Bitcoin isn't complicated but the fiat system is! - page 2.

Reatim

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Quote from: Findingnemo on June 28, 2024, 12:28:34 PM

I just want to show this to whoever says Bitcoin technology is too complicated for a common man and then ask them to explain this which they have been using day to day and whether any of 'em got any idea what is going on behind their preferred method Cheesy

To be fair no common probably knows all this. But they think of fiat as less complicated because it is what’s commonly used. It seems pretty straightforward. Money from bank, money to spend.

But of course it is more than that but a common man does not see any use for knowing all the other details. With crypto, they say it’s complicated because they can’t understand where exactly it’s coming from. Their mindset is that “money is paper so how is crypto money if there’s no paper?”.

They just need to listen and focus and I am sure they will get it eventually

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Quote from: Z-tight on July 01, 2024, 10:11:20 AM

The truth is that BTC technology is complicated to a lot of people, and that is why many people choose not to use it. In order to use BTC, you have to be responsible for your own coins, and many people do not want that, they don't want to store their seed phrase and they fear that being in control of their funds is a scary proposition.

There might be a lot of things about the fiat system that so many people do not understand, but who cares, they keep their money in the bank and allow the bank secure it for them, they simply understand all that they really need to know. However, with BTC i believe even the basic thing isn't easy for a lot of people, i.e. setting an appropriate fee rate for their tx.

I think fiat and BTC can never compete because the biggest difference between fiat money and BTC is that fiat money can be used by uneducated people but BTC can't. While BTC requires education and experience, there are no such requirements or difficulties for fiat money. Also, fiat money is used to buy daily things and not BTC.

Yes, it can be said that those who keep money in fiat should buy BTC instead if they are aware of BTC because the money kept in the bank cannot give as much profit as the BTC can. You buy BTC and can keep the BTC for the future as BTC has proven from its past that every year BTC price goes higher. From now on, BTC will only give profit to its users, so instead of keeping it in banks, BTC should be bought and kept.

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Quote from: Abiky on July 04, 2024, 07:56:44 PM

Improving user experience is key for mainstream adoption of Bitcoin. It should only be a matter of time before BTC becomes easy enough to use as Fiat for day-to-day payments. Some wallets already set optimum network fees when sending BTC. They even have an attractive GUI. So there's been some progress after all. But you'd still need some sort of technical knowledge to avoid sending coins to the wrong address or securing your funds against hacks or theft.

Good luck explaining to the average Joe:
- that when he pays with two inputs he must pay twice in fees, like when paying with two $10 bills you're charged more than when paying with a $20, oh wait...
- explain to the average Joe why he should pay the fee when his card is free
- explain that if something gets wrong with his coins there is no support number

Average Joe will not use decentralized Bitcoin, he will use still a centralized solution if he is forced to, and by then the picture for BTC will look just like the one for Fiat. Harsh and not the reality we want, but it's reality nonetheless!

Quote from: Iranus on July 05, 2024, 04:36:19 AM

Yes, it is only a matter of time and we should not be too hasty because in comparison, bitcoin is only 15 years old while fiat money is hundreds of years old.

Fiat money is 50 years old, paper money is hundreds of years old!

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Quote from: Abiky on July 04, 2024, 07:56:44 PM

Quote from: Iranus on July 04, 2024, 06:44:34 AM

Both bitcoin and fiat are complicated if we dig deeper into how they work, but fiat has been used for thousands of years and is supported by governments, banks, and thousands of different services that make its use easier than ever. Meanwhile, bitcoin is a decentralized currency, we have to preserve and store it ourselves, which makes it difficult for many people because they are used to depending on and receiving support from organizations such as banks.

The difference I see in both is new and old, and in my opinion, over time bitcoin will gradually become more familiar to people and we will no longer hear anyone complaining that bitcoin is complicated.

Improving user experience is key for mainstream adoption of Bitcoin. It should only be a matter of time before BTC becomes easy enough to use as Fiat for day-to-day payments. Some wallets already set optimum network fees when sending BTC. They even have an attractive GUI. So there's been some progress after all. But you'd still need some sort of technical knowledge to avoid sending coins to the wrong address or securing your funds against hacks or theft. This only applies for non-custodial wallets. Centralized wallets (managed by a custodian) are much easier to use, though.

I hope someday major countries adopt BTC as legal tender. That would reduce Fiat's dominance by a large margin. Despite Bitcoin's promise to bring financial freedom, we should never expect it to replace Fiat. Governments don't want to lose power/control over the economy, right? Cheesy

I believe that once governments legalize bitcoin and allow people to use it widely, user experience improvements will soon be implemented. Yes, it is only a matter of time and we should not be too hasty because in comparison, bitcoin is only 15 years old while fiat money is hundreds of years old. So don't be surprised or blame anyone if they say bitcoin is more complicated than fiat currency.

I seriously doubt the government will legalize bitcoin as a currency to reduce fiat dominance. Because fiat money represents government dominance, they control us through fiat money so I don't think that can happen.

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Quote from: Z-tight on July 01, 2024, 10:11:20 AM

The truth is that BTC technology is complicated to a lot of people, and that is why many people choose not to use it. In order to use BTC, you have to be responsible for your own coins, and many people do not want that, they don't want to store their seed phrase and they fear that being in control of their funds is a scary proposition.
(...)

It makes sense, this is what people mean about being complicated, unlike the fiat system.
For some people, it's easy to understand and use Bitcoin, but we can't really blame other people who having difficulty and are against it.
Because at the end of the day, it will be up to them if they will use Bitcoin or not.

Abiky

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Quote from: Iranus on July 04, 2024, 06:44:34 AM

Both bitcoin and fiat are complicated if we dig deeper into how they work, but fiat has been used for thousands of years and is supported by governments, banks, and thousands of different services that make its use easier than ever. Meanwhile, bitcoin is a decentralized currency, we have to preserve and store it ourselves, which makes it difficult for many people because they are used to depending on and receiving support from organizations such as banks.

The difference I see in both is new and old, and in my opinion, over time bitcoin will gradually become more familiar to people and we will no longer hear anyone complaining that bitcoin is complicated.

Improving user experience is key for mainstream adoption of Bitcoin. It should only be a matter of time before BTC becomes easy enough to use as Fiat for day-to-day payments. Some wallets already set optimum network fees when sending BTC. They even have an attractive GUI. So there's been some progress after all. But you'd still need some sort of technical knowledge to avoid sending coins to the wrong address or securing your funds against hacks or theft. This only applies for non-custodial wallets. Centralized wallets (managed by a custodian) are much easier to use, though.

I hope someday major countries adopt BTC as legal tender. That would reduce Fiat's dominance by a large margin. Despite Bitcoin's promise to bring financial freedom, we should never expect it to replace Fiat. Governments don't want to lose power/control over the economy, right? Cheesy

Iranus

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Both bitcoin and fiat are complicated if we dig deeper into how they work, but fiat has been used for thousands of years and is supported by governments, banks, and thousands of different services that make its use easier than ever. Meanwhile, bitcoin is a decentralized currency, we have to preserve and store it ourselves, which makes it difficult for many people because they are used to depending on and receiving support from organizations such as banks.

The difference I see in both is new and old, and in my opinion, over time bitcoin will gradually become more familiar to people and we will no longer hear anyone complaining that bitcoin is complicated.

Abiky

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Quote from: BALIK on July 01, 2024, 10:04:06 AM

El Salvador has accepted bitcoin as legal tender but they still use USD as their main currency, moreover I see them focusing on investing in bitcoin rather than promoting and encouraging people to use bitcoin instead of USD as the main currency.

I believe that all countries in the world will have to accept and legalize bitcoin but that does not mean they will accept it as legal tender and eliminate fiat currency. Don't forget that governments are controlling and managing us through fiat, if they abolish fiat how will they control us? So, the scenario where governments will legalize bitcoin and the fiat era ends is highly unlikely.

Exactly. The very countries embracing the Bitcoin revolution, are the ones still stuck with the "Fiat Standard". This won't change anytime soon. Especially when governments don't want to lose control/power over the economy. They might as well build CBDCs on top of Bitcoin, than use BTC as a replacement for Fiat. At least we know Bitcoin (and crypto) is the future of money.

The world economy will change drastically in the future. Central banks will use Bitcoin's core blockchain technology for their own digital Fiat currencies (otherwise known as CBDCs). They won't lose. The ones that will be losing are people like you and me. Bitcoin promises to bring true financial freedom. But with CEXs and institutional investment companies dominating the market, BTC would be subject to the wills of the government. If such entity prohibits people from buying/selling BTC or even using it, it'll be game over for good. I have a feeling "hyperbitcoinization" will be a long and distant dream.

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Quote from: Findingnemo on June 28, 2024, 12:28:34 PM

I just want to show this to whoever says Bitcoin technology is too complicated for a common man and then ask them to explain this which they have been using day to day and whether any of 'em got any idea what is going on behind their preferred method Cheesy

The only thing fiat has over bitcoin right now is that the "reversible" thing. Because it is decentralized, when you send some coins to someone then it's gone and that's it, there is nothing that you can do to fix it. However, if you do end up doing something like that in fiat, like you sent the money but then things didn't go as planned, there are ways to get the money back.

This is why shopping with bitcoin is so hard, specially online because you could pay someone some money and they could just end up with stealing it from you and in the coin world you just can't do anything else, whereas if you do end up with same thing at fiat, you just do chargeback and call your bank and you get your money back eventually without an issue.

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I suppose it comes down people being creatures of comfort. Generally once people are used to something or to doing something in a particular way, it is difficult to show them a new way.

When Bitcoin was introduced in 2009 it did not bring people in masses from all age and educational demographics then and it is not doing it now either though year-on-year number are increasing. Today people using Bitcoin (or their preferred crypto) are increasing in numbers across all age and educational demographics but in comparison to those that use fiat, it is in such a minority that working out percentages will be difficult.

Z-tight

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The truth is that BTC technology is complicated to a lot of people, and that is why many people choose not to use it. In order to use BTC, you have to be responsible for your own coins, and many people do not want that, they don't want to store their seed phrase and they fear that being in control of their funds is a scary proposition.

There might be a lot of things about the fiat system that so many people do not understand, but who cares, they keep their money in the bank and allow the bank secure it for them, they simply understand all that they really need to know. However, with BTC i believe even the basic thing isn't easy for a lot of people, i.e. setting an appropriate fee rate for their tx.

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Quote from: Abiky on July 01, 2024, 08:29:28 AM

-snip
I wonder if other countries will adopt BTC as legal tender the same way El Salvador did? If a large number of countries adopt BTC, Fiat's days will be over. Just you wait and see.

El Salvador has accepted bitcoin as legal tender but they still use USD as their main currency, moreover I see them focusing on investing in bitcoin rather than promoting and encouraging people to use bitcoin instead of USD as the main currency.

I believe that all countries in the world will have to accept and legalize bitcoin but that does not mean they will accept it as legal tender and eliminate fiat currency. Don't forget that governments are controlling and managing us through fiat, if they abolish fiat how will they control us? So, the scenario where governments will legalize bitcoin and the fiat era ends is highly unlikely.

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Quote from: Findingnemo on June 28, 2024, 12:28:34 PM

While I was scrolling Reddit one post caught my eyes

Bitcoin is too complicated" ~US Dollar user

_{*you may have to download and zoom in to get in details}

I just want to show this to whoever says Bitcoin technology is too complicated for a common man and then ask them to explain this which they have been using day to day and whether any of 'em got any idea what is going on behind their preferred method Cheesy

It's bitcoin's technology that's complicated, cause for the average joe it combines what you cannot understand simply with computer science and engineering, as well as the hardest parts of economics into a single school of thought.

Understanding how bitcoin works economically comes easy to a majority of us cause hey, we've been using it since time immemorial, but ask a random bitcoin user if they know what SHA-256 is, or how mining works, as well as why scalability isn't going to be a thing in this industry and watch as their brains collapse upon itself and turn into a black hole.

You can't blame and condemn people for not knowing something on an atomic level, and you can't make people stop condemning something just cause they don't know it. Liking something, bitcoin in particular should come naturally to the person, else they'll end up nothing but a spiteful rat when they lose all their money aping on shit they shouldn't ape at.

Abiky

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Quote from: Findingnemo on June 28, 2024, 12:28:34 PM

While I was scrolling Reddit one post caught my eyes

_{*you may have to download and zoom in to get in details}

I just want to show this to whoever says Bitcoin technology is too complicated for a common man and then ask them to explain this which they have been using day to day and whether any of 'em got any idea what is going on behind their preferred method Cheesy

In technical terms, Bitcoin is much more complicated than Fiat. It will be hard for someone new to understand how BTC works (setting optimum network fees, avoiding sending coins to the wrong address, backing up seeds/keys, etc). With Fiat, sending/receiving payments is a breeze. I mean if that's what you mean by "complicated".

Believe me, things will get better for Bitcoin as developers continue to improve UX. It won't be long enough before sending/receiving BTC would be as easy as sending/receiving an email. We just need to give it a little more time. It won't be going anywhere, especially when it's the one coin that started it all.

With "Wall Street" now in the game, BTC will only go higher both in market price and mainstream adoption. I wonder if other countries will adopt BTC as legal tender the same way El Salvador did? If a large number of countries adopt BTC, Fiat's days will be over. Just you wait and see.

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Quote from: Doan9269 on June 28, 2024, 04:51:05 PM

There's no complications in bitcoin except those that have found it difficult to comprehend on learning new things, there's nothing heard from understanding what bitcoin is and how we can as well join from the way we see it, bitcoin is what others should see as the simplest thing to do because it will be the tyoe that can help change someone's story for good and not to use it as money, but through it, we can comfortably discover the way bitcoin is meant for others, fiat system is more complicated because it's being controlled by central

Bitcoin will only be complicated for those who are not open about bitcoin education, thinking that it will always be difficult for them to use and spend it for daily basis unlike fiat wherein they are born using that. However, for those who are always hunger for new technology, just like bitcoin, instead of seeing it as quite difficult and complicated, it turned out that they get more excited and interested using its new innovation. There is really nothing that we can’t learn from bitcoin, as long as the eagerness and motivation is present, and patience of course who will help you learn immensely.

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Quote from: Findingnemo on June 28, 2024, 12:28:34 PM

While I was scrolling Reddit one post caught my eyes

Bitcoin is too complicated" ~US Dollar user

_{*you may have to download and zoom in to get in details}

I just want to show this to whoever says Bitcoin technology is too complicated for a common man and then ask them to explain this which they have been using day to day and whether any of 'em got any idea what is going on behind their preferred method Cheesy

This is a great image, however it's a little confusing how the Tether stable coin is included in the chart. It would really be great if it only included fiat based systems. I guess the thing is though, as much as this chart tries to capture the complexity of the US dollar monetary system, there are so many other connections that are not covered, just because of the complexity and unknown unknowns involved.

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Quote from: re-start on June 29, 2024, 02:29:04 AM

In my opinion, the fiat system has many complications that ordinary people do not know about. We have only used the fiat system since we were born and most of us don't know about this system and how they control it. But Bitcoin is a new payment system and people are curious about it, and I believe that in the coming years, the blockchain and bitcoin system will destroy the fiat system.

How will Bitcoin destroy the fiat currency system? Do you think governments accept and legalize bitcoin only to destroy the fiat currency system they have built for thousands of years? Is the government that stupid?

While we are bitcoin investors and always want it to become popular worldwide, we also need to be realistic and not spread misleading narratives between bitcoin and governments. Don't exaggerate unnecessarily about bitcoin and don't make governments hate bitcoin more just because we spread false rumors. If you have ever read bitcoin's whitepaper, you will know that Satoshi created bitcoin not to replace or destroy the current monetary system.

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Oh yes, I've seen this image or a similar one before, and since then I regularly point out that fiat is not simpler than Bitcoin. What is simpler is usage, but that's something that can be simplified and sometimes is simplified with Bitcoin, albeit at a cost of decentralization. But fiat doesn't have decentralization and that doesn't seem to bother most people. So Bitcoin can be similar to fiat in that regard.

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I think the part where it is being talked about as complicated is very different from how and what it is used for.

For a non-tech savvy person, you would really be overwhelmed with how bitcoin is used and just sending it requires a lot of things like Wallet, Internet connection, Address that you are going to send to. I really think it is complicated for people who aren’t really exposed to that.

As for the dollars, Fiat system, It is really easy. You just have to give the cash and then minus the difference from what you are buying or something.

I’m not saying that bitcoin hasn’t been converted into something easier but in general it is complicated compared to just using cash.

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The Fiat system is easy to understand because we don't need to use gadgets but bitcoin does which makes any person who doesn't have a good background about how new technology works will definitely say, I prefer fiat. In fact, in my country, even when using ATMs still a lot of people don't know, they ask for assistance from others. That is much more if the system is not the system we have known since childhood.

Maybe for this young generation, it was easy for them as they are exposed already but I'd never see this as adaptable to the oldies people, they certainly take what they understand fully rather than learning new things. And I expect mixed opinions from people as it depends on their current situation and adaptability.

Topic: Bitcoin isn't complicated but the fiat system is! - page 2. (Read 629 times)