IMV, Bitcoin/CC is only necessary because of the existence of fiat legal tender. If the government didn't hold a monopoly on money I wouldn't put so much hope into CC. If we had private competing currencies there'd be little need for CC, tho, of course, it could still be very useful and perhaps still quite profitable.
In short, I don't particular want BTC to replace fiat, I just want non governmental currencies.
Topic: Bitcoin simply cannot replace fiat - page 2. (Read 7201 times)
Are we talking global replacement of fiat
if we are I cannot see the 4 billion people who are poor and do not have a smart phone or pc being able to use a crypto currency
if we are I cannot see the 4 billion people who are poor and do not have a smart phone or pc being able to use a crypto currency
Not in the near future. But how can you be so sure that by AD 2100, not everyone will have access to internet?
Also, if BTC becomes mainstream, third party companies will spring up (just like today's banks) who will make the transactions easier.
http://techcrunch.com/2013/10/07/itu-6-8b-mobile-subs-by-end-of-2013-nearly-as-many-people-as-there-are-on-earth-2-7b-on-any-kind-of-internet/
we are all here now.
Are we talking global replacement of fiat
if we are I cannot see the 4 billion people who are poor and do not have a smart phone or pc being able to use a crypto currency
if we are I cannot see the 4 billion people who are poor and do not have a smart phone or pc being able to use a crypto currency
Not in the near future. But how can you be so sure that by AD 2100, not everyone will have access to internet?
Also, if BTC becomes mainstream, third party companies will spring up (just like today's banks) who will make the transactions easier.
Are we talking global replacement of fiat
if we are I cannot see the 4 billion people who are poor and do not have a smart phone or pc being able to use a crypto currency
if we are I cannot see the 4 billion people who are poor and do not have a smart phone or pc being able to use a crypto currency
http://letstalkbitcoin.com/bitcoin-simply-cannot-replace-fiat/#.UpmkkcRpmEw
Yes or no? What do you think?
Yes or no? What do you think?
Bitcoin won't replace fiat but crypto-currency certainly will. It's a better form of money, hands down. I suspect we'll see many different cryptos utilized all over the world. Just like we have many different government fiats around the world.
The thinking that banks or countries will buy Bitcoin to use as currency, is really absurd. They'll just create their own. I think some people forget the code is open sourced and there is no benefit to banks, governments or even the Paypal/Amazons of the world, buying a crypto just to make current holders richer, when they can just create a new one and make themselves rich.
The takeaway from that should be that when BTC captures even more of the value that is currently held in other commodities, such as gold, that BTC will continue to increase in value. Which are easier to store & transport...bitcoins or gold bars & coins? Which are easier to use for commerce directly? Bitcoin only has a tiny fraction of the total value held in other commodities, and has the capability of becoming far more useful. So, of the two, an oz of gold seems rather overpriced to me now and a bitcoin seems like an astounding bargain even at current prices.
Though technically I have no objection to what you just said (less bitcoins per capita driving prices up and all that), but I still have a kind of anxiety, or rather uneasy consideration, which is not emotional in nature (I don't have that much to lose and already profited handsomely), that Bitcoin should soon crash into the ground even if people are trying to withhold it. I would call that Bitcoin singularity (the end of this) when a constantly increasing price comes along with an ever increasing volatility and yet lower volume is causing still more extreme changes of price. A feeling that something is terribly wrong with Bitcoin...
Bitcoin will not replace fiat or gold or anything else whatsoever although is has the potential to disrupt markets like that of international remmitances.
Bitcoin is worth more than gold already, apparently. :-)
Compare the $13 billion market cap of BTC to the estimated total net worth of all the gold ever mined on earth (some 200,000 tonnes, worth $9 trillion).
Ok what will happen if do that comparison? Something that will actually make sense?
The comparison of the price of 1 bitcoin with the price of 1 ounce of gold is meant for pr buzz reasons and holds no other value whatsoever.
The takeaway from that should be that when BTC captures even more of the value that is currently held in other commodities, such as gold, that BTC will continue to increase in value. Which are easier to store & transport...bitcoins or gold bars & coins? Which are easier to use for commerce directly? Bitcoin only has a tiny fraction of the total value held in other commodities, and has the capability of becoming far more useful. So, of the two, an oz of gold seems rather overpriced to me now and a bitcoin seems like an astounding bargain even at current prices.
Bitcoin will not replace fiat or gold or anything else whatsoever although is has the potential to disrupt markets like that of international remmitances.
Bitcoin is worth more than gold already, apparently. :-)
Compare the $13 billion market cap of BTC to the estimated total net worth of all the gold ever mined on earth (some 200,000 tonnes, worth $9 trillion).
Ok what will happen if do that comparison? Something that will actually make sense?
The comparison of the price of 1 bitcoin with the price of 1 ounce of gold is meant for pr buzz reasons and holds no other value whatsoever.
Bitcoin will not replace fiat or gold or anything else whatsoever although is has the potential to disrupt markets like that of international remmitances.
Bitcoin is worth more than gold already, apparently. :-)
Compare the $13 billion market cap of BTC to the estimated total net worth of all the gold ever mined on earth (some 200,000 tonnes, worth $9 trillion).
Bitcoin will not replace fiat or gold or anything else whatsoever although is has the potential to disrupt markets like that of international remmitances.
Bitcoin is worth more than gold already, apparently. :-)
Actually no because gold's price is per kg or gram or ounce and you can't weigh bitcoins anyway
Bitcoin will not replace fiat or gold or anything else whatsoever although is has the potential to disrupt markets like that of international remmitances.
Bitcoin is worth more than gold already, apparently. :-)
Bitcoin will not replace fiat or gold or anything else whatsoever although is has the potential to disrupt markets like that of international remmitances.
http://bitcoinrichlist.com/top500
Using the top 500 address list there are a number of wallets with no activity since 2010 and 2011. The probability that these are LOST addresses is high as is the value.
Anyone want to work out the % of coins involved?
Using the top 500 address list there are a number of wallets with no activity since 2010 and 2011. The probability that these are LOST addresses is high as is the value.
Anyone want to work out the % of coins involved?
On another thread this was calculated at 463k coins in 115 wallets in the top 500 which is 3.8% of 12M coins potentially dead/lost
It was Rothschild / Rockerfeller et al
http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-federal-reserve-cartel-the-eight-families
http://land.netonecom.net/tlp/ref/federal_reserve.shtml
http://www.2012.com.au/Federal_Reserve.html
Some names
) Lord Jacob de Rothschild.
2) Son Nathaniel.
3) Baron John de Rothschild, who recently said they’re working towards global governance. (NOTE: The Rothschild Dynasty is worth some 500 Trillion dollars. Just about half the world’s wealth)
4) Sir Evelyn de Rothschild.
5) David Rockefeller, Sr. who’s son Nick, while making him an offer for Nevada Governorship, told film director Aaron Russo (now deceased ) about 9/11 in advance. (Refuse a Rockefeller order, and you may end up dead). (NOTE: The Rockefeller dynasty controls over 100 Trillion dollars)
6) Nathan Warburg, whose family, was not only instrumental in creating the treasonous Federal Reserve, but along
7) Sakamoto Rothschild , known for the most diabolical invention in human history B....n
Just saying http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-federal-reserve-cartel-the-eight-families
http://land.netonecom.net/tlp/ref/federal_reserve.shtml
http://www.2012.com.au/Federal_Reserve.html
Some names
) Lord Jacob de Rothschild.
2) Son Nathaniel.
3) Baron John de Rothschild, who recently said they’re working towards global governance. (NOTE: The Rothschild Dynasty is worth some 500 Trillion dollars. Just about half the world’s wealth)
4) Sir Evelyn de Rothschild.
5) David Rockefeller, Sr. who’s son Nick, while making him an offer for Nevada Governorship, told film director Aaron Russo (now deceased ) about 9/11 in advance. (Refuse a Rockefeller order, and you may end up dead). (NOTE: The Rockefeller dynasty controls over 100 Trillion dollars)
6) Nathan Warburg, whose family, was not only instrumental in creating the treasonous Federal Reserve, but along
7) Sakamoto Rothschild , known for the most diabolical invention in human history B....n
It was Rothschild / Rockerfeller et al
http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-federal-reserve-cartel-the-eight-families
http://land.netonecom.net/tlp/ref/federal_reserve.shtml
http://www.2012.com.au/Federal_Reserve.html
Some names
) Lord Jacob de Rothschild.
2) Son Nathaniel.
3) Baron John de Rothschild, who recently said they’re working towards global governance. (NOTE: The Rothschild Dynasty is worth some 500 Trillion dollars. Just about half the world’s wealth)
4) Sir Evelyn de Rothschild.
5) David Rockefeller, Sr. who’s son Nick, while making him an offer for Nevada Governorship, told film director Aaron Russo (now deceased ) about 9/11 in advance. (Refuse a Rockefeller order, and you may end up dead). (NOTE: The Rockefeller dynasty controls over 100 Trillion dollars)
6) Nathan Warburg, whose family, was not only instrumental in creating the treasonous Federal Reserve, but along
http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-federal-reserve-cartel-the-eight-families
http://land.netonecom.net/tlp/ref/federal_reserve.shtml
http://www.2012.com.au/Federal_Reserve.html
Some names
) Lord Jacob de Rothschild.
2) Son Nathaniel.
3) Baron John de Rothschild, who recently said they’re working towards global governance. (NOTE: The Rothschild Dynasty is worth some 500 Trillion dollars. Just about half the world’s wealth)
4) Sir Evelyn de Rothschild.
5) David Rockefeller, Sr. who’s son Nick, while making him an offer for Nevada Governorship, told film director Aaron Russo (now deceased ) about 9/11 in advance. (Refuse a Rockefeller order, and you may end up dead). (NOTE: The Rockefeller dynasty controls over 100 Trillion dollars)
6) Nathan Warburg, whose family, was not only instrumental in creating the treasonous Federal Reserve, but along
You are a wise man Grasshopper.
My $.02.
To hazard a guess, assuming they didn't sell out, the largest shareholders will be the descendants/heirs of all the founders of each one of those 5 banks above, including all the banks they partnered/merged with.
Family money and genealogy isn't some vast conspiracy.
Lame.
Family money and genealogy isn't some vast conspiracy.
Lame.
I make no claims of a conspiracy. Just facts.
1. Printing currency is illegal
2. Banks have an exemption to this law
3. Any debt based currency will have more debt than money, therefore
4. The creditors will always be owed more than there is, therefore,
5. Most people will always be indebted (i.e. poor) and
6. Those with the printing exemption will never be indebted (i.e. rich)
No conspiracy. Just a fucked system that was fine 500 years ago but it can go now. I don't really care who they are. I do know they will do anything to keep their exemption, and have managed quite well to do so, which is not surprising given the nature of the exemption. But I do think that if they had a name and a face, people would be more inclined to ask what is so special about them to have this exemption. So they hide behind stone pillars and bricks and call it an institution. But it's just people with laws written to entitle them. Undoubtedly "family money", but really family laws. All the money in the FR system went away in '08, they held a negative reserve balance. So they made new rules, and created new money, which is the chart above.
I'd like to be able to do that too but I am not permitted to. Though bitcoin... close.
It was Rothschild / Rockerfeller et al
http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-federal-reserve-cartel-the-eight-families
http://land.netonecom.net/tlp/ref/federal_reserve.shtml
http://www.2012.com.au/Federal_Reserve.html
Some names
) Lord Jacob de Rothschild.
2) Son Nathaniel.
3) Baron John de Rothschild, who recently said they’re working towards global governance. (NOTE: The Rothschild Dynasty is worth some 500 Trillion dollars. Just about half the world’s wealth)
4) Sir Evelyn de Rothschild.
5) David Rockefeller, Sr. who’s son Nick, while making him an offer for Nevada Governorship, told film director Aaron Russo (now deceased ) about 9/11 in advance. (Refuse a Rockefeller order, and you may end up dead). (NOTE: The Rockefeller dynasty controls over 100 Trillion dollars)
6) Nathan Warburg, whose family, was not only instrumental in creating the treasonous Federal Reserve, but along
http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-federal-reserve-cartel-the-eight-families
http://land.netonecom.net/tlp/ref/federal_reserve.shtml
http://www.2012.com.au/Federal_Reserve.html
Some names
) Lord Jacob de Rothschild.
2) Son Nathaniel.
3) Baron John de Rothschild, who recently said they’re working towards global governance. (NOTE: The Rothschild Dynasty is worth some 500 Trillion dollars. Just about half the world’s wealth)
4) Sir Evelyn de Rothschild.
5) David Rockefeller, Sr. who’s son Nick, while making him an offer for Nevada Governorship, told film director Aaron Russo (now deceased ) about 9/11 in advance. (Refuse a Rockefeller order, and you may end up dead). (NOTE: The Rockefeller dynasty controls over 100 Trillion dollars)
6) Nathan Warburg, whose family, was not only instrumental in creating the treasonous Federal Reserve, but along
To hazard a guess, assuming they didn't sell out, the largest shareholders will be the descendants/heirs of all the founders of each one of those 5 banks above, including all the banks they partnered/merged with.
Family money and genealogy isn't some vast conspiracy.
Lame.
Family money and genealogy isn't some vast conspiracy.
Lame.
Name 5 of the 10 largest shareholders of the Federal Reserve
Hint
#1 Satoshi Naka..... (actually probably not. You're on your own.)
(edit- feel free to use google, phone a friend, call the Fed...anything you like. 10 BTC if you can name 5 of them.)
Hint
#1 Satoshi Naka..... (actually probably not. You're on your own.)
(edit- feel free to use google, phone a friend, call the Fed...anything you like. 10 BTC if you can name 5 of them.)
http://www.federalreserve.gov/faqs/about_14986.htm
Quote
The 12 regional Federal Reserve Banks, which were established by the Congress as the operating arms of the nation's central banking system, are organized similarly to private corporations--possibly leading to some confusion about "ownership." For example, the Reserve Banks issue shares of stock to member banks.
http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/h41/current/
9. Statement of Condition of Each Federal Reserve Bank, November 27, 2013
shows each regional reserve bank, but you probably mean the end shareholders, which are the member banks below:
http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/lbr/current/default.htm
(in millions, so #1 would be $1.947794e+12 USD, for example)
JPMORGAN CHASE BK NA/JPMORGAN CHASE & CO 1 852218 COLUMBUS, OH NAT 1,947,794
BANK OF AMER NA/BANK OF AMER CORP 2 480228 CHARLOTTE, NC NAT 1,429,737
CITIBANK NA/CITIGROUP 3 476810 SIOUX FALLS, SD NAT 1,319,359
WELLS FARGO BK NA/WELLS FARGO & CO 4 451965 SIOUX FALLS, SD NAT 1,284,538
U S BK NA/U S BC 5 504713 CINCINNATI, OH NAT 349,333
Don't have enough time to parse the foreign banks below but I'm not seeing any in the major allies over 349,333 million USD.
http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/iba/201303/bycntry.htm
Structure Data for the U.S. Offices of Foreign Banking Organizations
Yes that makes it all less opaque doesn't it.
So to answer the question, you incorporate as Bitcoinbehemoth Monstrosity NA, write covenants into your charter, hold the preferred stock with voting rights in the family vault, float a billion shares to the masses to stuff in their pension funds, completely diffusing any illusion of control over the entity, and hire a few lobbyists to buy the current government stooges and make sure they don't rock your boat.
If that was your objective, I mean.
Quote from: Bolded words from the above quote
Name 5 of the 10 largest shareholders of the Federal Reserve... 10 BTC if you can name 5 of them.
Seems transparent and question-answered to me, unless 1) those 5 aren't the largest shareholders/member banks and there are actually foreign banks with more, and I just need to parse the bycntry.htm list more closely 2) your definition of "shareholders" isn't the Fed's definition of shareholders, and you want to get even more granular and meant to ask "Name 5 of the 10 largest depositors into the Federal Reserve shareholder/member banks?" Which is a question that only the government could legally both ask and answer itself about. If I were one of those people, I wouldn't want anyone to fucking know, government or no government.
1BUTRZ85L1JuoX5y2XRjxJaYcjcMLhPJcY
Don't offer up bounties if you're not going to pay.
Names of institutions are not names of people. If you gave your handle to someone else I would be having this conversation with someine else now and have no idea.
That was not the topic. I am well aware for the structure of the Fed. If you want to spilt hairs there is no fed. It is the collective vault of its member companies. Who have of late sent their representatives to their board meetings to decide the best way to help everyone is to print themselves $85 cash every month, and keep it all for themselves, and pay themselves interest on their reserves.
Working out well for them.
http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/WRESBAL/
But no you did not answer my question.
I'd welch anyways that's a lot of money for a trivia question.
Name 5 of the 10 largest shareholders of the Federal Reserve
Hint
#1 Satoshi Naka..... (actually probably not. You're on your own.)
(edit- feel free to use google, phone a friend, call the Fed...anything you like. 10 BTC if you can name 5 of them.)
Hint
#1 Satoshi Naka..... (actually probably not. You're on your own.)
(edit- feel free to use google, phone a friend, call the Fed...anything you like. 10 BTC if you can name 5 of them.)
http://www.federalreserve.gov/faqs/about_14986.htm
Quote
The 12 regional Federal Reserve Banks, which were established by the Congress as the operating arms of the nation's central banking system, are organized similarly to private corporations--possibly leading to some confusion about "ownership." For example, the Reserve Banks issue shares of stock to member banks.
http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/h41/current/
9. Statement of Condition of Each Federal Reserve Bank, November 27, 2013
shows each regional reserve bank, but you probably mean the end shareholders, which are the member banks below:
http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/lbr/current/default.htm
(in millions, so #1 would be $1.947794e+12 USD, for example)
JPMORGAN CHASE BK NA/JPMORGAN CHASE & CO 1 852218 COLUMBUS, OH NAT 1,947,794
BANK OF AMER NA/BANK OF AMER CORP 2 480228 CHARLOTTE, NC NAT 1,429,737
CITIBANK NA/CITIGROUP 3 476810 SIOUX FALLS, SD NAT 1,319,359
WELLS FARGO BK NA/WELLS FARGO & CO 4 451965 SIOUX FALLS, SD NAT 1,284,538
U S BK NA/U S BC 5 504713 CINCINNATI, OH NAT 349,333
Don't have enough time to parse the foreign banks below but I'm not seeing any in the major allies over 349,333 million USD.
http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/iba/201303/bycntry.htm
Structure Data for the U.S. Offices of Foreign Banking Organizations
Yes that makes it all less opaque doesn't it.
So to answer the question, you incorporate as Bitcoinbehemoth Monstrosity NA, write covenants into your charter, hold the preferred stock with voting rights in the family vault, float a billion shares to the masses to stuff in their pension funds, completely diffusing any illusion of control over the entity, and hire a few lobbyists to buy the current government stooges and make sure they don't rock your boat.
If that was your objective, I mean.
Seems transparent and question-answered to me, unless 1) those 5 aren't the largest shareholders/member banks and there are actually foreign banks with more, and I just need to parse the bycntry.htm list more closely 2) your definition of "shareholders" isn't the Fed's definition of shareholders, and you want to get even more granular and meant to ask "Name 5 of the 10 largest depositors into the Federal Reserve shareholder/member banks?" Which is a question that only the government could legally both ask and answer itself about. If I were one of those people, I wouldn't want anyone to fucking know, government or no government.
Quote from: Bolded words from the above quote
Name 5 of the 10 largest shareholders of the Federal Reserve... 10 BTC if you can name 5 of them.
1BUTRZ85L1JuoX5y2XRjxJaYcjcMLhPJcY
Don't offer up bounties if you're not going to pay.
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