescapable.
^ this makes perfect sense.
Well not really. That would be neutral or no position. Short is when you owe bitcoins that you do not actually own, with options or protection. (I am not saying that options or protection currently exist)
short != leveraged all short means is selling with intention to buy back lower (cover)
shorting with leverage is what your talking about
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short_%28finance%29
Adam, check your own link. Shortselling indeed means selling to cover at lower price, but from the starting point of a neutral position (owning nothing of the asset).
Just check the schematic, there isn't a "Lender" and "Share borrowing" part there for nothing.
I sold bitcoins yesterday on 12€, placed an order to buy at 10.7
There's my bet.
There's my bet.
ouch
If you are holding any other assets and not in bitcoins you are by definition short bitcoins.
No you are not. Shorting is being lent an asset and selling it (to buy it at lower price later and give back to lender).
Thnx for the lesson in trading terminology ...
... short is also used to mean "not long".
when you say short bitcoin when you are not holding it, you were use bitcoin as benchmark, in that way, yes, you are shorting bitcoins by not long.
Your underlying assumption is natural position is holding all your assets in bitcoin.
... and we have a winner.
The guy who is obsessed with mucus and nasal emissions must have pulled out some brains at some point I think.
You got me
(Actually it's the color of the planetexpress spaceship, but nevermind)
The rest of your post is for what it's worth a compelling piece of work, but when it comes down to it propaganda and has nothing to do with the correct term for shorting.
You can only be short by selling, saying that you are "short" bitcoin with money you didn't get by selling bitcoin is ridiculous.
That's like saying I am also short strawberries because I haven't invested all my money in strawberries.
Even further being short is commonly refereed to selling a borrowed asset, nobody uses the term for something else, look around.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short_%28finance%29
Quote
The potential loss on a short sale is theoretically unlimited in the event of an unlimited rise in the price of the instrument, however in practice the short seller will be required to post margin or collateral to cover losses, and any inability to do so on a timely basis would cause its broker or counterparty to liquidate the position.
That's only possible with a borrowed asset.
If you are holding any other assets and not in bitcoins you are by definition short bitcoins.
No you are not. Shorting is being lent an asset and selling it (to buy it at lower price later and give back to lender).
Thnx for the lesson in trading terminology ...
... short is also used to mean "not long".
when you say short bitcoin when you are not holding it, you were use bitcoin as benchmark, in that way, yes, you are shorting bitcoins by not long.
Your underlying assumption is natural position is holding all your assets in bitcoin.
... and we have a winner.
The guy who is obsessed with mucus and nasal emissions must have pulled out some brains at some point I think.
Measuring your worth in bitcoins should be the new norm for anybody who is serious about this little experiment .... all others are short by definition ... there are no 'neutral' positions, that is a fallacy peddled by fiat-meisters, all assets are in play. All wealth assets are measured with respect to something else, when you can realise that you have begun your journey to wealth and understanding money.
Being "in" dollars is the same thing to being long dollars and being in bitcoin is the same thing as being short dollars, there is no difference (some quibble about leverage but leverage of 1 is still short). If you sell any asset you are a natural short since if you were to ever buy that asset back again you would either gain or lose on the round-trip, so all trades include a long and a short component, it is inescapable.
You just blew my mind. I learned more in those 2 paragraphs than I have in the past week of my life. I need to go read some more trading websites.
If you are holding any other assets and not in bitcoins you are by definition short bitcoins.
No you are not. Shorting is being lent an asset and selling it (to buy it at lower price later and give back to lender).
Thnx for the lesson in trading terminology ...
... short is also used to mean "not long".
when you say short bitcoin when you are not holding it, you were use bitcoin as benchmark, in that way, yes, you are shorting bitcoins by not long.
Your underlying assumption is natural position is holding all your assets in bitcoin.
... and we have a winner.
The guy who is obsessed with mucus and nasal emissions must have pulled out some brains at some point I think.
Measuring your worth in bitcoins should be the new norm for anybody who is serious about this little experiment .... all others are short by definition ... there are no 'neutral' positions, that is a fallacy peddled by fiat-meisters, all assets are in play. All wealth assets are measured with respect to something else, when you can realise that you have begun your journey to wealth and understanding money.
Being "in" dollars is the same thing to being long dollars and being in bitcoin is the same thing as being short dollars, there is no difference (some quibble about leverage but leverage of 1 is still short). If you sell any asset you are a natural short since if you were to ever buy that asset back again you would either gain or lose on the round-trip, so all trades include a long and a short component, it is inescapable.
Looks like the buyers have more cold blood
Not that my holdings amount to much, but I have to say that I completely wrote off my 'investment' the moment I got my coins. I consider the fiat money I paid for them dead and gone.
Cold blood? More like liquid nitrogen.
I mean, what do I have to lose? Some Monopoly money which was going to inflate out of control anyway? I pay more for car repairs!
Edit: In fact, the only reason I would 'cash out' would be to buy an asset, like a house or property, which I could not buy with bitcoin. Silver? Gold? All good! All I need is to get paid in btc and I would never touch a dollar again except to buy groceries!
Edit2: The only reason I don't keep all of my assets in btc is because of it's volatility. If it ever levels off or keeps a steady growth rate I will keep a majority of my funds in btc.
i always took the term short to mean that you were selling something you didn't have..
or in other words, a person selling BTC, even though he is "short" on the coins to do it...
or in other words, a person selling BTC, even though he is "short" on the coins to do it...
That is also the correct use, people who are telling otherwise are pulling stuff out of their noses.
i always took the term short to mean that you were selling something you didn't have..
or in other words, a person selling BTC, even though he is "short" on the coins to do it...
or in other words, a person selling BTC, even though he is "short" on the coins to do it...
If you are holding any other assets and not in bitcoins you are by definition short bitcoins.
No you are not. Shorting is being lent an asset and selling it (to buy it at lower price later and give back to lender).
Thnx for the lesson in trading terminology ...
... short is also used to mean "not long".
Well not really. That would be neutral or no position. Short is when you owe bitcoins that you do not actually own, with options or protection. (I am not saying that options or protection currently exist)
all short means is selling with intention to buy back lower (cover)
shorting with leverage is what your talking about
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short_%28finance%29
If you short, you are naturally in a leverage position, since short generate additional asset (by selling the item you short), and liability (to return the item back), so if you are not leveraged before, you total asset is your total net asset (equity), after the short, you total asset /you net asset (equity) is bigger than 1.
Accumulating debt is leveraging
If you are holding any other assets and not in bitcoins you are by definition short bitcoins.
No you are not. Shorting is being lent an asset and selling it (to buy it at lower price later and give back to lender).
Thnx for the lesson in trading terminology ...
... short is also used to mean "not long".
Well not really. That would be neutral or no position. Short is when you owe bitcoins that you do not actually own, with options or protection. (I am not saying that options or protection currently exist)
all short means is selling with intention to buy back lower (cover)
shorting with leverage is what your talking about
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short_%28finance%29
If you are holding any other assets and not in bitcoins you are by definition short bitcoins.
No you are not. Shorting is being lent an asset and selling it (to buy it at lower price later and give back to lender).
Thnx for the lesson in trading terminology ...
... short is also used to mean "not long".
Well not really. That would be neutral or no position. Short is when you owe bitcoins that you do not actually own, with options or protection. (I am not saying that options or protection currently exist)
If you are holding any other assets and not in bitcoins you are by definition short bitcoins.
No you are not. Shorting is being lent an asset and selling it (to buy it at lower price later and give back to lender).
Thnx for the lesson in trading terminology ...
... short is also used to mean "not long".
when you say short bitcoin when you are not holding it, you were use bitcoin as benchmark, in that way, yes, you are shorting bitcoins by not long.
Your underlying assumption is natural position is holding all your assets in bitcoin.
Actually it means short selling since the term "short" means levering a trade using credit. You can be short BTC or Short USD for example.
Long means you do not use credit in your position. So by definition somebody who does not own BTC but has USD is long USD.
If you buy BTC on mtgox and withdraw them you are long BTC.
Long means you do not use credit in your position. So by definition somebody who does not own BTC but has USD is long USD.
If you buy BTC on mtgox and withdraw them you are long BTC.
... short is also used to mean "not long".
Yeah, and "a Ponzi scheme" is also used to describe bitcoin. Doesn't make it right though.
If you are holding any other assets and not in bitcoins you are by definition short bitcoins.
No you are not. Shorting is being lent an asset and selling it (to buy it at lower price later and give back to lender).
Thnx for the lesson in trading terminology ...
... short is also used to mean "not long".
If you are holding any other assets and not in bitcoins you are by definition short bitcoins.
No you are not. Shorting is being lent an asset and selling it (to buy it at lower price later and give back to lender).
If you are holding any other assets and not in bitcoins you are by definition short bitcoins.
Just by holding US dollar cash last year you lost 160% by not being in bitcoin.
Just by holding US dollar cash last year you lost 160% by not being in bitcoin.
Jump to: