FUD
Please post your FUD on one of the other threads. This thread is not for debating what I do.
This is fair.
What exactly is this thread for then, with the new thread for announcements, etc?
Topic: Bitcoin Savings and Trust | Home | Closed - page 3. (Read 802116 times)
Please post your FUD on one of the other threads. This thread is not for debating what I do.
This is fair.
What exactly is this thread for then, with the new thread for announcements, etc?
FUD
Please post your FUD on one of the other threads. This thread is not for debating what I do.
Disclosure: I pulled all of my money from pirate. I had around $1000 dollars in it, which compared to my income is a large amount. I could no longer ignore the feeling in my gut.
That being said, this situation is getting to the point of ridiculousness. Pirate just keeps assuring people he is legit, without ever really doing anything else besides paying out 7%. He never states what he is doing, he just has some secret where he can pull BTC from some unknown source to give back to investors. It resembles a ponzi, I'm sorry but it does. I've watched the bonds issued by Goat and Foo grow every week as more and more people join in. Pirate can't prove he isn't a ponzi, and if anyone says contrary it just turns into a flame war and gets nowhere.
I don't know if it's legit, I don't know if it's illegitimate. Nobody does. The retarded amount of flaming is a sad state of affairs. I appreciate opposing view points, there is no reason not to. Investing money is serious business, and people deserve all the information they can get their hands on. Unfortunately, there isn't much information to be found. All people see is 7%. Until Pirate comes out and gives a detailed description of what he does, the theories will keep on coming.
Sorry pirate (assuming your legit) but it's inescapable. This is a very high risk investment due to the lack of information. I knew that when I signed up, and I'm sure others do to. You can't be mad when people point out the raging similarities between your operation and a ponzi.
1) No information
2) Nice returns for investors
3) Ever increasing amounts of money thrown your way
4) Capital based incentives (at this point)
You can't escape these claims until more transparency is provided about your operation. You won't. Sorry. Get used to it.
On Pirate's side are people assuring a legitimate operation based solely on returns (up to this point), which investment-wise is a fair point. On the other side are people pointing out the similarities between this operation and a ponzi, also a fair point. Bad news Pirate's side, your assurance is how a ponzi operation works, so it's not really evidence to the contrary.
Anyone with their head not wedged tightly in their ass could step back and see the merits of the opposing argument. What they are saying DOES make sense, it looks EXACTLY like a ponzi. That doesn't mean it is, and it is up to investors to weigh the pros and cons before investing.
All this being said, since I cannot prove or disprove your legitimacy, I would like to thank you for my returns for 5 weeks. I had GLBSE investments provided by Goat and Foo and never had a problem with either of them.
If you are illegitimate, I'll see you in hell.
That being said, this situation is getting to the point of ridiculousness. Pirate just keeps assuring people he is legit, without ever really doing anything else besides paying out 7%. He never states what he is doing, he just has some secret where he can pull BTC from some unknown source to give back to investors. It resembles a ponzi, I'm sorry but it does. I've watched the bonds issued by Goat and Foo grow every week as more and more people join in. Pirate can't prove he isn't a ponzi, and if anyone says contrary it just turns into a flame war and gets nowhere.
I don't know if it's legit, I don't know if it's illegitimate. Nobody does. The retarded amount of flaming is a sad state of affairs. I appreciate opposing view points, there is no reason not to. Investing money is serious business, and people deserve all the information they can get their hands on. Unfortunately, there isn't much information to be found. All people see is 7%. Until Pirate comes out and gives a detailed description of what he does, the theories will keep on coming.
Sorry pirate (assuming your legit) but it's inescapable. This is a very high risk investment due to the lack of information. I knew that when I signed up, and I'm sure others do to. You can't be mad when people point out the raging similarities between your operation and a ponzi.
1) No information
2) Nice returns for investors
3) Ever increasing amounts of money thrown your way
4) Capital based incentives (at this point)
You can't escape these claims until more transparency is provided about your operation. You won't. Sorry. Get used to it.
On Pirate's side are people assuring a legitimate operation based solely on returns (up to this point), which investment-wise is a fair point. On the other side are people pointing out the similarities between this operation and a ponzi, also a fair point. Bad news Pirate's side, your assurance is how a ponzi operation works, so it's not really evidence to the contrary.
Anyone with their head not wedged tightly in their ass could step back and see the merits of the opposing argument. What they are saying DOES make sense, it looks EXACTLY like a ponzi. That doesn't mean it is, and it is up to investors to weigh the pros and cons before investing.
All this being said, since I cannot prove or disprove your legitimacy, I would like to thank you for my returns for 5 weeks. I had GLBSE investments provided by Goat and Foo and never had a problem with either of them.
If you are illegitimate, I'll see you in hell.
woof woof!
Nice to see YOU again here Mr. Dog.
Someone throw him a bone, please !
woof woof!
He won't want one soon, since the passthroughs pay more now... 
Now if only I could a referral...
You won't need one soon! 
Pirate, do you have a Skype or other VoIP account? Why not hold a conference and assuage your inventors.
I'm pretty sure it's not his investors who are bombarding him with questions
Pirate, do you have a Skype or other VoIP account? Why not hold a conference and assuage your inventors.
I have no need to hold a conference call to talk about anything that they don't already know. What do you mean?
Pirate, do you have a Skype or other VoIP account? Why not hold a conference and assuage your inventors.
Bitcoin is not fiat yet. That doesn't mean it won't be at some point nor does it mean I don't believe in it. There's simply no reason at this time for me to risk market movements with my converted fiat > bitcoin
Riiiight ok, that's a valid reason.. Except there's one tiny little problem with your story: Your clients haven't had any loses yet even though the price rose which should have meant that you couldn't have possibly bought back all the bitcoins people "invested" with you that you initially, as you claim, converted to fiat. How is this possible? How are you able to meet your obligations even though the risk event for which you insured yourself against by using other people's bitcoins clearly happened?Do you really think someone that manages as many coins as I do, doesn't have an influence on market movements? What I do with the coins is my business and my lenders are well aware of the risks associated with entrusting someone with them. If anyone has a reason to not trust me with their coins they're more than welcome to withdraw them.
I'm done discussing the same stuff over and over, if someone has something new to add fine but until then... I be havin' t' get aft t' me ship.
So you basically have no answer why your clients HAVEN'T lost money "investing" with you after the recent significant exchange rate increase, which is the risk you hedge against by using their money instead of your own?
I really wish you knew what you were talking about.
Ok really, I'm done.
Btw people should pay attention to this ^. It's a serious red flag and he's "done" explaining..
We're all filled up on crazy here! Got FUD? Check out these threads.
inb4 thread locked again. - A Theory on what pirateat40 is doing
- The Bond party is a HYIP scam party
- BS&T -- Are you staying or leaving?
On a more serious side, why is there a sudden surge of people attacking BS&T?
Personally I got inspired by the EVE story which pirate's business has a remarkable similarity with, but it also reminded me of my crossing paths with ponzi scams irl and the devastation it always causes and so I couldn't help myself but to be another voice of serious concern in hopes to save some people from unnecessarily losing their hard earned money.
We're all filled up on crazy here! Got FUD? Check out these threads.
inb4 thread locked again. - A Theory on what pirateat40 is doing
- The Bond party is a HYIP scam party
- BS&T -- Are you staying or leaving?
On a more serious side, why is there a sudden surge of people attacking BS&T?
We're all filled up on crazy here! Got FUD? Check out these threads.
Email alerts suck!
Guys, guys...this is an easy fix.
If you want to know if he's lying or not, just ask him to swear on his grandmother's grave and promise that he's not running a ponzi.
Easy peasy.
If you want to know if he's lying or not, just ask him to swear on his grandmother's grave and promise that he's not running a ponzi.
Easy peasy.
hazek: we may be talking around each other. I'm just saying that his hedge only helps if the BTCUSD drops, and if it rises, he has extra liability. This is probably what you're saying as well.
Not at all. His "hedge" is that he is using other people's money. If the BTCUSD rate drops, he makes more, if it goes up his clients lose, or so the story goes. His clients should have lost money with the recent significant exchange rate increase, they haven't, why? Because he's not really exchanging anything.
Okay, when you say 'clients' do you mean the people giving him BTC or the people supposedly giving him $? I'm talking about the people giving him BTC. And I'm saying that under the assumption that somehow pirate is doing something legit or semi-legit, having to pay people back in BTC is good for him if BTCUSD goes down and harder for him if it goes up. I'm not entirely sure what you're saying. It might be something about his supposed real-world ($) clients losing money?
-bgc
He claims:
- he is facing risk when converting BTC to fiat and back
- therefor he is using other people's money to do his investing to avoid a loss if BTCUSD goes up
My conclusions:
- the risk event he is hedging against by using other people's money has happened
- his clients haven't lost money when they should have
- he isn't really exchanging anything
- his stated reason for giving up some of his "profits" and using other people's money is bogus
Who said he is converting directly to FIAT, though? For instance, I've personally traded a few intermediate currencies to get from BTC to USD, and in turn draw in a bigger profit for a lower USD to BTC price. It's quite possible if you know what you're doing.
Riiiight ok, that's a valid reason.. Except there's one tiny little problem with your story: Your clients haven't had any loses yet even though the price rose which should have meant that you couldn't have possibly bought back all the bitcoins people "invested" with you that you initially, as you claim, converted to fiat. How is this possible? How are you able to meet your obligations even though the risk event for which you insured yourself against by using other people's bitcoins clearly happened?
Do you really think someone that manages as many coins as I do, doesn't have an influence on market movements? What I do with the coins is my business and my lenders are well aware of the risks associated with entrusting someone with them. If anyone has a reason to not trust me with their coins they're more than welcome to withdraw them.
I'm done discussing the same stuff over and over, if someone has something new to add fine but until then... I be havin' t' get aft t' me ship.
So you basically have no answer why your clients HAVEN'T lost money "investing" with you after the recent significant exchange rate increase, which is the risk you hedge against by using their money instead of your own?
I really wish you knew what you were talking about.
Ok really, I'm done.
We'll see about that in a new thread, coming soon
hazek: we may be talking around each other. I'm just saying that his hedge only helps if the BTCUSD drops, and if it rises, he has extra liability. This is probably what you're saying as well.
Not at all. His "hedge" is that he is using other people's money. If the BTCUSD rate drops, he makes more, if it goes up his clients lose, or so the story goes. His clients should have lost money with the recent significant exchange rate increase, they haven't, why? Because he's not really exchanging anything.
Okay, when you say 'clients' do you mean the people giving him BTC or the people supposedly giving him $? I'm talking about the people giving him BTC. And I'm saying that under the assumption that somehow pirate is doing something legit or semi-legit, having to pay people back in BTC is good for him if BTCUSD goes down and harder for him if it goes up. I'm not entirely sure what you're saying. It might be something about his supposed real-world ($) clients losing money?
-bgc
He claims:
- he is facing risk when converting BTC to fiat and back
- therefor he is using other people's money to do his investing to avoid a loss if BTCUSD goes up
My conclusions:
- the risk event he is hedging against by using other people's money has happened
- his clients haven't lost money when they should have
- he isn't really exchanging anything
- his stated reason for giving up some of his "profits" and using other people's money is bogus
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