Topic: BRICS has become eleven countries instead of five. - page 2. (Read 1420 times)

BRICS mirrors the issue Venezuela is facing.
No buyer base.

In BRICS countries only a few can afford a house, a bitcoin, or consume. Consume is what China sells.

They're basically trying to form a "global south/east" block, like the "West" (USA, UK, EU and Aus/NZ) is a block, who bullies the rest of the world and wages wars non-stop. If one can weaken the Dollar hegemony, they can become competitive. But these countries are very diverse in thinking and alliance: for instance India, they are a big buddy of the USA and hate China (they have a war being waged with knives, ongoing on their border).

When BRICS was only 5 countries, nothing much has happened, but they are slowly trying to make themselves an economic group.

Hence the New Development Bank (headed by Dilma Rousseff) to be like an IMF and World Bank but for BRICS (the IMF and World Bank essentially cause political coups and keep the "global south" poor: with coup d'etats and bribes to export these nations' wealth to the political elites in the west, by paying off one political family in said country to play ball. So one group of politicians in the US get rich, and one family in said global south country gets rich. Everyone else stays poor.

Obviously this kind of behaviour will also happen among BRICS nations, let's not kid ourselves.

The 6 new countries have all been chosen for their mineral and agricultural wealth, and I think Egypt for the Suez Canal.
That is one reason I think for the Genocide in Gaza right now. Israel and the USA wants to build the socaled "Ben Gurion Canal" from Eilat in the Gulf of Aqaba through the Negev, and out at Gaza into the Mediterranean. That's why this "port" the US is constructing in Gaza is not for humanitarian aid. It's to park war ships and eventually create a canal. They still have to deal with the Houthi's at the other end though. But they are already bombing Yemen so I guess they are next on the list of "enemies" to bomb and invade....

Hence, we need to get the populace excited about Bitcoin and the new financial system instead. Draining the US financial system of funds for war might be the only way to stop the forever-wars they wage on smaller nations with natural resources.

PS: Goldman Sachs has already predicted that IRAN has the potential of becoming one of the largest world economies in the 21st century. They have 10% of the world's oil reserves and 15% of the world's gas reserves. And lots of gold, iron, copper, lead, zinc, chromium and URANIUM. (also saffron, pistachios, caviar and dates). They also have a massive automotive industry producing cars sold all over the Middle East and Asia. Iran is helping Burkino Faso and South Africa build oil refineries now.

I was at the BRICS conference last August in Johannesburg. They are NOT going to start a new currency, instead they will just trade in each others' currencies. They've been buying and selling oil using the Yuan already.

One BRICS currency would be very stupid:
imagine there's a war in Russia and sanctions against Iran, which will now affect a country that has nothing to do with those things, say Argentina). That's what happened with Greece in 2015 – they were on the Euro and couldn't devalue their currency to make their goods and services more competitive to the rest of the world, so they couldn't get of a hole because of the Euro.

I think they should be using Bitcoin of course.... 

I think that the BRICS is basically a formation of countries that wants to break the monopoly of the US dollar, as the recognized currency in international trades, because over the years most of these countries have been outstanding economically and technologically. If they're able to achieve this, then that means they'll reduce the dominance of the dollar internationally, and gradually weaken the US as the world power, only one country can not achieve this, so this BRICS alliance can form the synergy to make it happen. It's good that they're inviting countries who share their visions because there's power in unity, but disunity will be their greatest undoings.

We talk a lot about the BRICS countries and discuss what they can do, including in opposition to the dollar. But I have not yet heard anything about what these countries have actually done in practice, what decisions they are making. There is also a lot of talk about the special currency of the BRICS countries, but there is no information at all about this possible currency.

Well, they created the BRICS Development Bank back in 2014 with an authorized capital of $100 billion and equity participation of all BRICS members. Authorized capital in dollars to fight against the dollar?

Is it possible to find somewhere references to these "fabulous" ratings, measurement methodology, samples, verifiable data ? Or is this information not for everyone ?
I wonder about development too ! For example, can we have a list of Iranian scientists and a list of new technologies/medicines/solutions to global problems that they have invented/researched/built/given to the world ?

I'm afraid it will be similar to the story about how the USSR defeated tuberculosis..... But it turned out that it was achieved with the help of BCG vaccination, which the USSR brazenly used, forgetting about the real authors. And also at the expense of thousands of tuberculosis dispensaries where huge numbers of people were simply held against their will.....

Yes IRAN has a higher education standart and has partially correct as the West is trying that there People only buy stuff.

It depends on which country you have in mind! There are nearly 200 countries in the world and every single one of them export goods to others and all their people pay for stuff in their local fiat not in $ or €.

As for education, I don't know under what government you've been living that's made you think this way but the scientific growth in the Eastern bloc has been fast. For example in the past 4 decades Iran has been leading in all the rankings like WOS which puts Iran as #1 in the list in Asia and I believe somewhere between #15 and #17 globally.
In fact one of the reasons why Iran has been under this many sanctions is this growth and also the reason why they fear BRICS as a whole so much. All these countries have tremendous amount of potential.

Money, purchasing power. 


Why do countries sell their goods to the West? Due to hard cash, their citizens,companies, countries can pay in $ or €.
It is obvious that the governments do not like their people to be educated.

That has nothing to do with the part of my comment that you quoted!
For example Saudi Arabia has is both a rich country with the largest number of poor but at the same time they were dictating the oil price BUT for United States with Petrodollar. Ever since last year they stopped and haven't been doing that and were instead dictating or rather helping Eastern powers dictate the price of oil. They even threatens US regime with "major economic consequences"
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/06/08/saudi-arabia-cut-oil-production/

Between themselves, they can make calculations however they like - ripple, dates, cowrie shells, beads..... But this does not solve the problem of interacting with the "outside world" - and there nobody sells their goods and services for ripples or beads. That's where the main problem lies. And the economies of sub-sanctioned countries are far from being "self-sufficient", which means they need to buy a lot of goods on the world market, and there - the dollar. That is why all the methods of mutual settlements invented by rogue countries do not solve this global problem.

Poor in comparison to what? The West? Yeah, I believe you can call it poor... but there are numerous countries all around the globe much poorer than BRICS countries. Western countries attract the most intelligent, qualified, trained peeps from developing countries aka "brain drain" but once these intelligent and qualified people will see opportunity in their own countries this process will stop and reverse. Let me remind you about Irish people leaving for the US, Italians moving to Germany, Polish people to the UK etc. Now Ireland and Italy are attracting lots of people from all around the world as a nice place to work and live, including former expats returning back home.

To my knowledge, this is not entirely accurate. The formula on which the euro is issued is not entirely entrusted to the European Central Bank. The bank issued only 8 percent of the total currency, and the rest was distributed among the European Union countries, each according to its population and GDP. To use the euro, the European Union countries were forced to abandon their old currencies backed by gold and a basket of other major currencies (mainly the dollar). Therefore, the Union’s issues of the euro are supposed to be compatible with the size of all member states’ reserves of gold and major currencies.
This is the information I have and I ask anyone with more accurate information to correct me since I cannot provide accurate sources.

- I do not think that either of them will sacrifice his gold savings, one of his sources of strength, for the sake of BRICS. This also will not be able to compete with the dollar.
- Oil prices are very volatile and can never be relied upon, especially since there is a global organization that monopolizes export policies and price setting (OPEC).
- I don't know of any possible formula to do this, but I think that gas might help in this in one way or another.
- As well as lithium and precious metals, but the size of global savings must be verified.

This is certain, but let us not forget what you and I emphasized in several previous discussions: No currency project will succeed if its goal is to defeat the dollar, because this is not possible at all. We are looking for a balance of polarities where the global economy can choose from a basket of currencies and not be forced to use a single currency (the dollar) in a single way.

The biggest Issue I see is that BRICS has the poorest population. That is an issue and the numbers of trade won't make a difference.
They BRICS population should get wiser and invest in education, their own.

Well the thing about Iran's economy specially the foreign trades is that most of it is not made public. We only have a handful of official statements to work with. For example the statement by the official at the Ministry of Industry, Mine and Trade last year is the first official statement I can think of about cryotocurrencies being used to make an actual trade worth $10 million. Less than a month after that the regulations were published on using bitcoin mined in Iran for imports like importing vehicles. And the latest news I read 4-5 month ago was that the progress is slow and so far a couple of mining farms have joined and the trade size is only in tens of millions.

That's the challenging part though.
But at the same time all fiat currencies in the world are like that! It is also how euro was created. Euro like the dollar is not backed by anything either and it is used in an "economic bloc" called Europe! So in a way euro is like the BRICS currency. It will be backed by its supply and demand and the economies that are behind it.

If an asset is needed to back BRICS currency they can use a basket of them instead of gold alone. That can include:
- Gold (Russia and China have the fifth and sixth largest supplies)
- Oil (Saudi Arabia + Iran + Russia = 30% and if you add their "friends" like Venezuela, Qatar, etc. it is >60%)
- Gas (Iran + Russia = almost 50% of all the gas on planet)
- Lithium (Iran started searching recently and one of the first things found was 8.5 million ton reserve + China 5.1 mil ton + if Argentina 20 mil ton and Chile 11 mil ton join BRICS that's again more than half)
- Plus some other minerals that I can't think of right now and is rich in the East

This also means that in the future BRICS has the potential to effectively dictate the price of all these resources.
Not to mention that they could effectively recreate Petrodollar concept with the new currency, meaning selling all these resources for the BRICS currency only.

I agree with you that it is not wise at all to rely on one of the existing blockchain networks in the cryptocurrency market or to create a new network. The BRICS unified currency project will not be able to avoid the principle of centralization and be able to control its uses, especially since each country has its own financial system and independent financial policy, which is difficult to fit all of them into one common framework.
I think that the most important question that must be asked when we discuss the idea of establishing a unified currency for BRICS is where will its value be derived from?
Is it permissible to rely on gold again? But most of it is in the hands of America and the West.
Is it permissible to use any other metal as a substitute for gold in this case? The producers of this metal will be very lucky, especially if they are not members of BRICS.
What is the probability of this currency's success if we provide it with a Bitcoin cover?

I don't think an US company would be involved in Case of Iran.
A state has much more money to move around and I doubt the Iran uses Bitcoin, except their own. Most likey a privacy coin.

This involves a bunch of problems. The most notable ones are volatility and control.
If anything decentralized like bitcoin or centralized like XRP or any other altcoin is used, all trades will be affected by their volatile price that stems from their small markets that can be manipulated (even more for altcoins).
If the technology is taken and a separate new network is created (like using Ripple not XRP) then it still suffers from the shortcomings of the blockchain technology that will show itself a lot more when it is centralized. In other words there is no reason to do it when they can just create a SWIFT like system!

I don't know what you mean by "a US company", maybe a typo? but regarding what Iran uses, there are a bunch of things. Most notable ones are gold, mutual currencies and alternatives of SWIFT, and last but not least bitcoin specially since over the past couple of years mining has been growing in Iran.
AFAIK there are no other cryptocurrencies used for trades even the Digital Rial project is still not fully operational.

To be clear the point is not to be "under the radar", the point is to remove United States control over your money so that they can no longer steal it at any time and for any reason.
In fact in this context, this movement is very similar to bitcoin. Bitcoin transactions are not "under the radar", instead they are out there for the whole world to see but no central authority can censor them. This is why bitcoin was created and is used, and similarly will be why the alternative to SWIFT will be created.

Out of the 11 countries in BRICS, I would say that two members are having a lot of bargaining power at the moment - India and Saudi Arabia. Both these nations are considered valuable by the BRICS bloc, and at the same time during the ongoing G20 summit also both these nations were pampered by the other members. On the other hand, Russia and China seems to be losing their dominance. Recently Italy decided to pull out from the Belt and Road Initiative. Brazil and South Africa were never influential enough to start with. Right now, BRICS looks very imbalanced.

Indeed christal clear.
As all Ripple Transactions are not running under the radar, meaning not visible for the US, they can do as they plan and it'll not be out in the open. For visible observation there are satellites. But visibility does not say people have accurate, physical input, a reason why governments are suspicious. Government have human traits, they are envious as we are ie.
 
IRAN is doing it successfully although they don't use ripple, being an US company they most probably made up something else.

To clarify, I'm not from the US, nor a citizen living in the US.