Bottlecaps 2.1 UPDATE REQUIRED - HARDFORK JULY 4 2014 to 200% Annual PoS - page 159.

mullick

legendary

Activity: 1064

Merit: 1002

Seems to be just the turbulance described above. Just a longer string of it. I noticed it as well after I read that but everything is on the same page now again

EDIT: it keeps working back to POS blocks 3 or 4 POW blocks will be generated before a POS block enters the network with a block # lower and orphans those due to superior trustscore. POS just isnt designed to work this fast

Much better than the previous logs....

Code:

REORGANIZE
REORGANIZE: Disconnect 8 blocks; 0f029e71f0f90d0ab8e9..00000000883f0ff0a52e
REORGANIZE: Connect 1 blocks; 0f029e71f0f90d0ab8e9..4aae74886be84dda2a2b
CTxMemPool::accept() : accepted 5d348b8e71 (poolsz 1)
REORGANIZE: done
SetBestChain: new best=4aae74886be84dda2a2b  height=99330  trust=38004552046  date=09/01/13 08:07:41

paulsltc123

newbie

Activity: 55

Merit: 0

There hasn't been another fork due to this has there? I'm seeing some strange numbers from the pools and peers...varying difficulties too as well as block numbers that aren't adding up at the moment....hope I'm wrong...

paulsltc123

newbie

Activity: 55

Merit: 0

Quote from: mullick on September 01, 2013, 02:21:44 AM

Quote from: paulsltc123 on September 01, 2013, 02:01:25 AM

Do we know why the two main pools mining CAPs at 40-50Mh/s are getting over 75% orphans? It was never like this before. You could mine 10mh for a day and barely get at couple hundred coins at this rate. Why is this happening now? Efficiency before was like 95%+ and now has bottomed out since the update. Tell me this wasnt supposed to happen, right?

Mullick or Isawhim, wanna take a stab at explaining this for everyone?

Well I havent had time to sit down and look at it tonight but my belief is this.

Users were urged to turn stake off in their wallets with the reservebalance= setting for a period of about 2 weeks. Also cryptsy wallets were not open for 2 weeks. Since the cryptsy wallets receive a lot of transactions as do the pools that were down ect they were gaining large amounts of stake the entire time, 2+weeks worth. When the stake system was fixed and the wallets reopened and started minting the network exploded with stake. POS blocks are being generated so quickly they are orphaning them selves and POW blocks. The Pos difficulty isnt rising because this is "Normal" for the parameters originally set in the code.

The good news is this amount of stake simply cannot last it will soon run out once everyone stops competing for the POS blocks and we will see long stretches without stake again. Other parameters prevent stake from building up like this under average conditions so It will go down. I will be patching these issues and changing around stake setting over the next few weeks / months. But this shouldnt last long and I expect it to calm down very soon.

Also I will hopefully working with the original developer soon to get the checkpointing system up

Thanks for the quick reply and info. Makes sense. Just hope you're right that this will catch up and level off (very) soon. Right now blocks also being found 2-4 times a minute which is crazy fast and high even though difficulty is properly adjusting and there aren't any wild swings in network hashrates. Pretty stable actually. I'm willing to bet though that there are many who haven't even noticed yet that they're barely getting 20-40% of coin payout estimates right now due to the crazy high orphan rates...but I'm sure you're right and this will self correct very soon.
Glad to be back on exchange and at decent rate too..and I bet it will rise nicely as well...

mullick

legendary

Activity: 1064

Merit: 1002

Quote from: paulsltc123 on September 01, 2013, 02:01:25 AM

Do we know why the two main pools mining CAPs at 40-50Mh/s are getting over 75% orphans? It was never like this before. You could mine 10mh for a day and barely get at couple hundred coins at this rate. Why is this happening now? Efficiency before was like 95%+ and now has bottomed out since the update. Tell me this wasnt supposed to happen, right?

Mullick or Isawhim, wanna take a stab at explaining this for everyone?

Well I havent had time to sit down and look at it tonight but my belief is this.

Users were urged to turn stake off in their wallets with the reservebalance= setting for a period of about 2 weeks. Also cryptsy wallets were not open for 2 weeks. Since the cryptsy wallets receive a lot of transactions as do the pools that were down ect they were gaining large amounts of stake the entire time, 2+weeks worth. When the stake system was fixed and the wallets reopened and started minting the network exploded with stake. POS blocks are being generated so quickly they are orphaning them selves and POW blocks. The Pos difficulty isnt rising because this is "Normal" for the parameters originally set in the code.

The good news is this amount of stake simply cannot last it will soon run out once everyone stops competing for the POS blocks and we will see long stretches without stake again. Other parameters prevent stake from building up like this under average conditions so It will go down. I will be patching these issues and changing around stake setting over the next few weeks / months. But this shouldnt last long and I expect it to calm down very soon.

Also I will hopefully working with the original developer soon to get the checkpointing system up

paulsltc123

newbie

Activity: 55

Merit: 0

Do we know why the two main pools mining CAPs at 40-50Mh/s are getting over 75% orphans? It was never like this before. You could mine 10mh for a day and barely get at couple hundred coins at this rate. Why is this happening now? Efficiency before was like 95%+ and now has bottomed out since the update. Tell me this wasnt supposed to happen, right?

Mullick or Isawhim, wanna take a stab at explaining this for everyone?

John Eden

member

Activity: 98

Merit: 10

Have you mined Bottlecaps today?

Caps now accepted on http://www.igotspots.com/cap.html Buy gold and silver with your caps!

ISAWHIM

hero member

Activity: 504

Merit: 500

Quote from: Lordofhell on August 31, 2013, 08:09:38 PM

Ok, i`m trying to mine solo again. I found three blocks and three transactions have but in wallet i see only 10 coins. Why?

Two were orphaned... Eg, you didn't find them before another block was found, and the other block was accepted by more people first, over your block.

Eg, you found one at 12:00:15 and the other block by another miner was found at 12:00:10... and it had 6 confirms before yours got 5... You were just too far away to be "updated", as the block navigated the rooms. When that one got 6 confirms, your wallet removed your invalid coins from the "pending" status, and didn't deposit them into your wallet. Thus, you lost that lotto-drawing. Tongue

Remember, your miner talks to your own wallet faster than it talks to the network. After your miner finds a valid block, it passes it to the wallet, which then checks to see if it is actually valid, then it attempts to pass it to the network... then it has to be checked by 6 other wallets on the network, before any other block is sent from anyone else... That all takes time.

That is why I use a 64 workload size... I submit found blocks faster. Because I am not waiting 4x longer for a 256 workload to "finish", before I can submit it to my wallet for confirmation. Plus, workload 64 makes my miners run faster, on average. (I have low RAM. Like only 2GB total.)

ISAWHIM

hero member

Activity: 504

Merit: 500

Solo-mining, I am only getting about 36% orphans, average, over the past 24 hours.

Remember, the POS allowance is based off the total generated coins, so with all the days of non-POS, there are a lot of holes to be filled. It should not take more than a few days to normalize.

If you want to help alleviate the issue, simply mine another coin, but keep this wallet open and unlocked, so you create all the POS you were denied. I don't mind the orphans, that just makes the price I have to ask for, higher.

Like I said, don't settle for less than 0.0005 BTC/CAP... And stay firm on your order. Buying the few short-sales listed for easy coins. (Easier than mining... If you mine another coin, and trade that for BTC to buy CAP... There are plenty of overvalued coins you can mine for a quick turn-around to coins of actual value. Leave them with the debt of holding an overpriced coin, while you consume the undervalued coins.)

Don't mine just to mine, mine so you have something to trade with, to get what you actually want.

Lordofhell

newbie

Activity: 37

Merit: 0

Ok, i`m trying to mine solo again. I found three blocks and three transactions have but in wallet i see only 10 coins. Why?

paulsltc123

newbie

Activity: 55

Merit: 0

Yeah in the last 36 hours the orphans rate has been EXTREMELY high...was on Coinmine for a while and they are getting mostly orphans yesterday and still today and trying some solo and also orphaning many as well..what is up with this all of a sudden you think?

rav3n_pl

legendary

Activity: 1361

Merit: 1003

Don`t panic! Organize!

Looks like POS mining is fixed: all my POW blocks are orphaned by POS ones...
Switching machine to another currency.

Lauda

legendary

Activity: 2674

Merit: 2965

Terminated.

Quote from: flound1129 on August 31, 2013, 12:40:26 PM

Is coinchoose on the right chain? They're showing almost 4x the profitability of my calculations at the moment.

They are taking into account the orphan rates right now.

flound1129

hero member

Activity: 938

Merit: 1000

www.multipool.us

Quote from: eBit on August 31, 2013, 01:03:36 PM

Quote from: flound1129 on August 31, 2013, 12:40:26 PM

Is coinchoose on the right chain? They're showing almost 4x the profitability of my calculations at the moment.

I wouldn't rely on coinchoose. Their profitability has always been slightly overstated on this coin in my opinion.

What percentage of orphans are your calculations showing?

Yeah I realized the discrepancy was due to the orphan rate.

eBit

member

Activity: 91

Merit: 10

Quote from: flound1129 on August 31, 2013, 12:40:26 PM

Is coinchoose on the right chain? They're showing almost 4x the profitability of my calculations at the moment.

I wouldn't rely on coinchoose. Their profitability has always been slightly overstated on this coin in my opinion.

What percentage of orphans are your calculations showing?

eBit

member

Activity: 91

Merit: 10

Quote from: mullick on August 31, 2013, 12:15:44 PM

Quote from: Jazkal on August 31, 2013, 12:06:26 PM

So the "goal" is to run off all the miners for this coin?

Is this going to be the way it is going forward?

No the network doesnt have the stake to keep this going. Everyone was advised to stop POS minting and the pools were as well. The pools hold a lot of coins as well as cryptsy. When they all fired up their wallets again it was just a perfect storm really. It will calm down very soon I believe

It is true this is technically normal operation for the code parameters. But the min/max stake age and many other factors prevent blocks from being made this fast under normal operation.

It really does show why these parameters need to be changed in the long run and I will be doing so over the next few months. We should see the network start to relax tonight if im correct with my understanding

Seeing 83% orphans right now at Multipool and 90% at Coinmine. In the meantime, is the network still generating ~60 POW blocks/min or are we getting much less?

Any chance that the person maintaining this block explorer can restore it?
http://bot.webboise.com:2760/chain/Bottlecaps?count=20

Balthazar

legendary

Activity: 3108

Merit: 1359

flound1129

There are no wrong chains anymore, a bug was fixed yesterday.

https://github.com/bottlecaps-foundation/bottlecaps/pull/4

Coinchoose displays the correct block number.

flound1129

hero member

Activity: 938

Merit: 1000

www.multipool.us

Is coinchoose on the right chain? They're showing almost 4x the profitability of my calculations at the moment.

Balthazar

legendary

Activity: 3108

Merit: 1359

Anyway, syncronized checkpoints could resolve this situation.

mullick

legendary

Activity: 1064

Merit: 1002

Quote from: Jazkal on August 31, 2013, 12:06:26 PM

So the "goal" is to run off all the miners for this coin?

Is this going to be the way it is going forward?

No the network doesnt have the stake to keep this going. Everyone was advised to stop POS minting and the pools were as well. The pools hold a lot of coins as well as cryptsy. When they all fired up their wallets again it was just a perfect storm really. It will calm down very soon I believe

It is true this is technically normal operation for the code parameters. But the min/max stake age and many other factors prevent blocks from being made this fast under normal operation.

It really does show why these parameters need to be changed in the long run and I will be doing so over the next few months. We should see the network start to relax tonight if im correct with my understanding

Balthazar

legendary

Activity: 3108

Merit: 1359

I don't know the goal, but such situation is not a result of error or something looks like. It's a normal operation, for current settings. But I should say that selecting 1 minute block spacing is a pretty stupid decision. With 3-5 minutes there would be much less orphans.

Topic: Bottlecaps 2.1 UPDATE REQUIRED - HARDFORK JULY 4 2014 to 200% Annual PoS - page 159. (Read 388610 times)