Topic: Bitcoin Savings and Trust is probably a Ponzi Scheme: A Petition - page 12. (Read 25616 times)

Defaulting is bad I believe, owing people. Even if there is a slightest chance, why are people buying into this?

Edit:
I've been lurking at the BTC saving & trust & the pirate thing.

Whole situation feels eerie.

On the 14th, I'm even pulling out from IneedAUsername, as I pm'd him multiple times and have not got a reply yet.

OP, put your money, if you have any, where your mouth is or just STFU...

And believe me, this ^^ is good advice. And I'm giving it for free when I should charge for it

These people dont want to risk their own coins on this happening - They just want a way to say "I told you so " if it does.

Does that also apply to bananas, bikes, boating safety courses, big block chevys and beer ?

Thank you for enlightening me. I had no idea. Any other words of wisdom?

I was talking about paying for stuff like pasta, piano lessons, paperback books, picture frames, and anything else people regularly purchase without fear of being discovered.

Yes, Must be good vodka.....considering it's actually Thursday night....

I'll quote Joel's post just because it's valuable- I''l read it again later.  (mega respect attracting his attention to this corner of the world)

Ever think Pirate or (fill in blank - I know who he is, but you ass is too lazy to work it out) enjoys the speculation.  I've paid serious coin for fun, 1% would be worth it.

Friday night - good quality vodka (paid for by coins), and P@40 is just one of many schemes in the game.  Get a life - it's just small - many more out there, but people too stupid to look.

(disclaimer - the Starfish blah blah vodka blah)

Only Pirate can answer that question. Without knowing what Pirate's actually doing, there's no way to know how he could demonstrate it wasn't a Ponzi scheme.. It depends on precisely how what he's doing is different from a Ponzi scheme. Presumably, something about that difference would be provable. If it's literally impossible to prove it's not a Ponzi scheme, then it's a Ponzi scheme. If two things are indistinguishable, then they're the same thing.

Something in this direction would be nice.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.881737





Okay, I've made my point.

At the end of the day, people are free to invest any way they wish.

By actually demonstrating he knows what he's talking about. If he can do that, show backdated examples, and explain his models, then I'll get him a six to seven figure job working for a hedge fund. I know a few quants that would pay top dollar for his legitimate trading strategies.

Local transactions? Seriously? Market arbitrage? Private loans? That can mean anything. Here, watch me take a 100 dollar bill from one pocket and put it in my other pocket. Why not Unicorn Arbitrage?


What Pirate fails to understand is that his returns are outliers relative to all other legit investments. How many standard deviations does it take before this sinks in?


I'm sure Pirate will continue to show great returns and make people money, but those profits likely come from the people who lose everything at the end.


You can lead a horse to water......



Money laundering and cocaine...yeah, that's much better than a ponzi scheme.  

More reliable, I suppose.

But a red herring nonetheless.

Not that I care what other people do with their free time. To each his own, but am I the only one that wants to see bitcoin succeed as a currency that's actually used in everyday commerce, not just shady transactions? Go ahead and launder money and buy cocaine for all I care, but here let's focus instead on what Pirate actually claims.

And why should I bring proof to the table, when I'm not the one claiming such absurd investment returns?

God forbid someone should ask questions about a smoke and mirrors investment fund!

I never saw 'Optional Cocaine Payments Coming Soon' in Pirate's BTCST Thread, but I still have my fingers crossed

Dare to dream Arnold.....Dare to dream (if you are not Western Canadian, you will have no idea as to the reference)

Would you like an Account Referral ?
I'm in good standing.....

I hope you realize I am screwing with you.

Remember me ? I started the 'Free TerryTibbs' from scammer status campaign.....lol

If I believed he would default or run off today, I'd have bought Meni's anti-pirate bonds. There is still money to be made here if you play it right, but in the long term, it's a ponzi. I'm fairly certain.

Bullshit !


You got turned down for an account.....I was THERE in the thread....LOL
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.658272

I also fully believe this is a ponzi scheme.

I agree.

And "then don't invest" is a shoddy excuse, because it ignore the debasement of the forum and bitcoin's reputation, as well as unsuspecting investors who aren't savvy enough to realize their money is being used to steal from future investors.

Absent an explanation of how Pirate generates such profits, ponzi is the most likely explanation. Quantitatively, it's obvious from just a glance that his alpha relative to his beta against any standard benchmark puts him way beyond the Madoff level in terms of incredulity. Am I the only one that considers risk? Either Pirate is the greatest investor who's ever lived, or he's going to teach people a tough lesson in finance. Remember that people do actually make money in ponzi schemes, and that they can last for years. But they all end the same: disaster. As I mentioned in another thread, revealing the strategy of one's investing technique does not reveal the actual investing process or "give away" any substantive information. Revealing that one's fund engages in spatial arbitrage or out-of-the-money options or equity straddles tells investors nothing about how the fund allocates capital, but it does give them deeper understanding into the process.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.

And it shouldn't be hard to demonstrate if it's legit.

The OP brings up a good point, because the reason we ask tough questions is because people actually get ripped off and wiped out by so-called investments that have numbers commensurate with Pirate's numbers.


Bitcoin has incredible potential. I don't want to see it sabotaged before its time and have its reputation sullied by a few dodgy "investment funds."

Nor do I want to see bitcointalk degenerate into a HYIP forum.

Satoshi developed something incredible, but these "investments" are what you all settle for?

If Pirate really is as good as claims, then he should be able to explain, at least in general terms, how he generates profits.

And if he does demonstrate that he's not running a ponzi scheme, then I'll humbly apologize.

Sig worthy!

Some people seem to find this concept hard to grasp.

He only want's access to all the addresses he uses... and the people he does business with... and his bitcoinica positions... and a small commission... and his Mt. Gox password... and his private keys.

Well, I'm committing my username to the statement, "Pirate's BTCST is not a Ponzi scheme."
Also, please state your opinion on GPUMAX, a nontrivial piece of work with a nontrivial amount of hashes behind it.  Please state your opinion on, as previous posters have mentioned, Pirate's publicly known identity and address. 
Have you considered that if Pirate made it clear exactly what he was doing, everyone would be doing it?  What financial disclosure, specifically, do you want from him? 
Note that even mining gives 10% monthly returns (and more, if you use Pirate's wonderful GPUMAX service).  The Bitcoin economy is a high-yield economy.