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Topic: Bitcoin mining will never pay off with GPUs for dedicated miners. (Read 12709 times)

sr. member
Activity: 350
Merit: 250
I have to admit that all of this was just an excuse for me to build a new gaming PC. Smiley

I spent about 1500 USD for a system with a Trifire of 6970's and there's just no way I'll ever break even on it since I only started mining like a week ago and I have like 6 BTC to show for it so far. If I were to sell it on the exchange, I'd get like 90 USD for that, lol. Almost covers the Blu-Ray burner I picked out.

I'll let it grind through the whole summer but I do not expect to pull out more than 50 BTC when all's said and done before the difficulty gets cranked so high that it becomes weeks between BTCs even with pooled mining. Maybe someday they'll trade for 40 USD and I'll break even on the system if I choose to cash in but they can just as easily go to 0 USD, too.

Finally a person who has a pretty clear perspective of his own situation without clouding it with self reassuring lies. Right now at current exchange rate there is no possible way to recover your cost or even expect to mine more btc than you would if you purchased instead. If you are one of those people that keep telling yourself that this isn't the case because you are a miner, you will most certainly be in the loss in the coming months in you decided to jump in now. Just consider it more of a discounted gaming machine if you will at best. I wouldn't expect to recover cost at this junction.

Price increase, as much as people like to believe, is not in any way directly related to difficulty increase. One does not raise to lower the other simply because of it's changing values. It has moved in sync somewhat in the recent past to mask or make it appear so, but our recent 100% jump in diff didn't do a thing to price. In fact it dropped considerably after the speculative initial news reporting of Bitcoin from major media channels caused a major hike in price. None of this was in any way done by the difficulty increase and it won't matter in the future if general speculations of bitcoin will influence price in similar fashion and it will.
newbie
Activity: 23
Merit: 0
I have to admit that all of this was just an excuse for me to build a new gaming PC. Smiley

I spent about 1500 USD for a system with a Trifire of 6970's and there's just no way I'll ever break even on it since I only started mining like a week ago and I have like 6 BTC to show for it so far. If I were to sell it on the exchange, I'd get like 90 USD for that, lol. Almost covers the Blu-Ray burner I picked out.

I'll let it grind through the whole summer but I do not expect to pull out more than 50 BTC when all's said and done before the difficulty gets cranked so high that it becomes weeks between BTCs even with pooled mining. Maybe someday they'll trade for 40 USD and I'll break even on the system if I choose to cash in but they can just as easily go to 0 USD, too.
member
Activity: 112
Merit: 10
Firstbits: 1yetiax
Not necessarily. I will not cash out below $20. Sure, mining AND investing is an even higher gamble, but it also makes it more phun(tm)!
newbie
Activity: 25
Merit: 0
The thing about price and difficulty...

There is no shortage of BTC...and even if there was...there are just as many BTC being made regardless of the difficulty, they are just split among more people.

What does affect the price of BTC is when the miners decide they have had enough of this now and cash out, which will happen more often as difficulty increases.

But's are't reasonable miners constantly cashing out while they grow their mining farm?
newbie
Activity: 25
Merit: 0
Wow...starting multiple threads stating the same crap now.

Everyone, read all posts related to this troll before forming opinions.

But he is USEFUL - the less people will get into mining, the better for those that will.

Now, another thing to think about - different locations on Earth have different electricity costs. Mine is about 1/2 of the US right now.

Then think about solar and wind power. Yes, if we were not all enslaved by the Govts., then we could just sell the electricity in the open market, but with millions of regulations and high entry cost - it's not as easy as Bitcoin mining way to convert electricity into some personal power (a.k.a. money).

Third point - it's just FUN. People are playing on the stock market in a WAY more hostile environment, geared to cheat and rid small players of their money. Bitcoin scene is very refreshing after THAT. And, yes, investing $15,000 you don't have is probably not a good idea, but investing $1000 certainly is (just think about all these loosing tens of thousands of USD on futures and Forex).
legendary
Activity: 1692
Merit: 1018
The same topics were probably mentioned by the first 100 or so people mining after 10000 more people jumped on board and brought up difficulty. Now those guys are the ones who don't have to work for a living.

The only people rolling in cash are those that started mining in 2009 or 2010.  People keep repeating the mantra that increased difficulty will lead to increased BTC/USD exchange rates, but recently we saw that trend broken.  Difficulty is up 100% yet the price remains the same.  Speculators and those very few people actually using bitcoin don't care how much hardware costs, or the price of electricity.  They never had to pay those costs.  If no one ever created another bitcoin from here on in the market would still be very well supplied.
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
It depends on the demand for bitcoins as well. If the demand is weak, the price wont go up no matter what the miners do.
That is the ultimate arbiter of prices, demand for bitcoins.

I just wish I had enough $$$ to be the first with the ASIC.  You could have every bitcoin made for the next year with that.
legendary
Activity: 1148
Merit: 1001
Radix-The Decentralized Finance Protocol
Some people might say that the exchange rate of bitcoins may go up to compensate.  That may or may not be true.  But if it is, it would make more economic sense to buy bitcoins now and take the gain, rather than buying hardware to generate them.

The exchange rate of bitcoins will go up. The value of bitcoins is in the hands of the miners for the most part. If they have to raise the cost of bitcoins in order to make a profit after paying their hydro, then it will go up. Nobody in the right mind would sit here, watching how bitcoins has grown since one year ago and figure that it's a bad move to mine.

The same topics were probably mentioned by the first 100 or so people mining after 10000 more people jumped on board and brought up difficulty. Now those guys are the ones who don't have to work for a living.

It depends on the demand for bitcoins as well. If the demand is weak, the price wont go up no matter what the miners do.
full member
Activity: 210
Merit: 100
Hmmm...interesting.  Somehow I really doubt you are the hookup.
full member
Activity: 210
Merit: 100

There wasn't very many when I started...and since more than one thread was started for the same thing in the same day it seems odd.

As does some noob who supposedly dumps 10k into mining only to decide that he was stupid.
I actually just copied this bitcoin mining thread from the newbies section, since I couldn't post in the mining section earlier.  I haven't created any other threads since.  This swisher guy really likes following me around.  Grin

Everyone needs a hobby...keeps me away from refreshing mtgox and miner status.


*cough* VIRGIN *cough*

Hey, if Swisher is a girl, you may like that.

Lol
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0

There wasn't very many when I started...and since more than one thread was started for the same thing in the same day it seems odd.

As does some noob who supposedly dumps 10k into mining only to decide that he was stupid.
I actually just copied this bitcoin mining thread from the newbies section, since I couldn't post in the mining section earlier.  I haven't created any other threads since.  This swisher guy really likes following me around.  Grin

Everyone needs a hobby...keeps me away from refreshing mtgox and miner status.


*cough* VIRGIN *cough*

Actually, every time I see SwisherCutter, I think of someone taking a urinal cake (Swisher Co.) and chopping it up with a razor blade.
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0

There wasn't very many when I started...and since more than one thread was started for the same thing in the same day it seems odd.

As does some noob who supposedly dumps 10k into mining only to decide that he was stupid.
I actually just copied this bitcoin mining thread from the newbies section, since I couldn't post in the mining section earlier.  I haven't created any other threads since.  This swisher guy really likes following me around.  Grin

Everyone needs a hobby...keeps me away from refreshing mtgox and miner status.


*cough* VIRGIN *cough*

Hey, if Swisher is a girl, you may like that.
newbie
Activity: 42
Merit: 0

There wasn't very many when I started...and since more than one thread was started for the same thing in the same day it seems odd.

As does some noob who supposedly dumps 10k into mining only to decide that he was stupid.
I actually just copied this bitcoin mining thread from the newbies section, since I couldn't post in the mining section earlier.  I haven't created any other threads since.  This swisher guy really likes following me around.  Grin

Everyone needs a hobby...keeps me away from refreshing mtgox and miner status.


*cough* VIRGIN *cough*
full member
Activity: 210
Merit: 100

There wasn't very many when I started...and since more than one thread was started for the same thing in the same day it seems odd.

As does some noob who supposedly dumps 10k into mining only to decide that he was stupid.
I actually just copied this bitcoin mining thread from the newbies section, since I couldn't post in the mining section earlier.  I haven't created any other threads since.  This swisher guy really likes following me around.  Grin

Everyone needs a hobby...keeps me away from refreshing mtgox and miner status.
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0

There wasn't very many when I started...and since more than one thread was started for the same thing in the same day it seems odd.

As does some noob who supposedly dumps 10k into mining only to decide that he was stupid.
I actually just copied this bitcoin mining thread from the newbies section, since I couldn't post in the mining section earlier.  I haven't created any other threads since.  This swisher guy really likes following me around.  Grin
full member
Activity: 210
Merit: 100
Having a 5 day account and only posting things that discredit bitcoin/mtgox/client software...that points to obvious troll.

You seem to not listen. I have already explained this umpteen times, but I will try again:

I have never discredited bitcoin.  I think it is a great investment.  I only discredit dedicated mining for now.
Mt. Gox has a simple incompatability with IE 8, which I explained.  Other than that, I have had no problem with Mt. Gox.
The client software, I have no idea about.



Click on your account tab...you are aware we can read all of your posts right?  Tell me which one of your posts was helpful or new to the community.  I couldn't find one.
Saying that I have contributed nothing of value is a different argument than saying that I have discredited bitcoin/mtgox, etc.  Try to refute the original post.

As far as value, I belive if I help people understand the problem with the network growth halving their profits every 18 days, they can make a better decision on buying dedicated miners.

Also, I have commented on how bitcoins are much better than fiat currency issued by central bankers that can be inflated at will.  That is the best part of bitcoin.  Plus real banking secrecy.


Again, you are not saying anything new...no need for a new discussion...this has all been well documented for months and most believe it to be inaccurate.
hero member
Activity: 602
Merit: 500
Having a 5 day account and only posting things that discredit bitcoin/mtgox/client software...that points to obvious troll.

You seem to not listen. I have already explained this umpteen times, but I will try again:

I have never discredited bitcoin.  I think it is a great investment.  I only discredit dedicated mining for now.
Mt. Gox has a simple incompatability with IE 8, which I explained.  Other than that, I have had no problem with Mt. Gox.
The client software, I have no idea about.



Click on your account tab...you are aware we can read all of your posts right?  Tell me which one of your posts was helpful or new to the community.  I couldn't find one.

so you read ALL his posts? jesus dude.. GET A LIFE.


He only has 72 posts, you can skim through them all fairly quickly with a high reading rate. Or take a stastical sampling, for example, I'll take 1 at random off every page of his profile:

Quote
If you are building the PC because you were going to use it for gaming anyway, then it isn't a loss. Buying a PC only for mining is a complete loss.

Quote
For example, see this thread from someone else that has done the math:
http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=18803.0

I'm sorry you think I am a troll for simply spreading the truth.  If you don't like what I am saying, then there is nothing I can do for you.  I am hoping to let others know what is going on.


Quote
What I am saying is that you will get a better return just buying right now.  Unless you already have a gaming machine, or are going to buy a machine for gaming as well.  Then it is just free money until the power costs more than the bitcoins.

The growth rate of difficulty has been 4% a day for the last year, so yes, mining rigs have been less profitable than just buying bitcoins for the last year.  If the network growth slows down to ~2.5% a year, then it starts making sense.  The first year of bitcoin, the growth rate was almost flat, so you could make more money mining than buying bitcoins.

Keep in mind this is only about dedicated mining rigs.  If you already have the equipment, there is nothing to lose by mining.  At least for another 60 days when it reaches electricity costs.

Quote
My spreadsheet estimates predict 60 days.  But that is at $20/bitcoin.  They may go up and extend net loss point out.  But still, it would have been better to buy bitcoins directly.

Yadda yadda. Obviously this is a poor sampling, but I'm just using it to show you can get a flavor for someones posts quickly and easily while still having "a life".
legendary
Activity: 1708
Merit: 1010
Having a 5 day account and only posting things that discredit bitcoin/mtgox/client software...that points to obvious troll.

You seem to not listen. I have already explained this umpteen times, but I will try again:

I have never discredited bitcoin.  I think it is a great investment.  I only discredit dedicated mining for now.
Mt. Gox has a simple incompatability with IE 8, which I explained.  Other than that, I have had no problem with Mt. Gox.
The client software, I have no idea about.



Click on your account tab...you are aware we can read all of your posts right?  Tell me which one of your posts was helpful or new to the community.  I couldn't find one.

so you read ALL his posts? jesus dude.. GET A LIFE.


There wasn't very many when I started...and since more than one thread was started for the same thing in the same day it seems odd.

As does some noob who supposedly dumps 10k into mining only to decide that he was stupid.

Actually 12,000$

If I offered you $6K for your entire cluster, would you sell?
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
Having a 5 day account and only posting things that discredit bitcoin/mtgox/client software...that points to obvious troll.

You seem to not listen. I have already explained this umpteen times, but I will try again:

I have never discredited bitcoin.  I think it is a great investment.  I only discredit dedicated mining for now.
Mt. Gox has a simple incompatability with IE 8, which I explained.  Other than that, I have had no problem with Mt. Gox.
The client software, I have no idea about.



Click on your account tab...you are aware we can read all of your posts right?  Tell me which one of your posts was helpful or new to the community.  I couldn't find one.
Saying that I have contributed nothing of value is a different argument than saying that I have discredited bitcoin/mtgox, etc.  Try to refute the original post.

As far as value, I belive if I help people understand the problem with the network growth halving their profits every 18 days, they can make a better decision on buying dedicated miners.

Also, I have commented on how bitcoins are much better than fiat currency issued by central bankers that can be inflated at will.  That is the best part of bitcoin.  Plus real banking secrecy.
newbie
Activity: 42
Merit: 0
Having a 5 day account and only posting things that discredit bitcoin/mtgox/client software...that points to obvious troll.

You seem to not listen. I have already explained this umpteen times, but I will try again:

I have never discredited bitcoin.  I think it is a great investment.  I only discredit dedicated mining for now.
Mt. Gox has a simple incompatability with IE 8, which I explained.  Other than that, I have had no problem with Mt. Gox.
The client software, I have no idea about.



Click on your account tab...you are aware we can read all of your posts right?  Tell me which one of your posts was helpful or new to the community.  I couldn't find one.

so you read ALL his posts? jesus dude.. GET A LIFE.


There wasn't very many when I started...and since more than one thread was started for the same thing in the same day it seems odd.

As does some noob who supposedly dumps 10k into mining only to decide that he was stupid.

Actually 12,000$.... and it WAS STUPID.

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