Topic: Bitcoin Monetary Policy But Things are Changing Now (Taproot) (Read 317 times)

Maybe it doesn't have to be like that? Maybe you do not have to join in the blockchain part of it. Just because it is decentralized, doesn't mean that we need to be the ones who are in charge for it, and we can just watch afar while supporting it and buying it.

Basically I have zero miners, never owned any, and I know that I don't have 32 eth to start helping with the PoS there for example, but I know that they are both decentralized and that's good enough for me. I do not need it to be something that I participate in order to make sure that it's decentralized, I can accept it the way it is right now and that's good enough for me, I just buy and vote with my money by holding the coins.

Well, I do agree with you that POW is better in the circulation supply management but I am discussing a point which is that one both models there is a controlled environment such as on the POW side the compute resources owners control the blockchain and on the POS side the Money holders control the market. A middleman like me who doesn't have many resources and Money can't contribute to blockchain decentralization because of these models.

Also, POW is directly targeted for its power consumption which is a big issue for the Bitcoin community, But we always neglect it. Some experts who support centralization and traditional markets target this point to prove Bitcoin is unworthy. The community is sticking to its ideology and continuously supporting good Bitcoin. This a sign for a big reform but what if we consider a solution for  Bitcoin power consumption?

Proof of Work is better than Proof of Stake as it requires physical resources to create new coins into circulating supply. With Proof of Stake, you can create new coins or tokens by investing in a node (Masternode, Supernode, Security Node, etc.) or amount of some coins or tokens and stake yours on network to earn staking rewards. It can be hacked, exploited to vote new Proposal. This algorithm makes such networks based on it is less secured and more vulnerable to exploitation.

The hybrid model PoW/ PoS is not new but we need to see it on big altcoins to know how good or bad it is in reality and on big main nets.

I was thinking in another way I would like to know what you think of the decentralization of the network with POS and POW because it is very clear that both have +1 points one is power efficient and the other is efficient in terms of security. Regarding the new switch we are talking about can you please elaborate on DPOS and Hybrid POw/POs are kind of such things which I have gone through theoretically but I am not sure where these machines are implemented. For Dpos I think EOS is based on DPOS.

Rest I would like yo know what senior thinks about it and why still we are unable to find such a solution..

If some day a new algorithm is invented that at least provides the security that PoW provides and offers enough advantages over it, I don't see any reason for bitcoin to not switch to that new algorithm. The thing is, we already know that PoS is severely flawed and adds more problems than it solves. This is why talking about such a switch is more like a joke. After all PoS was invented in ~2012 and failed then and there.

Ruining the purpose of Bitcoin from being electronic cash to force it into your view of being a mere asset, can only do more harm in the long term. This is why this spam problem should be addressed ASAP.


Also it seems that in the end 4mb blocks were made a reality, but instead of transactions, they are now filled with spam...

well, if you also want a system where censoring is impossible/expensive, then the two things will inevitably contradict one another, it's always going to be possible to somehow cleverly craft bitcoin transactions so that they contain data that can be decoded in a way that isn't a payment of BTC (or that a transaction contains some different data, AND pays someone)

there's nothing that can be done about the issue absolutely, but the tx fees mitigate it.

maybe if everyone knew how you use your BTC, then some people wouldn't like it? fortunately, because of bitcoin's anti-censorship properties, their only options are:

• be unhappy
• get on with their lives

i recommend the 2nd option, but some people seem to like feeling miserable

Well said, I know it's nearly impossible for the Bitcoin community to accept any type of POW to POS solution in the future. for the dirt, I would say sometimes you need to compromise with the circumstances.
As always antibiotics are not available haha also from the farmer's background in my society using such antibiotics is not preferred we feel better with "Desi Tootkas" following the medical instructions from highly qualified elders. Rubbing Tumeric is a better option.

Wrong. You can not create NFTs using Bitcoin protocol. It simply is not defined that way. The script complexity has also not changed in the way you think with Taproot.

What people mistakenly call "dominance" is not dominance at all. It is market cap ratio and it will not change like this as long as thousands shitcoins are being created with billions of [fake] circulating supply which would create fake market cap hence decreasing the ration which is btc_MC/(sum of thousands of MCs).

Fees always go up in all spam attacks. This time it is not different with Ordinals attack either.

It's like saying "rub dirt in your would if you want it to heal"

So, I don't want talking too much about smart contracts or any beneficial program after the taproot upgrade, If the block increase to twice, will it affect to bitcoin blockchain size data?.

I have a thread talked about size of hard disk data, I'm not outspoken if the blockchain data is too big to keep it while, I have enough hard disk to accommodate it. But if that smart contracts or NFT like you said burden to my hard disk, of course, I do not accept it, I just want bitcoin blockchain data only on my hardisk, not others smart contracts, nft or etc .

i dont mind speaking to people as if the are 5 year old ELI-5
but when they act like 5 years old that when they earn the descriptions i give them

at the millenium min wage was about £$5
and bought 4 loaves of bread

now its $15(3x) for the same work time.. BUT NOT 12(3x) loaves of bread.. instead its far less bread than the 3x multiple of dollar

..
yes hard drive data gets cheaper per GB so yes it deflationary
you get more data per dollar

..
bitcoin
as the value* goes up. you get less bitcoin per dollar(more goods per bitcoin)

and you again wanting to go extreme of total supply or other extreme of temporary price of 1 day shows you have not learned anything

inflation announcements are not daily or millenia
inflation/recession official announcements are for fiat, a 6 month call not a daily or a century

*also bitcoin value is not found at the top of a daily market. its based at the bottom of a period

value is the opposite of premium
and not evaluated on a spot market

i would say more but i think i should give you a few days to work out a few things and let your thoughts settle

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one little hint
PRICE is speculative and moves at the whim short term.
it can inflate and deflate

but dont confuse that with value
not confuse inflate deflate vs inflationary deflationary

the 'ate' is temporary the 'tionary' is periodic

as for value.. value is the opposite of premium. so value is found at the bottom. not the top
so looking to find if bitcoin is deflationary you have to look over a period of time of the periodic lows
not the silly things you look at

So Tesla shares are also deflationary, since in
in 2012 if you would have sold one share you would get 2 loaves of bread
in 2022 you would have got 600 loaves of bread for one share

Oh wait, even the USD is deflationary if we look at data processing costs


With 100$ you could get a 32 GB SSD in 2009
With 100$ you can get a 1TB drive now 

Oh but wait, since Bitcoin has lost value since 2021, does this mean it's sometimes inflationary sometimes deflationary and sometimes it has no clue what it is? 
Two weeks ago it was deflationary, two days it was inflationary and now is again deflationary 

so for 6 millenia gold has been inflationary hmm

so that means selling an ounce of gold in the 1970s would have got me more loaves of bread then .. than it does now

ok
well in 2012($4) if i sold 1 btc i would have only got 3 loaves of bread
well in 2022($17k) if i sold 1 btc i would have only got 2?1? loaves of bread
or.. what really happened is i would have got 10,000 loaves of bread

yep bitcoin gained value in 10 years. which is deflation

because mining cost only $600 an hour for 150 coins in 2012 (best rates)
because mining cost only $560k an hour for 37.5 coins in 2022 (best rates)

Except that the price is not falling at all:



Why? Do we have a right way in which we should all voice our opinions in unison? 
Take for example your view on the two communities coming together and granting more support to BTC  cause of NFT,
do you think that everyone is happy about this? Don't be so sure, maximalists don't like this at all, and it's not everyone be happy, let's all shake hands and sing chants together.
Even here some are really pissed at the turn of events, just check some topics and you're going to see what I mean, as I don't like to point fingers.

Anyhow, two things
- for now, Bitcoin is inflationary, every single day you have more Bitcoins in circulation, that's inflation. It's also inherently deflationary since at one point it will become so once the priting stops.
- the number of addresses with a balance is something normal since we get 900 new BTC each day and we still have usage, but number o-f addresses =/= people so you can't say for sure we have the same growth and not even be sure we do have it.

For many of the above replies, I would say 90% of the replies are taking the wrong direction, except a few ones.

The motive behind the post was to explain the narrative change regarding Bitcoin. Previously we all knew Bitcoin due to its monetary policy but now things are changing it is an indication of a change of mindset and investment approach. As previously a maximum of us invest in Bitcoin due to the Store of value role of Bitcoin but now and in the future there will be more reasons as well to invest in Bitcoin and Taproot is taken as an example approach.

The point is in the future rather than taproot there will be more and more reasons to invest in Bitcoin which is a positive approach in my view but some people consider it as a negative attitude due to the impact of the new features on the Bitcoins base but I am not sure on what basis they take it negatively.

@tranthidung thanks sir for the correct information until now I was considering Bitcoin as a completely deflationary model but things are clear now.

It has a fixed total supply but many bitcoins were lost. We can not get an exact number of lost bitcoin but can estimate it based on inactive UTXOs.

• Like I make an example of estimation on lost bitcoins there
• HODL waves

• Controlled supply
• Equivalent Network Time

It is not correct to say Bitcoin has a deflationary model. It is inflationary with time. Just has a significant less inflation rate than all fiat currencies. So bitcoin maximalists want to exaggerate it with the term Deflationary model.
Bitcoin Inflation vs. Time

The growth of Bitcoin market value will heavily depend on good/valuable  projects getting built within the network, more horizontally (like *side*chains) and less vertically . And they must be according to Bitcoin principles to be considered valuable and part of the Network.

No Proof of Stake (PoS) project will ever be part of the Bitcoin Network as that seriously violate the Bitcoin Principle. Beside, PoS is cursed evil/faudulent consensus mechanism. It will bring problems to the Network and should be rejected.
 A different PoW type could be used if they don't want the current one

We are living in the era of IOTs and humans made every possible things to be run as on automations so i wonder there remains any place for developers to not make such tools to automate difference between these transactions in this competitive market.

There are numerous websites or tools that will automatically differentiate between btc transactions and tell you at the spot either its segwit or taprooted.

• Blockstream.info
• Mempool.space
• Bitcoin Core--> well its almost manual because you have to enter some commands in order to get output.

Secondly, i would say, its hard to find taproot-base txids. because most of the users use segwit base system.

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For you OP, compilation seems to be good and clear, well i hope you could add why taproot is better than seg wit or any other proposal for bitcoin such as Graftroot and others, well i know these are not implemented yet but i hope thorough detail with sequence, make much interesting compilation.


I do not know maybe graftroot will do the work. well i am not as supporter of that proposal but L2 problems can be handled when the right time comes. because BTC is going to be decentralized. 

fastest way is the prefix.
bc1q=segwit
bc1p=taproot

a UTXO put into a transactions input to spend it does not actually show the "address" in raw blockchain data
it just shows the txid of previous tx and the output position it wants to spend

so you would have to look up the spending txid and find the output anyway

so the fastest way if your looking for an individual tx "type" is to just paste the spending txid into a blockexplorer and use eyes at the prefix
or you could try grabbing the input txid search block data for its output and do things the slower way

Really? I'm curious how do you determine which transactions are segwit or are taproot in the network. I understand you can click every TXID and use the difference in wallet address format just by  looking at the prefix. Is there a better or faster way for an average user to look at this?