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Topic: Bitcoinica No Spread Charged for the next 12 hours. - page 2. (Read 4985 times)

hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
Shame on everything; regret nothing.

Please make this relation/algorithm PUBIC!.
This will make sure everyone knows the risks.
The risk comes not from the leverage but from the non-stability in your algorithm!
It resonates too much.


sorry, i couldn't let this one go. Cheesy

This is absolutely ludicrous.  It's the same as asking someone to write you a trade bot for free, then explain how you wrote it.
legendary
Activity: 1414
Merit: 1000
HODL OR DIE

Maybe someone can make a bucket shop with independent pricing power to compete with Bitcoinica.


That's not a bad idea.  I bet it would still get customers even if it was blatantly advertised as a "bucket shop".

Agreed, that's why I ran out and got bitcoinbucketshop.com earlier today.  Grin I think there is a market for low limit BTC price speculation. This would allow low spreads and lots of opportunity to gamble.
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
Shame on everything; regret nothing.
OK I finally created a bitcoinica account, and tried to fund it with a MtGox code, but something bad happened:

1: I generated a Mt Gox code for x BTC
2: copied code into bitcoinica deposit field and pressed "Redeem and Deposit" -- but I got an Error message.
3: Then I noticed I had not pressed the CONFIRM button on the Mt Gox Withdrawal, so I pressed Confirm, re-copied the code to bitcoinica, tried "Redeem and Deposit" again, and this time it worked.

4: However when I looked back at my MtGox balance, it was lower by 2x BTC, as if I had withdrawn x BTC twice, but only x were transferred to bitcoinica.

What went wrong here?  If I actually generated two codes by mistake, how do I recover that first code?  I don't see it in my mtgox history...

thanks

I've never had that happen personally, but have always been slightly afraid of the possibility of something like this.  You need to talk to Zhou or Jon at Bitcoinica and/or someone at Gox.
member
Activity: 85
Merit: 10
OK I finally created a bitcoinica account, and tried to fund it with a MtGox code, but something bad happened:

1: I generated a Mt Gox code for x BTC
2: copied code into bitcoinica deposit field and pressed "Redeem and Deposit" -- but I got an Error message.
3: Then I noticed I had not pressed the CONFIRM button on the Mt Gox Withdrawal, so I pressed Confirm, re-copied the code to bitcoinica, tried "Redeem and Deposit" again, and this time it worked.

4: However when I looked back at my MtGox balance, it was lower by 2x BTC, as if I had withdrawn x BTC twice, but only x were transferred to bitcoinica.

What went wrong here?  If I actually generated two codes by mistake, how do I recover that first code?  I don't see it in my mtgox history...

thanks
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002

Please make this relation/algorithm PUBIC!.
This will make sure everyone knows the risks.
The risk comes not from the leverage but from the non-stability in your algorithm!
It resonates too much.


sorry, i couldn't let this one go. Cheesy
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
Shame on everything; regret nothing.
I am a MT Gox trader, but am curious about Bitcoinica.

Does Bitcoinica give you the ability to do Stop Loss Orders? Can I trade like I would on Mt Gox with close spreads, or is the spread so far apart that its not worthwhile?

I cant seem to find an exchange that does stop loss orders with enough volume.

Bitcoinica provides "stop" orders -- the disadvantage is that if the next open market order is far away from your stop (big spikes), it will have provided little protection.  But I imagine a stop order used by a bot on mtgox would act similarly.
hero member
Activity: 662
Merit: 545
stewart, it wouldn't be too hard to write a bot in php to run stops for you, surprised nobody has made one yet.

Wish I had the smarts to do this, and what a great MT Gox trading help this would be. I would happily donate BTC for that kind of bot.

+1
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
Shame on everything; regret nothing.

The problem is that Bitcoinica is the most transparent pricing engine ever that tells you the *real* trading prices of Bitcoin, instead of the unreliable Mt. Gox "last price".

Actually this "problem" can be used as an advantage when all the real-time charting services are down due to connection or whatever sort of problems... you can get an idea of price from Bitcoinica.
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
Shame on everything; regret nothing.

Maybe someone can make a bucket shop with independent pricing power to compete with Bitcoinica.


That's not a bad idea.  I bet it would still get customers even if it was blatantly advertised as a "bucket shop".
vip
Activity: 490
Merit: 502
It's not his algorithm causing resonation, it's his users and others who are overreacting to every little market move.

Quite true.

All prices are given. We are now even releasing the charts. All price points are tradable with guaranteed liquidity.

Also, don't forget that a huge buy or sell can make the order book very thin for a brief period, and obviously everyone has to wait until Bitcoinica provides better prices when the orders re-establish.

The problem is that Bitcoinica is the most transparent pricing engine ever that tells you the *real* trading prices of Bitcoin, instead of the unreliable Mt. Gox "last price".
vip
Activity: 490
Merit: 502


The lowest price ever tracked today is only 4 cents, or 0.66% lower than the Mt. Gox low. I believe that unreasonable forced liquidations shouldn't happen again after the last algorithm change.

Your model is broken.
It acts often like a base ball glove.
When all logic say's now is the time to buy suddenly your buy price rises far above mtgox price and catches all the people falling for this trick.
Same goes for selling.
Quite often your spread just sits there, covering up all profit.
If this doesn't happen then you suddenly have liquidity problems.

So, either your algorithm is broken or you are not doing this fair.

Yesterday there was a spread of over 1 bitcoin.
That's bizar and totaly unbalanced.
And people have to wait untill your algorithm normalizes.
Often, when there is action, your algorithm just overreacts and covers the profits.
But by the time it normalizes there is no action on the exchanges.

This forum has even invented a term to describe this: Being Zhoutonged

Your algorithm has tons of hidden risk built in.
Now, the relation between the exchanges and your casino is unknown.
Please make this relation/algorithm PUBIC!.
This will make sure everyone knows the risks.
The risk comes not from the leverage but from the non-stability in your algorithm!
It resonates too much.

I tell you a public algorithm that you can use to test against ours. It's not identical, but a lot easier to handle:

Just estimate the average cost to buy/sell 100 BTC at Mt. Gox plus fees, considering slippage.

In reality, we have some minor adjustments on top of this to give customers better rates when possible.

You should never attempt to catch a spike on Bitcoinica using market orders. If there's no market depth at Mt. Gox, it's impossible to have a narrow spread on Bitcoinica. I can assure you that. It's not about profit at all.

Maybe someone can make a bucket shop with independent pricing power to compete with Bitcoinica.

99% of the time, Bitcoinica spreads are just as cheap as Mt. Gox fees. If you're the guy that hates Bitcoinica just because of the 1% time when spike happens, just go to Mt. Gox and see what happens when you attempt to buy/sell something fairly significant.
legendary
Activity: 1904
Merit: 1002
It's not his algorithm causing resonation, it's his users and others who are overreacting to every little market move.
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
Shame on everything; regret nothing.


The lowest price ever tracked today is only 4 cents, or 0.66% lower than the Mt. Gox low. I believe that unreasonable forced liquidations shouldn't happen again after the last algorithm change.

Your model is broken.
It acts often like a base ball glove.
When all logic say's now is the time to buy suddenly your buy price rises far above mtgox price and catches all the people falling for this trick.
Same goes for selling.
Quite often your spread just sits there, covering up all profit.
If this doesn't happen then you suddenly have liquidity problems.

So, either your algorithm is broken or you are not doing this fair.

Yesterday there was a spread of over 1 bitcoin.
That's bizar and totaly unbalanced.
And people have to wait untill your algorithm normalizes.
Often, when there is action, your algorithm just overreacts and covers the profits.
But by the time it normalizes there is no action on the exchanges.

This forum has even invented a term to describe this: Being Zhoutonged

Your algorithm has tons of hidden risk built in.
Now, the relation between the exchanges and your casino is unknown.
Please make this relation/algorithm PUBIC!.
This will make sure everyone knows the risks.
The risk comes not from the leverage but from the non-stability in your algorithm!
It resonates too much.

When you make a margin trading platform, you can make your algorithm more fair.  If you actually do, you can bet I'll trade there more often.

Right now -- I like Bitcoinica quite a bit.
hero member
Activity: 840
Merit: 1000


The lowest price ever tracked today is only 4 cents, or 0.66% lower than the Mt. Gox low. I believe that unreasonable forced liquidations shouldn't happen again after the last algorithm change.

Your model is broken.
It acts often like a base ball glove.
When all logic say's now is the time to buy suddenly your buy price rises far above mtgox price and catches all the people falling for this trick.
Same goes for selling.
Quite often your spread just sits there, covering up all profit.
If this doesn't happen then you suddenly have liquidity problems.

So, either your algorithm is broken or you are not doing this fair.

Yesterday there was a spread of over 1 bitcoin.
That's bizar and totaly unbalanced.
And people have to wait untill your algorithm normalizes.
Often, when there is action, your algorithm just overreacts and covers the profits.
But by the time it normalizes there is no action on the exchanges.

This forum has even invented a term to describe this: Being Zhoutonged

Your algorithm has tons of hidden risk built in.
Now, the relation between the exchanges and your casino is unknown.
Please make this relation/algorithm PUBIC!.
This will make sure everyone knows the risks.
The risk comes not from the leverage but from the non-stability in your algorithm!
It resonates too much.
vip
Activity: 490
Merit: 502
Just wanted to say thanks, zhouthong. The spreads have been amazing for the last 12 hours.

Now that we are back at the normal spreads, would it be possible at all to reduce them a bit ?

I know that you have some risk because of margins, providing liquidity and you need to make some money.

Whatever you do, I appreciate your service very much.

It's to my best interest to lower the spread, because people don't trade on Bitcoinica if the spread is high.

We have to pay Mt. Gox fees though. Currently we are paying 0.25%, the lowest tier. And the "commission" we charge is always less than 0.6%. So just do your own math by looking at the homepage numbers. Bitcoinica is actually quite cheap.

If you just want to catch the spikes, perhaps Mt. Gox is a better choice because they don't guarantee any liquidity and you are completely on your own.
full member
Activity: 184
Merit: 100
Feel the coffee, be the coffee.
Just wanted to say thanks, zhouthong. The spreads have been amazing for the last 12 hours.

Now that we are back at the normal spreads, would it be possible at all to reduce them a bit ?

I know that you have some risk because of margins, providing liquidity and you need to make some money.

Whatever you do, I appreciate your service very much.
legendary
Activity: 947
Merit: 1042
Hamster ate my bitcoin
If you followed the discussions, you would know that you wouldn't be trapped in a position. Trading restriction only applies on new positions. You can close any position any time. This is guaranteed now.

OK, thanks.
I must have missed that post.
legendary
Activity: 1386
Merit: 1000
I am asking because you can see the spread between bid and ask yourself.
Right now it is already seems to include bitcoinica comission.
legendary
Activity: 1386
Merit: 1000
Why the pony on your userpic have her eyes closed?
vip
Activity: 490
Merit: 502
Dear Mr Z,

I have been mucking around on Bitcoinica for about a month now, with a small amount of coins. I think the site is excellent and I'm very impressed.

However, the possibility of becoming trapped in a position (due to no reserve) is stopping me from moving more money to your site.

Is this something that will be fixed in the future?

If you followed the discussions, you would know that you wouldn't be trapped in a position. Trading restriction only applies on new positions. You can close any position any time. This is guaranteed now.
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