Topic: Bitcoin Was Perfect...............And Then Came The Utopians! (Read 4601 times)

NP; we are cool!

Thanks for your reply!

Sorry, I added to my thoughts after you responded. And they're not directed at you specifically.

No, that is not what I mean.

I refer to an underground economy which could still exist and be very, very profitable for those who have the intelligence and cojones to participate.

LostDutchman is the name and money is the game.

Would you care to play?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okjOi961fcc

My $.02.

You mean a "utopia"?

(Sorry, had to say it.)

Really, the "Well, it was good while it lasted" attitude of easy surrender I'm seeing on Reddit and forums is quite frankly pathetic, IMHO. Bitcoin is bigger than us. America decides that it wants to lay a heavy hand on Bitcoin? Fine, it will just redirect itself around that "error" and succeed in elsewhere in the world. Or it will evolve to meet the challenges placed upon it by an ever-deteriorating superpower. DarkWallet, for example.

Throwing up hands in despair at the first conspiratorial whiff of government intervention is juvenile. Scurrying off into ever smaller enclaves of altcoins is similarly juvenile. We live in the real world. If anyone thought the American government was going to look the other way and let Bitcoin jeopardize the future of its fiat is naive to say the least.

We meet challenges head on. At least those we believe in.

mine alt currency, what's the big fuzz. Srs. this thread is dumb

Not sure what your point was, but...

"Unhappy it is, though, to reflect that a brother's sword has been sheathed in a brother's breast and that the once-happy plains of America are either to be drenched with blood or inhabited by slaves. Sad alternative! But can a virtuous man hesitate in his choice?"

- George Washington

A hyper collective beyond Dunbars Numbers is always and per definition organized by organized violence (aka the state/church mafia). Capitalism is collectivism. No state - no market.

It didn't fail, it became mainstream.

If greed is the motivation, who doesn't want what communism has to offer 

Oops!

Communism failed.

"Berlin Wall" mean anything to anyone?

My $.02.

I think that only people who have lived in a capitalist country should say how bad or good capitalist is.
They shouldn't fantasize about how communism works in RL.

Obviously , same for the others.

As I managed to live survive in both , I can only say... F***** communism.

 

You guys are from the US right?

There is a certain breed in the US that seems to be completely blind, and yet proud and outspoken about it.

You can replace socialism with our new and more modern definition of capitalism in that post above and its still 100% correct.

Got some bads news for you and I'll let you figure it out on your own.

Violence works.

It always starts as "peacefule" demonstrations in the streets and then accelerates into someone shooting someone else.  Always.

"A revolution is not a dinner party, or writing an essay, or painting a picture, or doing embroidery. It cannot be so refined, so leisurely and gentle, so temperate, kind, courteous, restrained and magnanimous. A revolution is an insurrection, an act of violence by which one class overthrows another."

Mao Zedong.

Not that I advocate violence but let's get real here, mkay?

My $.02.

100% Agreed!
Makes more sense than the nonsense criticism spoken by Dutch and John.

Oh how trite, my views differ from your views so I am a Communist!  In reality I am a Gesellian, an anti-communist AND anti-capitalist philosophy, but enough about me.

Your definition dug up off our modern wiki-fied internet merely crystallizes the misconception that has been around for 50 years that ALL the aspects of the American economy are integral parts of a single monolithic 'thing' called capitalism.  But this is a definition that destroys meaning and understanding by creating a kind of black-box from which we are told "all good things come".  This is no accident, your inability you understand the society we live is composed of MULTIPLE system which CAN mixed and matched without causing the whole thing to implode serves to keep you complacent and accepting of the present mix

The analogy might be something like a Aztec corn farmer believing that the society he lived in was one monolith of farming, tribal-warfare and human sacrifice.  If someone told him that human sacrifice was bad he would defend it on the grounds that it was part of the system to produce corn and corn was obviously necessary for sustenance.

We only need to look closely at your definition to see that it doesn't ever put it's finger on ONE thing to define capitalism.  It immediately jumps into the free-market and proceeds to define THAT (open competition, profit motive and private ownership of the means of production).  Then it tells us what Capitalism 'encourages' (and here it defines Laissez-faire without calling it such) and tells us the U.S. is capitalist which is about as close as it gets to providing a single concrete definition.  So basically your definition translates to "Capitalism is the sum of all the economic paradigms operating in the U.S. today".

Further more dose it seem a bit strange to you that in that whole melange of a definition theirs is NO REFERENCE to capitol itself?  If you know your economic jargon then you know capitol means MONEY, so we would really expect their to be some reference to money and how it is supposed to work in capitalism.  But your definition is devoid of any reference to the flow of money, banking and interest payments doesn't even seem to exist in your definition.  Why do you think such BIG parts of the system are not mentioned?  Could it be that the actual productive and useful parts of our economy like Free-Markets are pushed to the rhetorical forefront while the usury that's sucking the life out of it all behind the scenes tries to go as unnoticed as possible.  Can you see how the meaning of the word capitalism has been altered to exactly what you've dutifully regurgitated to me.  And how your knee-jerk reaction to throwing "communist" at anyone who questions the system serves the banking sector.

Now you have a good point there!

Bitcoin Was Perfect...............And Then Came The Humans!

Without arguing for or against socialism or capitalism (which would be a different argument), I would suggest that violence is by no means isolated to any particular economic system. In fact, I would go further and say that any economic system taken to its extreme fosters abuse and violence.

For instance, there are many largely socialist Scandinavian countries right now that are much less violent and authoritarian than the US and consistently rate highest on quality of life and happiness indexes (e.g., Norway).

There are also many examples of violence in the support of capitalism, e.g. suppression of worker strikes by government at the behest of industrial powers at the turn of the 20th century, locking workers in factories leading to many famous "factory fire" massacres, the abuse of eminent domain by railroad owners during the 19th Century...the list really does goes on and on.

Of course, you could argue that these examples do not represent "pure" capitalism, but I would argue that such an ideal is as "utopian" as many starry-eyed socialists put forth.

Again, this is not to put one system above another, just arguing on the narrow topic of violence.

Thak you for your kind and insigtful post with which I agree 100%!

My $.02.

Centralization in mining isn't really an issue in my mind. What difference does it make? Sure no one is getting rich anymore from mining but I don't want to. I want to use it as a store of wealth and as a currency.

The pools are not going to agree to changes we don't like because they have the biggest stake to lose if the price drops.