Topic: Borrowed $1,000,000 (1 million dollars) from my dad to invest in BTC (serious) - page 6. (Read 18460 times)

He already said, barrow with 10% interest its not a gift... You don't need to go through a bank for a loan

I'm not an accountant, but there are a few things to consider, specifically if you are an American.
There is a gift tax in the US. You are allowed something like $10K per person per year tax free to be given to you, after that it is income. If your dad gives you 1M, you have to pay income tax on 990,000 at 39%.
So you may need to set up a company (an LLC or an S-Corp) to accept the money. This way it is an equity investment in the company, not gift income.

Also, you have to pay capital gains tax on any profits. If you don't hold your investment for more than 1 year, there are short term capital gains that are taxed as normal income (you would easily be in either the 35% or 39% income tax bracket when dealing with those amounts). If you sell your coins after 1 year then it is long term capital gains and the tax rate is 20%.

Talk to an accountant!

meh, $1m doesn't move the market much thesedays...

Only read op, haven't read any responses but...

If your dad loaned you a million dollars, then you shouldn't stress on the chance of losing it... I don't think it'll be much of a problem for you dude...

buy it,  sell it in a year so you pay less taxes and then live off the 8,000,000$ you just made after paying your dad 1100000$ and paid 10% in taxes

Easy option:
1) depost $1X,XXX with Bitstamp (2-3 days)
2) Buy BTC at enough market depth to make it significant, but not enough to manipulate the price significantly. (fairly instant)
3) Move the BTC through unique deposit addresses to disguise where it is eventually headed.... MtGox (fairly quick)
3) Transfer your coins to MtGox (linked to your tax haven bank account)
4) Sell for a 6-10% premium above Bitstamp ask price and withdraw the dollars (4 week withdrawal process... but you need to bide your time with that much cash to chug through)
5) Repeat steps 1 to 4 until all your dollars have been laundered through the process
6) You should have close to 10% just from market inefficiency. If you don't, repeat steps 1 through 4 again

Manipulation option:
1) Look for a weak side in the order book (not much market depth) and move the spread significantly. When the market scrambles to figure out if the price is collapsing and generally panicking, hoover up the undervalued orders on the other side of the market.

Leveraged option:
1) Take your $1m and raise enough capital from the collateral to have $10m or $100m and buy buy up every available bitcoins on the open market, creating an artificial price increase by giving you a monopoly on the scare asset. so you can dictate the market to some extent.

Mining option:
1) Buy your way to the front of the queue for the next generation mining hardware and generally control the supply of a scarce asset, or simply get in there faster, with more powerful hardware, and you could hover up $100k in 6 to 8 weeks if you could queue jump on a 2 Th/s unit, and your net risk would be negligible.

What I would *not* do is to to just buy bitcoins and hope for capital growth: your cash will actually dilute their value, because it's not linked to an economic fundamental, such as scarcity or means of production, or market forces, such as the balance of supply and demand (these just absorb money entering and leaving) and the Purchasing Power Parity remains unaltered.

What you really want is a repo contract (borrow bitcoins) and then decimate the market by selling them. Buy them back cheaply to fulfil your contract obligation, plus a load more that you will get at an artificially low price, and then wait for the market to find it's natural level again.

Seeing as it's a completely unregulated industry, i suppose there's no reason why you couldn't find an exchange that would be amenable to you front-running deals, so you can trade on that insider knowledge.

Bottom line; nobody has a crystal ball. Hedge funds and investment banks get rich from crooked lawyers, and bullying and manipulating the markets. Everybody else depends on a bit of luck, basic understanding of economic principles and some intuition about the panic moves of the herd... money's gotta go somewhere. Just look at the hassle of setting up a bullion vault and the inconvenience as a form of money.

Nobody can predict the price though... that's driven by fear, greed and manipulation.

Bitcoin is, regardless of what anyone tells you, 100% speculative in nature.

As an immature, illiquid, and low volume market it can be manipulated quite easily which creates lots of unpredictable volatility.

I am a fan of bitcoin, this is why I am here, but as investments go it is essentially ultra high risk, and should only be funded with risk capital.

My opinion; buy BTC with 10% of your available high risk capital, put 20 to 30% in another medium to high risk fund, as your young you can afford some mid term volatility, and the rest should be in something low risk or tangible.

Cheers...

Does anyone else think the subject of this post sounds suspiciously like a http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigerian_scam?
Could the OP be laying the groundwork now and later request a few mBTC from people to test his wallet security?

You can probably buy some BTC at under 1k at the moment. Might be a great deal, but for all you know next year it may be worth $500 and you'd be out money. What's happened with the value the past 60 days isn't really a good judge of the next 60 days.

Well if your dad gave you 1 mil on a whim for 10% return, he clearly is an idiot or super rich and doesn't care about the money so you might as well just ask him for 2 mil and tell him you'll give him a mil back in a year.

OP is an obvious troll.. this stuff really doesn't happen.

Don't do it. Really. A start-up is more sensible.

Noob2001 has some experience with secretly spending his parents' money on bitcoin, so he should be able to give you some good advice 

Wow, that's just insane!

I can't believe there have only been 3 or so replies telling you how totally insane your plan is.

You sound very young and very inexperienced with investing - am I right in my assumptions?

The reason you sound inexperienced in investing to me is that you seem to not have ANY feeling for risk. Once you have played for a little while on the markets, you have taken your risks and some of them went bad, so you learn to manage them.

Will BTC trade above 1500$, and will it do so relatively soon? I absolutely think so, this is the most likely way its gonna go. But the big question is: Can you afford to be wrong? You should always be able to afford being wrong. Sounds like you can't.

What if some huge government restriction or technical flaw comes out and it all goes to zero? It's not the most likely scenario IMO, but is it realistic? Absolutely, it could definitely happen!

You are hardly informed about BTC. In your position, you should spend a couple of weeks straight informing yourself about every possible aspect, every single risk, you should know BTC inside out in your sleep. And I don't care what the price of BTC does in the meantime, while you get informed.

Also, I don't get when you plan on selling: All above 1500$? How big will the temptation be to wait a little longer? Have you done that before - sold on a massive winning streek with the possibilities of your asset going much higher? Have you handled insane volatility like BTC before? Could you handle it psychologically if BTC fell below 700$, are you sure you would hold? Do you have a plan in place for all eventualities?

You are doing all that to be able to chill for a year in Miami?

All of this, in the form you chose to do it, sounds absolutely crazy to me. The fact people on here seem to forget about any risks makes me think as well.

Whatever your decision, I honestly wish you good luck and best of sucess!

If after ten minutes in a bitcoin thread you do not know who the patsy is—you are the patsy.

I'm staying out of fiat. That's their problem. By the time they come wanting their bitcoins, they probably know a little bit more how to secure it on their own.

What are the odds mate. I've been hopeing to find someone off the internet who was willing to take the responsibility of looking after a million cash for me :s

I get what you mean, but I think you contradicted yourself with that second sentence. Anyone who wanted to use such a service like this wouldn't have their own bitcoin wallet ... they'd just be showing up at your doorstep and wanting either cash or wired to a bank account.

Your dad is really generous. I think you should be fine, but make sure your bitcoins are super secure in the form of paper wallets.

There is a lot of good advice here. In sum:
1. Don't trust anyone random here
2. Learn about cold storage, offline wallets etc
3. Spread the coins among different addresses
4. Spread the purchases across different exchanges.

Also, be sure you want to do this. It could be risky.

:-)

Roughly the equivalent of borrowing money from your dad to put it all on roulette in Vegas.

If you can't afford to pay your dad back (which is sounds like you can't), you're scum.