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Topic: Bryan Micon's List of BTC Ponzi Schemes that should not be listed as "Lending" - page 4. (Read 119644 times)

legendary
Activity: 1316
Merit: 1005
Hey Team Ponzi - serious question: what Ponzi operator has voluntarily declared default? Pirate doesn't count because he still hasn't admitted or been proven to run one.
When Bernie's scheme collapsed in '08 he "voluntarily" declared himself in default the same way Pirate has, albeit without the outright confession of utter fraud.

Thank you.
legendary
Activity: 1232
Merit: 1014
FPV Drone Pilot
Hey Team Ponzi - serious question: what Ponzi operator has voluntarily declared default? Pirate doesn't count because he still hasn't admitted or been proven to run one.

Check my previous posts right at "closure" announcement. 

I predicted everything to a T so far - not that is is an amazing accomplishment - this should be the Ponzi manual in the Jr. Bernie Madoff "My First Ponzi Starter Kit" by Mattel

This is nothing but the latest step in the long stall that is "letting the mark down easy"

Very frequently there is abrupt end and the schemer runs away, but also very frequently there is the long stall and he'll tell people you are his friend and he'll make it right, just more time, more paperwork, etc.  Announcing a closure a week and a half ago was a stall, into the Monday deadline, into a stall with no time frame, into a default message, into a stall for another random deadline this time to submit personal information of the marks!??

I mean, I hope co-conspirator Payb.tc isn't stupid enough to fuck over his already fucked over userbase.  Any co-conspirator that hands personal info over to Pirate after this debacle is now crossing into the dark side.  A common use of this info is to re-roll the mark by saying "I can get you Pirate money back" and the mark gets rolled again somehow, like hiring a BS investigator or something.
sr. member
Activity: 336
Merit: 250
Hey Team Ponzi - serious question: what Ponzi operator has voluntarily declared default? Pirate doesn't count because he still hasn't admitted or been proven to run one.
When Bernie's scheme collapsed in '08 he "voluntarily" declared himself in default the same way Pirate has, albeit without the outright confession of utter fraud.

...BUT...did anyone get a free steak dinner and photo OP out of the deal, during it's 'Glory Days' ?

People got multi-million dollar bribes and extremely expensive gifts  Wink
sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 250
I heart thebaron
Hey Team Ponzi - serious question: what Ponzi operator has voluntarily declared default? Pirate doesn't count because he still hasn't admitted or been proven to run one.
When Bernie's scheme collapsed in '08 he "voluntarily" declared himself in default the same way Pirate has, albeit without the outright confession of utter fraud.

...BUT...did anyone get a free steak dinner and photo OP out of the deal, during it's 'Glory Days' ?

Perhaps some see 'value' differently than others. Being 'Starstruck' is not always a bad thing....
sr. member
Activity: 336
Merit: 250
Hey Team Ponzi - serious question: what Ponzi operator has voluntarily declared default? Pirate doesn't count because he still hasn't admitted or been proven to run one.
When Bernie's scheme collapsed in '08 he "voluntarily" declared himself in default the same way Pirate has, albeit without the outright confession of utter fraud.
donator
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
Hey Team Ponzi - serious question: what Ponzi operator has voluntarily declared default? Pirate doesn't count because he still hasn't admitted or been proven to run one.

Pirate didn't voluntarily default today.  He involuntarily defaulted 12 days ago when he was unable to payout withdraws requested.  Everything since then has been a dog and pony show.  One doesn't need to "declare" a default.  A default is not meeting your debt obligations.  You default by your actions.  

Pirate offered investors suckers DEMAND ACCOUNTS that means they can be withdrawn ON DEMAND without delay.  On 08/17 some accont holders made a DEMAND to withdraw their funds and that demand wasn't met.  At that instant Pirate was in default.  Period.  No ifs, ands or buts.
legendary
Activity: 1596
Merit: 1012
Democracy is vulnerable to a 51% attack.
Hey Team Ponzi - serious question: what Ponzi operator has voluntarily declared default? Pirate doesn't count because he still hasn't admitted or been proven to run one.
What makes you think it's voluntary?! Every Ponzi scheme defaults sooner or later when they no longer have enough reserves plus deposits to pay withdrawals (unless there's an arrest first).
sr. member
Activity: 252
Merit: 250
Hey Team Ponzi - serious question: what Ponzi operator has voluntarily declared default? Pirate doesn't count because he still hasn't admitted or been proven to run one.

I think this script-bot is a bit haywire...
sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 250
I heart thebaron
Around Christmastime 2013, BurtW will post "Week 70: 1,065,321 coins.  Heck yeah, over a million coins!  Got anything that compares, Team Ponzi?  I thought not."

I nearly pissed my pants reading and trying to re-quote this just now.....
legendary
Activity: 1316
Merit: 1005
Hey Team Ponzi - serious question: what Ponzi operator has voluntarily declared default? Pirate doesn't count because he still hasn't admitted or been proven to run one.
full member
Activity: 206
Merit: 100
Pirate just declared default:

As much as I've tried to meet the deadlines within the community, there're conditions beyond my control which have escalated the process to the point it is today.
Bitcoin Savings & Trust has hereby given notice of default to it's account holders.

No timeline or further information is available at this time.


This is from #btcst channel, the official bitcoin savings and trust chat.
Hey! BurtW! Might want to update your bet thread  Cheesy

Why so soon?  Default doesn't mean no one gets paid, as Goat repeatedly points out.  It just means no one gets paid now.  Around Christmastime 2013, BurtW will post "Week 70: 1,065,321 coins.  Heck yeah, over a million coins!  Got anything that compares, Team Ponzi?  I thought not."

Of course, I doubt he had a fraction of his claim with Pirate at the collapse.  Unlike OP, I think BurtW was a shill top-to-bottom.  The sort of Ponzi doublethink Joel describes is far too charitable for a passthrough operator who pitches to newbies and attacks anyone making obvious observations.
sr. member
Activity: 272
Merit: 250
Cryptopreneur
At least we have some closure here. Good thing i got into bitcoin late, and never had the option to put a large sum into PPT. And it all goes BOOM!  Cheesy
sr. member
Activity: 336
Merit: 250
I was directly addressing Micon's assertion that BurtW was simultaneously so stupid that he put his own money in Pirate, and that he was so evil that he duped others into the scheme, under full knowledge that it was a fraud.

I don't for even a tenth of a second believe that he actually added 10kBTC to a bullshit & trust account when he says he did.
The guy's a scammer, not a moron.
legendary
Activity: 3038
Merit: 1660
lose: unfind ... loose: untight
You are careening from wall to wall here. So is BurtW an evil mastermind co-conspirator actively stealing vast sums, or a hapless simpleton to be preyed upon by the typical denizen of back alleys? You can't have it both ways.
Amazingly, you can have both. You can have people who are evil masterminds with respect to those they solicit investments from and hapless simpletons with respect to those they pay the money to. It's actually not an uncommon characteristic of Ponzi schemes.

...

Consider a PPT operator who says the equivalent of, "Yeah, I guess I knew it was probably a Ponzi scheme, but I still figured people could get in early enough that they'd still make money." Simpleton or mastermind?

C'mon, Joel. That is _clearly_ not what I was replying to. I was directly addressing Micon's assertion that BurtW was simultaneously so stupid that he put his own money in Pirate, and that he was so evil that he duped others into the scheme, under full knowledge that it was a fraud.

And if you back up a couple of posts, the instigating factor was the outright lies being propagated by Micon.
sr. member
Activity: 336
Merit: 250
Pirate just declared default:

As much as I've tried to meet the deadlines within the community, there're conditions beyond my control which have escalated the process to the point it is today.
Bitcoin Savings & Trust has hereby given notice of default to it's account holders.

No timeline or further information is available at this time.


This is from #btcst channel, the official bitcoin savings and trust chat.
Hey! BurtW! Might want to update your bet thread  Cheesy
hero member
Activity: 504
Merit: 502
Id love to know what news he got for the PPT cause he just announced defaulting in irc, fuck knows whats going on. :/

Paybtc have any news on this ?
sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 250
I heart thebaron
Guys...guys....guys..... !

Pirate is going to pay. He contacted the PPT Operators and everything.

Please stop all of the hate.
hero member
Activity: 546
Merit: 500
Joel, how do you feel about Social Security, and the people who participate in it?
legendary
Activity: 1596
Merit: 1012
Democracy is vulnerable to a 51% attack.
You are careening from wall to wall here. So is BurtW an evil mastermind co-conspirator actively stealing vast sums, or a hapless simpleton to be preyed upon by the typical denizen of back alleys? You can't have it both ways.
Amazingly, you can have both. You can have people who are evil masterminds with respect to those they solicit investments from and hapless simpletons with respect to those they pay the money to. It's actually not an uncommon characteristic of Ponzi schemes.

It's the flipside of the fact that you will find both arguments that "Everyone knew it was a Ponzi scheme, so people who lost money weren't really scammed" and "We still don't know it's a Ponzi". You will even see these two completely contradictory arguments made by the same people within a few minutes.

The basic psychology is that on a rational level, you know that it is almost certainly a Ponzi. But you still believe irrationally that if you invest you will make money, likely because you think it's still early. So you act on the belief, that you really don't have, that you don't "really know" that it's a Ponzi "for sure". You convince yourself the on-paper profits you will never withdraw are real, so you start to believe that you are doing well and that convincing others to join will actually help them. And, of course, it will help you. Then you start using pressure and deception to solicit others, telling yourself it's to help them, but of course (coincidentally) it also helps you. However, you are still a sucker falling for a Ponzi scheme.

You really are both a hapless simpleton and an evil mastermind at the same time. Amazing but true.

Consider a PPT operator who says the equivalent of, "Yeah, I guess I knew it was probably a Ponzi scheme, but I still figured people could get in early enough that they'd still make money." Simpleton or mastermind?

legendary
Activity: 3038
Merit: 1660
lose: unfind ... loose: untight

1)  BurtW, ...

3)  The arrogance and outright lies he spread make me sick.

All right Micon - that's a friend of mine you are speaking about. Do you have proof that BurtW has lied about anything? Please quote.

And what about your lies, hmmmm? Provide evidence for the following blind assertions you made in a single post:

"BurtW helped Pirateat40 funnel 100k's of BTC to his scam via PPT bonds" - hint - you've already been corrected in this very thread.

"never invested his own monies" - while I could be anyone claiming anything, I know this assertion to be false. But most importantly, where's your evidence? You do not have any, because you are lying. Making it up as you go along.

In the course of just a couple weeks, you've gone off uncountable times half-cocked with wild assertions that are provably false. With never a mea culpa, apology, or retraction. I think you mean well in general, but your buffoonery is casting a lot of collateral damage. Put that thing away before somebody really gets hurt.


1)  retraction - looks like BurtW was not as smart as i thought.  if he fired his own BTC and set up the PPT system AND posted that it for sure wasnt a ponzi in his sig and i almost forgot about the fake $10k Bet thread.....  im now thinking this is a guy that Believed Pirate lies in totality

You are careening from wall to wall here. So is BurtW an evil mastermind co-conspirator actively stealing vast sums, or a hapless simpleton to be preyed upon by the typical denizen of back alleys? You can't have it both ways.

2)  i think we need to add up some #'s and see how Big of a co-conspirator BurtW is.  looks like he will rank #2 to payb.tc.  I should have ran the math first or phrased it different, but its a considerable sum.  how many BTC are the total of the last round of bonds? those are all Pirate profit now.

You're thrashing again. GLBSE lists the total bonds issued for each and every security. Never mind the fact that BurtW is no longer affiliated with the PPT.x issues. But that has been openly announced. And no, *I'm* not looking it up on your behalf either. Do your own damn legwork.

3) my main assertions are full-cocked, and all look to be 100% true (are you reading the same thread?) this was about Pirate being a total Ponzi schemer paying 7%/wk and it would go boom soon - and it went boom

As far as Pirate being a Ponzi operator, current preponderance of evidence is on your side. Personally, I consider the final verdict still to be out. But the central point is that you've made scores of other assertions that are provably false.

I'm just suggesting that you be a bit more precise about your accusations. To do otherwise makes you look the fool.
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