Bot trading domination: Time to panic? - page 4.

iv4n

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Quote from: Dart18 on January 06, 2020, 08:42:59 AM

Not everyone can be as good as those who can input what the bot would really do.
I tried and I failed. It seems easy for other but it is not. There will always be a problem at some point.

So I guess we could say others still prefer it doing with another type rather than bots.
Manual or with orders that are being left there.
It may not be a daily profit but there is a chance for that if you are the one who is monitoring it.

It's not easy even for the people with huge capital, trading bot strategies require a nice starting capital. Other than that, I think that many bots fail to make the profit all the time, wrong set up by the handlers, or slow bot that is unable to compete with other bots and volatile market, who will know.
I like to leave my order rather than having bot to trade for me. Maybe we are old school but it's how I like to do it.

Amel

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Quote from: salad daging on January 05, 2020, 08:45:37 PM

only panic if the bot algorithm succeeds with an AI precision ratio of 90% and is stable in generating profits in all conditions, if it's like this then not only traders are disturbed, the exchange will also start to make some improvements to get rid of it. There is no meaningful panic, but the trend will change where traders will prefer exchanges with lower bot activity.

If there really is a bot with such a ratio, maybe it was made by a genius like Albert Einstein haha. But I am very sure, the crypto market is too difficult to achieve such a ratio even though it's still possible anyway. Exchange will not take action in my opinion, if they really eliminate bots then they must be prepared to lose in competition with other exchanges, in fact.

ethergod

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If the markets are dominated by algorithmic trading, the obvious solution is to consider intermediate to long-term trades, or swing trades. Bots cannot foresee events and cannot be programmed, at least at this time, to make optimal long-term investments. A longer time-frame requires creativity.

Dart18

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Not everyone can be as good as those who can input what the bot would really do.
I tried and I failed. It seems easy for other but it is not. There will always be a problem at some point.

So I guess we could say others still prefer it doing with another type rather than bots.
Manual or with orders that are being left there.
It may not be a daily profit but there is a chance for that if you are the one who is monitoring it.

dunfida

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Quote from: avatar_kiyoshi on January 06, 2020, 04:56:46 AM

Quote from: salad daging on January 05, 2020, 08:45:37 PM

only panic if the bot algorithm succeeds with an AI precision ratio of 90% and is stable in generating profits in all conditions, if it's like this then not only traders are disturbed, the exchange will also start to make some improvements to get rid of it. There is no meaningful panic, but the trend will change where traders will prefer exchanges with lower bot activity.

That's impossible if there are a bot which have precision ratio of 90%, especially in cryptocurrency market, I tested automatic bot in crypto market, I can say it's around 60-70% ratio. In forex the ratio results are bigger and more stable.

I'm not so optimistic that the exchange will cut bots in its market, because AFAIK trading bot is legal.
for the next year there will likely be many trading bot, but the risk level is the same as manual trading.

precision of 90%? Then its already close to holy grail.When it comes to precision i cant really pinpoint yet it would vary on bots settings and the current condition of the market on the time you were trading.
I dont see for us to panic yet it is already casual thing that most of traders do make use of trading bots.

pajak666

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I would be surprised if market wasn't already dominated by bots. Why would anyone do it manually when we have been using computers for the past dozens of years? Whatever is your strategy it always makes sense to just automate it. If you are not able to build a working strategy, then no worries because neural networks and machine learning are taking over the industry so you will only need to pay subscription plans and multiply the money. Why would it be a reason to panic? Edges will get smaller but before of that people couldn't participate in this profit so yea, seems fair.

avatar_kiyoshi

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Quote from: salad daging on January 05, 2020, 08:45:37 PM

only panic if the bot algorithm succeeds with an AI precision ratio of 90% and is stable in generating profits in all conditions, if it's like this then not only traders are disturbed, the exchange will also start to make some improvements to get rid of it. There is no meaningful panic, but the trend will change where traders will prefer exchanges with lower bot activity.

That's impossible if there are a bot which have precision ratio of 90%, especially in cryptocurrency market, I tested automatic bot in crypto market, I can say it's around 60-70% ratio. In forex the ratio results are bigger and more stable.

I'm not so optimistic that the exchange will cut bots in its market, because AFAIK trading bot is legal.
for the next year there will likely be many trading bot, but the risk level is the same as manual trading.

wajik-tempe

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Quote from: rez303 on January 06, 2020, 02:10:41 AM

Quote from: cheezcarls on January 04, 2020, 03:22:08 PM

If they do what we feared the most, it would likely manipulate the prices of Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies as "wild swings" occur and may get even worse in more years to come.

Do you think we should be worried by this in the next few years of this decade? Let me know your reactions or thoughts about this one guys.

Thanks!

There is nothing to scare. those bots are also made by human algorithms, and it is no different from humans, just that it has no emotions and works very disciplined. So to defeat such bots is not difficult, we just follow what we have a plan and must have additional contingency plans. If you can do all that then you won't be scared.

Yeah bots won't be able to cover all the market conditions because there are a million different situation in the market and it's impossible for the human algorithm to create the bots that have 100% win rate in every trade. So, don't worry about it because bots are not a thread for cryptocurrency trading.

Xxmodded

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Quote from: cheezcarls on January 04, 2020, 03:22:08 PM

Algorithms and bot-trading have taken over Wall Street and the cryptocurrency market with no sign of slowing down. Analysts say everyday traders should be terrified of the coming decade.

Everyone in the cryptocurrency industry complains of bots ‘manipulating’ prices, but this will likely end up being even more severe during the 2020s.

In the past decade, we’ve seen some wild swings in prices, both among regular assets and cryptocurrencies. It’s primarily been due to algorithmic robots, but their effect will only be stronger in the coming years. The end result will be that successfully trading the market will be even more difficult.

Read the full news here

Analysts claimed that bot-trading may possibly dominate in the 2020's, do you think it is time for traders like us to panic now?

If they do what we feared the most, it would likely manipulate the prices of Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies as "wild swings" occur and may get even worse in more years to come.

Do you think we should be worried by this in the next few years of this decade? Let me know your reactions or thoughts about this one guys.

Thanks!

I ever faced with bot trading and make panic because when I put buy order always miss because bot trading put with higher price, I try to make my order buy higher amount and price but always bot trading make higher price than my buy order, then I try to use my price and waiting until price down for my order assets can buy some altcoin in market.

rez303

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Quote from: cheezcarls on January 04, 2020, 03:22:08 PM

If they do what we feared the most, it would likely manipulate the prices of Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies as "wild swings" occur and may get even worse in more years to come.

Do you think we should be worried by this in the next few years of this decade? Let me know your reactions or thoughts about this one guys.

Thanks!

There is nothing to scare. those bots are also made by human algorithms, and it is no different from humans, just that it has no emotions and works very disciplined. So to defeat such bots is not difficult, we just follow what we have a plan and must have additional contingency plans. If you can do all that then you won't be scared.

bitcampaign

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whether we are in the middle of panic buying or selling panic, if at this time the price of bitcoin is rising slowly whether this is called panic buying because halving soon arrives, what should be feared by a bot while the bot does not work if there are no funds in it, investors The one who holds the money and puts the money in the exchange is the one who arranges everything, but I'm waiting for it to come too it's time not to panic too much selling now

crwth

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I don't know why people think that it's terrifying to have a bot trade for you. It's something that could be done, and it's highly effective. It helps people who are busy to trade 24/7 without having to worry about anything else as long as the person makes sure that it is a trusted source. If you think about it, it's bots that are executing the trade, but there's always a person behind the account, who funds the capital, etc. Maybe there are more competition with bots in this year. A lot more algorithms could work and be invented, and we will not know this until we are there.

wajik-tempe

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Quote from: salad daging on January 05, 2020, 08:45:37 PM

only panic if the bot algorithm succeeds with an AI precision ratio of 90% and is stable in generating profits in all conditions, if it's like this then not only traders are disturbed, the exchange will also start to make some improvements to get rid of it. There is no meaningful panic, but the trend will change where traders will prefer exchanges with lower bot activity.

There will be no such bot since the market is so dynamically change and i'm sure there are no algorith that able to cover all the market movement, if it's really happen, it won't happen more than 3 times in a row but luck.

salad daging

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only panic if the bot algorithm succeeds with an AI precision ratio of 90% and is stable in generating profits in all conditions, if it's like this then not only traders are disturbed, the exchange will also start to make some improvements to get rid of it. There is no meaningful panic, but the trend will change where traders will prefer exchanges with lower bot activity.

adroitful_one

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Quote from: Reid on January 05, 2020, 08:32:56 AM

We should be more worried about more exchange closing down. This ain't a lifetime feat right?

Not all are making profits thru bot trading. We could see that here right? Many bitcointalk users are still asking how to set it up and most of them have stories of losses behind the reason of how to do it.
It might sound easy when we see it being run at one exchange but I don't prefer it.

The old times might be gone but there are still who can make money (a lot) thru just monitoring it and orders being secured with their bare eyes.

I don't think that the smaller exchanges that are at risk of closing down soon really have a bot problem. I think most people that run bots do so on the bigger exchanges with more volume. If there were hundreds of bots on there, they wouldn't have a problem making enough money to stay open. Bots are just a part of trading. They don't bother me even one bit. In fact, I appreciate the volume that they bring to some of these places.

Mahanton

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Quote from: exstasie on January 05, 2020, 04:38:36 AM

Quote from: cheezcarls on January 04, 2020, 03:22:08 PM

Analysts claimed that bot-trading may possibly dominate in the 2020's, do you think it is time for traders like us to panic now?

HFT algorithms have already dominated conventional markets for years. No need to panic. What you need to do is zoom out. Stop trading the intraday charts, the minute and hour charts. I recommend analyzing the weekly/daily time frames for trade setups and maybe using the 4-hour for entries.

Higher time frames have a much better noise-to-signal ratio. Focusing on the 15-minute chart is a sure way to get chopped up by the bots. Wink

For Bigger TF then it would be less likely to be burned out by bots yet most of them would really set it up on lower time frames.

But we know that they would really tend to hive on short ones due to active movements which bots are really suit out.If you do trade manually on
these frames then expect that your trading against bot.

Reid

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We should be more worried about more exchange closing down. This ain't a lifetime feat right?

Not all are making profits thru bot trading. We could see that here right? Many bitcointalk users are still asking how to set it up and most of them have stories of losses behind the reason of how to do it.
It might sound easy when we see it being run at one exchange but I don't prefer it.

The old times might be gone but there are still who can make money (a lot) thru just monitoring it and orders being secured with their bare eyes.

panganib999

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Hasn't it been always as such? The only reason bots aren't that used by entry traders is because they lack the knowledge of determining whether the bot is actually doing its work or not. There's also taking into account that using bots requires you to trust its creator, which is pretty risky imo. Only self-made bots are actually trust worthy, and since some don't know how to make them, they lack the avenue to actually try them out.

As for possible wild swings, every now and then may be possible but it shouldn't affect the market in the long term. Like, traders using bots are also traders, having large swings like that is only detrimental to them as well. It defeats the purpose of letting the market grow so that they can profit from it as well.

BuxCoin

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bot trading will cause crazy volatile swings they spoil everything for even small profits and traders like us must only sit and see losing our money i had this question in my mind from long time , bot trading should not be encouraged at all

exstasie

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Quote from: cheezcarls on January 04, 2020, 03:22:08 PM

Analysts claimed that bot-trading may possibly dominate in the 2020's, do you think it is time for traders like us to panic now?

HFT algorithms have already dominated conventional markets for years. No need to panic. What you need to do is zoom out. Stop trading the intraday charts, the minute and hour charts. I recommend analyzing the weekly/daily time frames for trade setups and maybe using the 4-hour for entries.

Higher time frames have a much better noise-to-signal ratio. Focusing on the 15-minute chart is a sure way to get chopped up by the bots. Wink

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