Topic: Bitcoin kwoledge is not complete without bitcoin investment - page 14. (Read 3346 times)

People are now more aware than ever when it comes to investing in Bitcoin. Whatever they do, they will try to keep even a small amount of bitcoins in their wallets. Because Bitcoin is not universally accepted by the government, but it is universally accepted by the public. Bitcoin is now going to be the best of all the valuable assets in the world. You have taken a good decision in both cases one is for long term investment you have started using a secure wallet and on the other hand as the market is volatile you have chosen DCA for accumulating bitcoin which can give you a big profit after a long period of time. Since you are also engaged in a job, there will be no obstacle to collect your bitcoins with your house rent ‍so definitely You will get better returns from Bitcoin than others.

You and I are using the term shitcoin and altcoin differently.  I consider anything that is not bitcoin (that has its own token) to be a shitcoin.. so from my consideration altcoin and shitcoin is the same thing... if you are trying to differentiate between how shitty or not are various shitcoins based on their price performance or some other broadly applicable principles, you are likely just getting yourself into trouble.. ..

So if you actually end up studying and largely understanding the investment thesis for bitcoin, then you can consider the extent to which any shitcoin might be providing some potential value, rathet than being a kind of temporary scam... and so sure, it is possible and even likely that there are some shitcoins that are not directly scamming and are providing some utility, so in that regard, if you waste your time studying that non-sense and you happen to find one or more that is worth putting some value into, then you will still need to temper your investment..

In the end, there is a presumption that shitcoins/altcoins are not providing much or any value or worthy of investment, and so you have to overcome that presumption in order to justify investing into them in any kind of meaningful way beyond short term pumpamentals (which is also a questionable reason to get into a project, but not an unreasonable reason if you have good information and/or confidence regarding short term pumpamentals.. which again is a different reason for getting into such coins as compared with bitcoin's long term investment thesis,  even though sometimes bitcoin will also continue to go through short-term pumping periods).


I don't really disagree with you, but you are not really saying much of anything here.. except that bitcoin is the best because everyone believes it is best, and so sure there might be some truth to that, but bitcoin is best based on the way that it is designed and its various network effects.  Consider Trace Mayer's seven network effects. 

Also bitcoin is best in part because it would take something in the order of a 10x improvement over BTC for some kind of a coin to take over bitcoin, and for example, some people cannot figure out bitcoin's relationship to gold, and so there are many people who are confused about bitcoin versus gold, but  part of the reason that bitcoin is gaining on gold's market share is because bitcoin is way more than 10x better than gold, and perhaps even in the neighborhood of 1,000x better than gold. So, sure it could take another 50 to 200 years for the market to end up recognizing bitcoin for it's 1,000x better value than gold, and so there are a lot of folks who cannot recognize bitcoin's superiority to gold (including the 1,000x angle), and so some people will end up being more correct than others in terms of their assessment of value but even if we assess value, the timeline could still take a very long time to play out.


I doubt that you are correct on this point.  Shitcoins could outperform bitcoin for a long time.. so I would not count on the fact that shitcoins might not pump and even end up outperforming bitcoin for considerable amounts of time.  I don't know whether such outperformance is going to happen, but I am not going to invest into those shitty scams merely because there are a bunch of dumb twats pumping their nonsense smoke and screen crap, whether we are referring to ethereum or some other shitcoins.  We could even get nation states pumping that nonsense.. so even if they might cause crap to get pumped (just like fiat is pumped and able to retain value) that still does not take away from bitcoin's investment thesis.. so you have to choose whether or not to invest at all in the crap (that could pump higher than bitcoin).

You likely know the expression: "market's can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent," so it is up to you if you get lured into shitty project because of their pumpening potentials (including various shitcoins), and sure of course, even with bitcoin, you should be figuring out your own position size based on the facts that a lot of weird things can end up happening that cause bitcoin prices to be suppressed lower than expected and for longer than expected.. .You should not be considering that it is inevitable that bitcoin will pump or that shitcoins will not pump.. that seems like a gambling kind of approach if you are not sufficiently/adequately preparing for either direction (and a variety of outcomes, even crazy ones).


It can take a real long time to make up for some of the losses that happen, so when any of us is looking at our investment portfolio, we have to be careful about not losing our principle.  So we should be figuring out ways to establish our various position sizes in such ways that we are not putting our principle at risk.

Yes, I know easier said than done.. but first of all figuring out how much we are going to invest into BTC or other investments, such as 10% of our salary (or some other reasonable amount that allows us to continue to live a reasonable lifestyle). .and then once we have figured out our budget then we have to figure out what to invest into..  If you are a brand new investor, then there does not seem to be anything wrong with putting all or most of your 10% amount into bitcoin until you reach a certain level of 20% to 50% of your annual salary or some other number that you believe to be reasonable and then at some later point, then figure out how to diversify.. and most likely not shitcoins but instead property, equities, commodities, bonds, and cash/cash equivalents... and sure if you cannot resist getting involved in various shitcoins, then restrict your investment into them to no more than 10% of the size of your bitcoin investment.. unless you figure out some angle that is actually good information about some project that you are going to invest into and to go beyond 10% of ther size of your bitcoin investment.

Anyhow, the point is that many times, it does take a long time to build back principle when you end up losing a lot of it (or even all of it) because you got to greedy and/or you failed to limit your position size based on how much risk you were entering into.

True Op, no knowledge is a waste, and practice is better than theory learning. I like the fact that you were able to shut the voice of fear in your head and buy the bitcoins.

The way the fiat currency is becoming inflated, knowing that there's an alternative is encouraging, even though there are risks attached to it. Personally, i'd rather face those risks that let my value depreciate.

Yes' I agree with you, before learning anything one must have knowledge of that subject, otherwise one can never learn those subjects. Because you learn a lot of things over time, and you don't do them, but the fact that you learn them is the greatest thing, and I think it's never a waste of time. Learning a subject will surely be needed one day in the future, and can certainly help you personally in this learning. If you had not learned these things you would never have been able to talk about them in the future if they were discussed in any detail, so this education of yours I think was best and necessary.

The same goes for Bitcoin investing. If I had no idea about Bitcoin, I would never have learned one without taking an education. In that case, I definitely need to learn about Bitcoin and how to invest and know the basics of Bitcoin. Of course, if I'm not well versed in Bitcoin and invest without knowing it, I'll most likely lose my money. And if I invest knowing everything, then surely I can expect profit from Bitcoin in the future, so learn everything first, but experience in everything will increase.

You are right, if you buy shitcoins and forget about most of them for several years, I'm not even talking about 10 years or more, then you can forget not only about this investment but also about your money. I'm talking about this from my own experience because when I learned about Bitcoin and saw how altcoins could rise, and I decided that this was a good way to increase the Bitcoin in my wallet, but I only lost everything I had because I didn't sell, when I could do it.

There are doubts that I will be able to achieve at least any satisfactory result with shitcoins, so I decided not to take any more risks and buy bitcoin, everything ingenious is simple.

@JJG, you have a clear point.
Some shitcoins end up being scams sometimes, whether they are the top shitcoins or not. As long as it's a shitcoin, fuck them all.
Although altcoins are not the best to recommend for a new investor, altcoins are more savable than shitcoins and this is a useful link.

When we talk about a good crypto currency, we should always remember BTC because Bitcoin is the only crypto currency in the market that investors are planning to accumulate.
Shitcoins can never grow above $10K because it is only those that don't know what Bitcoin is all about that put their money on it. The ethereum coin can be more profitable sometimes, but Bitcoin is more profitable when an investor holds it for a long time.

I agree, I did this many years ago but I agree with it as well. I feel like it's obvious that we are not doing anything that would be smart to handle all these kind of stuff, it just doesn't make sense to handle it any differently. I really hope that people could make it change a bit more and we could see some changes on the long term, but for the time being I believe that we are going to end up with a result that would be a lot better if we follow where our heart takes us.

Bitcoin is an amazing asset and having some of it couldn't hurt you if the money you are putting in is not some money that you will need. Some people put in their salary, that's a wrong move, do not make that type of investments at all.

It's a misuse of the term diversification, and that is how people get sucked into shitcoins because it is meant to sound like it is normal to diversify into shitcoins - merely because you don't know what is bitcoin and you cannot tell the difference between what is bitcoin and what are shitcoins.

The real idea of smart diversification goes into different kinds of asset classes rather than in the same asset class, and yeah sure if you are dumb and don't know what is bitcoin, then you will be led into false regarding various possibilities of various shitcoins.

Now in terms of gambling rather than investing, then diversifying might make some sense.  Diversify some of your gambling items, but OP has already stated several times that he is not gambling, he is investing and he is doing it for the long term, not the short term, so it does not really make any sense to diversify for the mere sake of it.. especially since you don't even seem to understand the concept of diversification very well.

Another aspect of diversification that can screw up your investment is when you end up diluting, and it could be the case that new investors should not be diluting their investment, and there may well not be any need to add additional assets until maybe your investment portfolio (potentially ONLY starting with bitcoin and cash) gets to be a certain size.. perhaps 20% to 50% of your annual salary, or maybe even a larger number.. which may well depend also on how much discretionary income a person might have.  There are a lot of people who ONLY are able to invest 10% of their annual salary at most, and so at that pace it would take them 10 years to get to a point in which they have invested a whole year's salary, so then it may well depend on how well their investments performed to be able to see if they have more than a whole years worth of income (or living expenses) in their investment portfolio. ..

The mere fact that some people are ONLY able to invest small amounts seems to justify a whole hell of a lot less diversification rather than fucking around with diluting the small amounts that they are actually able to invest (or save).  


Again pushing shitcoins.. Merely because they are at the top does not necessarily convert them into either an investment or within a category that is even close to as good as bitcoin.. so then a question becomes why waste your time, energy and/or money on such distractions?


Fuck shitcoins.. there is no need to practice with them without having a better investment thesis than diversification for the sake of it or they happen to be in the top coins or dumb shit like that.  When investing into shitcoins as contrasted with bitcoin there are more reasons to have to look into the overwhelming crap that is out there trying to act like they are either equal to or better than bitcoin.. so the best is to start out with bitcoin first and no need to study very many details and just get the fuck started with bitcoin and learn along the way... if you are going to fuck around with other coins and or projects, you are going to need to do your homework first because an overwhelming majority are pure nonsense and in need of babysitting and/or getting in and out rather than just buying and forgetting about it for 10 years (which way closer to the case with bitcoin.. being able to invest and forget about it).

It's true, annoyed, bored and happy are always mixed up when entering this world of trading. So, what is needed now is to be good at reading the direction of where the market is going and of course with a careful mindset and studying the factors that influence volatility because prices can rise quickly and fall in an instant. Yes. We know that BTC is an investment instrument with a long-term strategic pattern if you want maximum returns.

Absolutely correct, it is essential to develop comprehensive understanding about Bitcoin, its historical price trends and patterns on longer timeframes like weekly or even monthly intervals, before venturing into Bitcoin investment. It can exhibit extreme volatility on occasions and newcomers can get disheartened by substantial price drops, sometimes to the extent of 80% or even more during the bear market cycle that can last for years. Exercising patience and emotional control during such bearish phases is crucial for securing remarkable profits in the long run.

And on the time that you do see that you do make money if you have invested, then you would really be ending up on banging up your head into the wall on why you had missed out or didnt tend to take actions basing up with those analysis of yours which turns out to be true. Just like been said by others above that there's no such thing about risk free on this world no matter how good you are on dealing with something then losing money would  really be just that so inevitable but on the time that you do able to have a good grasps within this market then most likely you would really be able to make yourself sustain and would  really be able to make yourself survive despite of being random and unpredictable.
Knowledge in overall which it isnt limited on Bitcoin would really be always relevant on which not taking any action despite of being wary about the situation or condition would really be just that a waste because
you wont really be making money if you do let yourself sitting idle or would really be just that simply taking no action which it would be resulting on having no gains at all.
It would be really just that normal that you would really be going into the situation when you are still newbie on which information would really be that lacking or something that you had
put up into your mind with those bad ideas on which you would really be that able to change it out later on, on the time that you do able to read up those right informations
which are supposed to be read up and those past knowledge or information that you had read up will eventually be changed up directly.

In any investment, you should always have your contingencies in case it fails or not up to your expectations.
This is why, people are diversifying their investment portfolio to mitigate possible losses to any of their investment.
And I can agree with what the OP is doing, if you are already in this market, why not invest some especially with the top coin?
If you have done your job, studying the risks involved and you are all prepared, there's nothing wrong about buying some just to get the feel of it.
You would know what to do when you are already in the situation. If you lost some, treat it as a learning experience and see where you got it wrong.

I agree but this also applies to all kinds of investment.

No matter how knowledgeable you are on a certain topic, if you lack the necessary application of using those information and knowledge, then nothing would come into fruition. For example, you may be knowledgeable about all the intrinsic and extrinsic factors affecting the price of BTC and you were also able to accurately forecast its price but if you fail to take any action to take advantage of such knowledge, then nothing would definitely happen.

This is where theories are being used as methodologies in actual experiments. Without actually trying and applying what you have learned, nothing would come out and sprout from the root of all of the knowledge you have learned.

Sometimes we don't have to blame them or actually look at what they says because i sense they are trying to come up and with time they could get used with the word "Bitcoin" some people places cryptocurrency to bitcoin. Yes this is true initially at my early age or stage when I had little knowledge and joining the forum recently I never knew there are two seperate words for both but to me then was using cryptocurrencies to classified them both but i strongly believed with time and also as they gets involved with your discussion they would get corrected. That is why you are a boss over here so i believe following your ways isn't bad and that is where you plays your roles as a teacher and mentor who is to correct those people that doesn't have broad knowledge towards the industry.

What I mean, in that statement of making bitcoin to be part of my life means that I will always have a bitcoin investment even at old age. There will be no time that I will not be holding bitcoin, just like the way that we must need fiat to survive because it is a necessity. Bitcoin is not a necessity but it is worth holding and to be pass on to our heirs. This was why you guys are getting my point wrong, I wouldn't only have bitcoin as my investment but I will also have other investment around the corner, so that I don't end up shattering my  will.

 Emergency funds and other funds for up keeping must be among the budget for me to be able to stay off from touching my bitcoin investment portfolio.

Not all cryptocurrency can survive the long term and is worth holding except only bitcoin, because of its great potential, which we have seen from history. Most cryptocurrency are shitcoin and they can mess with your funds, and you will run at great loss just like what @JJG said, be used to the word bitcoin and not crypto, and let's be specific.

I am not even really opposed to what you are saying, Y3shot, because in theory what you are saying is correct.  However, what you are saying seems a bit patronizing because if we are dealing with adults rather than children, we have to presume some level of knowledge already exists with everyone. there are basic ideas about how much money is coming in versus what are the expenses and whether any money is left.  

Sure, young people probably need to spend a lot of time learning how to manage their money and figuring out how to invest, and what to invest in... but some of the learning comes from putting already existing knowledge to practice and learning along the way, rather than presuming that a lot of big and important things need to be learned about "the secrets of bitcoin" prior to our ability to start to take a stake into it.

The fact of the matter is that bitcoin is complicated as fuck when you come down to it, and so there is ONLY so much that each of us are going to know, so in order to develop an investment thesis, there are not necessarily needs to know everything from the start.


From the context of your post Asuspawer09, I can see that you are talking about bitcoin, so why do you feel some kind of need to substitute the word "cryptocurrency?"  

Are you trying to sound smarter?

Do you believe that strategies in regards to bitcoin are equally applicable to shitcoins? or various distracting and scammy shitcoin projects?

Your conscious and several times use of the term "cryptocurrency" seems to show that you have some reluctance in your own abilities to focus on bitcoin.. because you seem to think that there is something more broad that is going on and being contributed to bitcoin by the various affinity scam projects in the shitcoin space in which you are also giving legitimacy to that crap by using the word crypto rather than focusing on bitcoin in the way that you chose to respond to Ruttoshi.

Actually your several times use of the term cryptocurrency rather than using the word bitcoin (if that might have been what you were talking about?), converted a potentially otherwise good post into "gobble-dee-gook."

DCA does reduce risk, but is there a "no risk" scenario in this economic puppet show? Reading between the large players' movements, the hidden decisions made in dimly lit rooms that change the market's rhythm, is deeper understanding.

Even with your cryptocurrency and Bitcoin understanding, you're a small fish in a big, uncertain sea. Its not about knowledge only; its about understanding the undercurrents that move this ocean.

Its wise not to rely on crypto profit. You think they want you to succeed? You think you have the map, but the fluctuating market is an unholy place. There are much more losers than winners in this game. Cryptocurrency, Bitcoin, yes, exciting and new, but they come with significant risks.

I think about the case of being scammed or fallen in the hands of scammers are people who are too desperate about making money online, they always want to utilize all single opportunity they comes across online which to me isn't proper most at times we should see some of those opportunities that looks so real to be fake. Money or profit doesn't comes that way it takes time to rise and with much knowledge invested in making research it would be very hard for someone to cheaply fall into the hands of scammers, so we should reduced too much pressure of utilizing every single opportunities, so it's the knowledge that gives guides on how to become a successful bitcoin investor or a strong holder.

It is more beneficial to us when we learn first before we invest. This help us to be very conscious about making decisions that will help is grow well in making appropriate decisions that would be very effective to us. We need to be learning because we don't know when we are going to need such knowledge and the kind of greater benefits it's going to give us. Bitcoin investment need a lot of constant learn to help us make effective decisions that would bring more profits to us. There are people that are always looking for new means to scam people but if we have a good knowledge in cryptocurrency, we can defend ourselves from scammers.

That's the main point. This line goes against the thread title, and I am okay with that. I have learned many things out of curiosity. I have learned a little bit of video editing, a little bit of photo editing, CSS, HTML and many more things that I don't do these days. Does it mean my learnings are a waste of time? I don't think so because these things help me personally.

When it comes to Bitcoin, I have to learn first before I invest. The reason is apparent. If I don't learn about Bitcoin and start investing in it slowly but surely, I will be disappointed in Bitcoin when I see the market crashing.