Topic: Bitcoin plus - is it owned by a member of this forum? - RANT ALERT! - page 3. (Read 13359 times)

@BCEmporium: No idea who you are talking to, but it seems like you are the one that doesn't understand the Fees, they are just their to get someone to include your transaction in the blockchain. its blatantly obvious we wont make a profit but if us CPU mining makes you that upset, I'm sure if you send each of us 1 BTC we would be more then willing to stop just to make you happy. Oh and if it was directed at me, i don't like your attitude, in fact i don't like it regardless and i have a few choice words for you that ill keep to myself. G'day sir.

Per definition, miners are greedy, micro-miners are greedier... if you don't try to withdraw rightaway I guess he could had lift that fee, because is a NETWORK FEE, not a house fee! If you can't even figure out how bitcoin works and just want to dip in the free money, sorry...
And for god sake stop using those damn CPU pools, you will NEVER make enough to pay the electrical you spend by doing it that way! Rather ask your parents to buy you 1btc at some btc market.

hopefully this is easy enough to follow along my anger at this got the best of me

I 100% agree!! complete Bleeping scam. I've only been around for a few weeks and everything he said is exactly what i thought.

The owner hides the .01 btc MINIMUM for transfer until you go to the transfer page. while this is not a big deal, idealy id have liked to transfer it sooner. I had no clue untill then that i needed .01 minimum. so like the above guy said "its understandable" to have to wait. so while its my fault that i didnt check *every* page on his website, he Certainly didnt make this fee upfront. but forget about that for now here is the real 'gotcha'.

The real scam here is that it litterly doesnt mention *anything* *anywhere* about needing .02 BTC for the /actual/ transfer it ONLY says ".01 btc minimum for transfer".

the owner basically strings you alone with "well you have .004 btc! might as well stick around till you get .01 btc and can transfer it out, after all you earned it!" but once you get that .01 btc you find out the REAL minimum is .02 btc.. so now you have to wait around for another .01 btc or you end up throwing away the .01 btc you already have, effectivly donateing it to the site owner. so if at any point you leave... because you never withdraw the amount of BTC you've earnd the owner effectivly gets to keep it since the BTC is in his account and he only has to pay transfer fees on each of those small amounts *if* he transfers them out.

i only mention the following because someone else did as well and because i had the exact same reaction. it Seems like the amount he pays out drops over time as well as well as the frequency of payments, it Seems like hes double dipping. which is why i tested out a Real CPU miner... which i make allot more on. in 4 days, (not nights) I've made as much i had in the last 2-3 weeks.

some of you can say "its only a few pennies, and their are fees!" but i really don't care, the facts stand, the fees are hidden to string you along so when you eventually give up he gets to keep the money. Aside from that, he can lump multiple withdraw transactions together to reduce the overall cost(unless im just wrong on this, transactions have a limit in data size, not number of people included in the transaction). he can also simply push them out with no transaction fee since that limitation is client side and not in the protocol itself, i really wouldn't mind waiting 24 hours or a week to get the BTC considering a i spent 2-3 weeks getting it in the first place.

and for those of you thinking "why bother for so little?" its because It's freaking cool! then why am i pissed? because of the principal of it! and if TWO people are pissed, you can be sure their are more. this guy is certainly doing a great job to help out the image of bitcoin lets all give him some applauds! *claps for the site owner*.

id love to see how much btc is waiting to be given out from inactive accounts. heck he could even have a "donate your btc to xyz charity" then every time he reached 10.01 btc he could simply send it to the charity rather then keeping it.

oh and while I'm at it, the Ufasoft CPU miner that does GPU's as well works much better.. and doesn't require any installs.

forum page for all miners -> http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=16125.0




Link to other thread complaining about the same thing -> http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=17099.0

Been using it for 10 days now. Page only closes when I close it. It's never logged me out (and I have it logged in on a desktop and laptop at home, and a desk top at work). Seeing as this is a browser miner, chances are most users have pretty low performance computers and THAT's the problem.

As for the payouts, sending an email to him and asking him to change his minimum payout to match the new bitcoin client could work.

Just saying...

I assure you, I do not always defend BitcoinPlus, please research my posts, I tend to talk highly of Bitp.it, but in this case and one other brought up recently in the Newbie forum, it's hard not to see BCP's side on this matter, it is plain and simple a lack of a site update that is getting the site labeled as a scam.  You can clearly see this stemming from bitterness regarding misunderstanding how browser mining could work, obviously not on an individual level.  There is no scam.

BTW, thanks, I'm photogenic

Sorry Porn, but you're only defending the site because you let their software run on your porn site.
Quite understandable that you want to defend the site then.
Don't get me wrong - it's ok to do so IF it is disclosed.
Even the BCP policy was ok if disclosed.
The SCAM is that they don't.

BTW nice pics on your site

On top of being established with a fee system in place that is different value than when the site started, on top of how much a Bitcoin was 'worth', which of course changing by the minute... oh yeah.. also, scams usually try and sell you something.  They offer a service for a fee, in the end the service itself is provided.

I can see how the site and business isn't being run up to date and current, but they sure don't have to, and at this point with how people are attacking the site, I don't think half the users complaining deserve any explanation on anything with how little they seem to want to view things from BitcoinPlus' side.   

Yes, but it achieves nothing. Your CPU is maxed out to 100% by the applet anyway, so opening further pages just results in the same computing power but split across multiple applets. Ergo achieved nothing.

You can of course open the multiple pages on different computers. That's what I do, and indeed the site owner recommends that.

I personally disagree that it's a scam for two reasons:

1) As I said, the 0.01BTC fee is actually a relatively new feature. When the site first opened, there was no withdrawal fee and the cost was absorbed by the site (i.e. its owner). So what happened was that people--like the OP--started mining tiny <0.02BTC amounts and then withdrawing them regularly. That meant that the site owner got hit with a 0.01 fee for transactions that were often less that 0.01BTC in themselves. Not cost effective, so he introduced passing the fee on to the clients. Now I agree that that should be better communicated, but it's not a "scam", just poor communication (or at worst, not being up front)

2) I have successfully mined about 0.20BTC and successfully withdrawn it. If it was a true scam, the withdrawals would have just failed and the owner would have pocketed what little I had earned.

This is not a site that is trying to trick you out of your money (which is what a scam is). This is a site that had bad foresight as to how users would use the system, and a front page that isn't blindingly obvious that withdrawal transaction fees are passed on.

can you open more than one page?

if it's a scam how is he making money..I think it's a good idea I just learned about this now lol

That's just lack of information. NOT A SCAM damn it!

Gosh, these folks are doing a lot of noise out of 0,15 cents (at current rate)... are you 9 yo kids or what?!

Sorry, but it is a scam! Not only a scam but a strike of genius, too!

Here is the reason why:

1.) After your first payout(s) you try to transfer to your wallet whatever little you "mined"

=> This is the first time EVER that you're informed that the minimum transfer is 0.01 BTC
=> To the newbie, who just got his/her very first BTC this is frustrating but somewhat understandable, so you keep your machine running till the total of all your payouts exceed 0.01 BTC

2.) Second transfer attempt:
Now, the proud owner of 0.01x BTC finally wants to transfer the coins to his/her wallet. And BAM:
Now you get informed (FOR THE FIRST TIME EVER AGIAN) that you have to pay a 0.01 BTC transfer fee and that any transaction has to be a multiple of 0.01 BTC (i. e. that you have to "mine" at least 0.02 BTC and losing half of it to transfer fees).

=> At this point the devestated newbie realizes that this is not a fun way to start mining and stops using the service, leaving the owner with hundreds if not thousands of left newbie accounts

If the owner would clearly state that:

a) minimum transfer is 0.02 BTC (with a 0.01 BTC transaction fee)
b) transfers are possible only as multiples of 0.01 BTC

THEN it would be a poor deal.

This way it is utter scam!

Not scam just poorly run and the issue was the inherit fee in the system.

Real life counterpart:
I go to shop by something for 0.98€, then I pay it with 1€ coin, I don't get my 2 cents back, as Finland don't use those. I'm not screaming scam, I just accept it...

tim, the set up it seems like you have, means that maybe there is a way to do a mini-pool of mining over just the computers you have, I believe that can be done and people in the forums would help with that.

It's not a scam. But it is a poor deal.

julz,

If you just have cents, you'll be eaten by fees no matter where in Earth. Is like a poker player with low stack being eaten by the blinds...

Just that I found somewhat nearly funny some guys come out like shouting scammer at some one or "call the «bitpolice» this address ALHLH12kbdjkbk12334... just robbed me 0.32 btc!!!!".
But I understand your point, back on that mtgox mess I lost over 20 btc and still didn't bother or complaint much (lesson learned: not use the same u:p combo in more than 1 site), as I've much more, but for someone with 20'something that would be almost all or all of what he have.

While I agree with you that the leap to use the word 'scam' isn't helpful
- neither I think is the implied attitude that 'cents' or even tiny fractions thereof don't matter.
They matter a great deal to new bitcoin users - who may have about 0.01BTC total and are interested in trying out the system.

Really - I think many must have walked away from bitcoin because it feels like their wallet is just being eaten up by fees - just like the ordinary banking systems.

I know bitcoin isn't really optimised for microtransactions, but due to the uneven wealth distribution - this is already a problem for uptake.

If anything, this just points out the potential problems of pool-mining. You are at the mercy of the operator, who sets the fees and such. Like others have stated, you have two possible choices. One, just quit, or Two - set up your own. That is just the way it is.

Don't know what version of bitcoind and OS are they running, the latest builds nags if they're using Debian 5 for an instance, so their fee may still be 0.01.
Anyway, CPU mining is inefficient and can't compete with GPU mining. So any possible earnings of CPU mining pools will be small.

if you think it's a scam, stop using it!

rocket science it is not.