bustabit – The original crash game

leomedina

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bustabit & bustadice

Quote from: ? on December 03, 2024, 08:53:31 PM

Unfortunately, Max Profit decreased very large in years. In my opinion, This situation is very big problem for whale players.
Because, They can't play for big payout in this situation. What are you thinking about this matter. Thanks and Best Regards.

I'm not too worried about it. Bustabit's wager volume tends to be stable in terms of fiat money, not Bitcoin. This means that a player who used to bet 10 BTC when it was worth $10,000 will only bet 1 BTC today, so they wouldn't need the max-profit that bustabit used to have years ago.

To give you another example, the max-profit exactly a year ago was 18.21 BTC, which was worth ~$730,000 at the time, although Bitcoin's price was already increasing. In September 2023, the max-profit was equivalent to ~$600,000. The max-profit today is 5.46 BTC, which is worth ~$530,000. It's not as small as you'd imagine once you look at it in terms of fiat.

Quote from: hopenotlate on December 04, 2024, 11:23:05 AM

Quote from: leomedina on December 03, 2024, 12:50:07 PM

-snip-

The investing system is designed in a way that naturally incentivizes new investments. For example, a few weeks ago the commission rate was still pretty high (around 70%) partially because Bitcoin's price kept going up, which made it less appealing for investors.
-snip-

Maybe I'm misinterpreting your message but please be so kind to detail more the the bolded red part : how does bitcoin price affect commission rate (assuming it does as I'm understanding from the quoted part of your post)?

You aren't misinterpreting it. The commission rate takes into account the value of the bankroll in BTC/XDR (details here: https://bustabit.com/help/investing). The higher Bitcoin's price goes, the higher the commission and the lower the rate of return for investors. With BTC nearly worth $100,000 right now Shocked

, it's no surprise that the commission rate was going to incentivize some investors to divest.

Mahdirakib

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Quote from: hopenotlate on December 03, 2024, 12:03:08 PM

If you check the image below, taken from dicesites.com, you can see at February the huge dump due to ownership change you mentioned but you can see that from that point bankroll rose back up again to above 1000 BTC but then, starting from July it went down again slowly with those last quite big two dumps happened within the last two/three weeks to basically half as it was in July 2024. ~

Thank you for pointing this out. I hadn't really checked their bankroll during the July month. It was 700+ Bitcoin when I checked it for the last time, I had checked it a few many times within last few months. The max profit limit was almost double of current max profit limit for a few days in the July month. The surge of Bitcoin price has affected the bankroll of Bustabit significantly.

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Quote from: leomedina on December 03, 2024, 12:50:07 PM

-snip-

The investing system is designed in a way that naturally incentivizes new investments. For example, a few weeks ago the commission rate was still pretty high (around 70%) partially because Bitcoin's price kept going up, which made it less appealing for investors.
-snip-

Maybe I'm misinterpreting your message but please be so kind to detail more the the bolded red part : how does bitcoin price affect commission rate (assuming it does as I'm understanding from the quoted part of your post)?

?

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Quote from: leomedina on December 03, 2024, 12:50:07 PM

The investing system is designed in a way that naturally incentivizes new investments. For example, a few weeks ago the commission rate was still pretty high (around 70%) partially because Bitcoin's price kept going up, which made it less appealing for investors. But now that ~200 BTC have been divested, the commission rate dropped to 50%, making it considerably more attractive to them once again.

Dear leomedina, Hello, Firstly, I congratulate you for your new owner with respect to Bustabit. I wish you success.
Also, devans is very precious for me with respect to Bustabit game. And, I like and play Bustabit for a long time.

Unfortunately, Max Profit decreased very large in years. In my opinion, This situation is very big problem for whale players.
Because, They can't play for big payout in this situation. What are you thinking about this matter. Thanks and Best Regards.

leomedina

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Activity: 106

Merit: 34

bustabit & bustadice

Quote from: hopenotlate on December 03, 2024, 05:32:39 AM

Hey there Leo, noticed bankroll is steadily declining due to divestments ( investor profit is usually quite close to profit ATH) in last months , max bet profit is almost half of what it was around 5/6 months ago : do you think it due to BTC reaching its ATH or maybe the recent KYC thing you introduced for new investment or maybe both?

While the mandatory KYC check for new investments has definitely slowed them down, I believe it's mostly due to the price. At least that's what a couple of investors I spoke with mentioned. When I took over, Bitcoin's price was about half of what it is today.

Quote from: hopenotlate on December 03, 2024, 05:32:39 AM

Are you considering lowering commission rate to incentivize investment?

The investing system is designed in a way that naturally incentivizes new investments. For example, a few weeks ago the commission rate was still pretty high (around 70%) partially because Bitcoin's price kept going up, which made it less appealing for investors. But now that ~200 BTC have been divested, the commission rate dropped to 50%, making it considerably more attractive to them once again.

Quote from: TheUltraElite on December 03, 2024, 07:47:04 AM

Quote from: hopenotlate on December 03, 2024, 05:32:39 AM

Are you considering lowering commission rate to incentivize investment?

The recent KYC introduction for the new investments might be a reason why many have divested and new investors are not willing to take part. I would have considered adding in more BTC but after this rule, I am holding on whatever I have already put in and observing how it goes. Till date it has been good with a 20-30% per annum interest and hence I will let it grow on the site.

Lowering the commission could be an option, but I think the KYC hits harder than commission. People are crazy about privacy in this sector and they ought to be.

I'm sure it puts some people off, and as you said, that's understandable. Despite that, we are still verifying new investors every other day, and the lower commission rate could attract even more investments. For what it's worth, the investors' return since February 26th (the day I took over) has been 36%, even though the commission rate was quite high for most of that time.

hopenotlate

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Quote from: Mahdirakib on December 03, 2024, 10:27:26 AM

Quote from: hopenotlate on December 03, 2024, 05:32:39 AM

Hey there Leo, noticed bankroll is steadily declining due to divestments ( investor profit is usually quite close to profit ATH) in last months , max bet profit is almost half of what it was around 5/6 months ago : do you think it due to BTC reaching its ATH or maybe the recent KYC thing you introduced for new investment or maybe both?

Bustabit bankroll had decreased significantly when the ownership transition happened a few months ago. And the max profit limit has been adjusted (lowered) for the reduction of bankroll. The bankroll of Bustabit and the max profit limit is almost similar to what it is now since last few months. I haven't noticed any big changes in it in the recent days. The divestments actually happened when the ownership transition took place in the February month.

You clearly haven't followed the evolution of the bankroll well, at least not the one regarding the period I was referring to

Quote from: hopenotlate on December 03, 2024, 05:32:39 AM

-snip-
in last months , max bet profit is almost half of what it was around 5/6 months ago
-snip-

If you check the image below, taken from dicesites.com, you can see at February the huge dump due to ownership change you mentioned but you can see that from that point bankroll rose back up again to above 1000 BTC but then, starting from July it went down again slowly with those last quite big two dumps happened within the last two/three weeks to basically half as it was in July 2024.

Mahdirakib

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Quote from: hopenotlate on December 03, 2024, 05:32:39 AM

Hey there Leo, noticed bankroll is steadily declining due to divestments ( investor profit is usually quite close to profit ATH) in last months , max bet profit is almost half of what it was around 5/6 months ago : do you think it due to BTC reaching its ATH or maybe the recent KYC thing you introduced for new investment or maybe both?

Bustabit bankroll had decreased significantly when the ownership transition happened a few months ago. And the max profit limit has been adjusted (lowered) for the reduction of bankroll. The bankroll of Bustabit and the max profit limit is almost similar to what it is now since last few months. I haven't noticed any big changes in it in the recent days. The divestments actually happened when the ownership transition took place in the February month.

TheUltraElite

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So anyway, I applied as a merit source :)

Quote from: hopenotlate on December 03, 2024, 05:32:39 AM

Are you considering lowering commission rate to incentivize investment?

The recent KYC introduction for the new investments might be a reason why many have divested and new investors are not willing to take part. I would have considered adding in more BTC but after this rule, I am holding on whatever I have already put in and observing how it goes. Till date it has been good with a 20-30% per annum interest and hence I will let it grow on the site.

Lowering the commission could be an option, but I think the KYC hits harder than commission. People are crazy about privacy in this sector and they ought to be.

hopenotlate

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Hey there Leo, noticed bankroll is steadily declining due to divestments ( investor profit is usually quite close to profit ATH) in last months , max bet profit is almost half of what it was around 5/6 months ago : do you think it due to BTC reaching its ATH or maybe the recent KYC thing you introduced for new investment or maybe both?
Are you considering lowering commission rate to incentivize investment?

leomedina

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Activity: 106

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bustabit & bustadice

Good news! We've finally added support for the Lightning Network on both bustabit and bustadice

The limits are a bit low right now, but we'll be increasing them slowly over time as we get more comfortable managing our channels' liquidity.

TheUltraElite

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So anyway, I applied as a merit source :)

Quote from: Fivestar4everMVP on July 21, 2024, 10:01:19 PM

-snip-

I would once again like to point out, this new rule is applicable to new "investors" not the players and existing investors. The situation is similar but at the same time different because stake does not have such an investment scheme running in it. We can only assume that this would trickle down to players and old investors, but for the time being this is not the case.

I hope things continue running for old investors as they are. I have long terms investment plans on BAB already in their first phase.

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Quote from: virasog on July 20, 2024, 05:24:19 AM

Quote from: hopenotlate on July 20, 2024, 12:41:08 AM

Quote from: TheUltraElite on July 19, 2024, 01:55:14 PM

Read carefully, the need to KYC is currently only applicable to "new" investors, not existing investors, not players, only those who change their investment or newly invest.

So players can continue as they were playing.
-snip-

This new measure makes me wonder a bit; players can keep on playing anonymously, old investors can still stay in the dark but new ones ( or already existing that want to raise their stack) have to verify their identity : why so? Is there any new recent legislation that requires you to verify the source of your investors from a certain date onwards or what? Why investors and not also players?

In that case, i think sooner or later the same rules for KYC may apply for old investors and players too. I also don't think that why only new investors are under the radar ?
Perhaps, they may implement changes in steps otherwise it will being panic among the gamblers already active at bustabit.

This is exactly the same approach stake took when they updated their terms and conditions to announce that kyc had become mandatory on the site, they said that those who are registering new on the site will be required to passed kyc verification before they are even allowed to deposit and start playing on the site, while the old players who are yet to verify their account can continue to play normally like before, and can apply to get their account verified anytime they(the customer) deem it feet and convenient for him or her.

Personally, I think this approach is a strategy the casino employ to not try to make it look like they are pressurizing the already old players, its just a way to give the Old players time to prepare themselves well to get their account verified, while they can still freely play on the casino, forcefully asking every one to pass kyc verification will greatly affect the casino's income, as obviously, all gamblers will be paused from gambling, and only a few will try to pass the verification immediately so as to continue to play, the rest will take their time, and the casino may even lose alot of customers in the process.

leomedina

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bustabit & bustadice

Quote from: JollyGood on July 21, 2024, 05:39:59 AM

Was the new rule introduced because you hold a particular passport and nationality which was different to the possessed by Daniel?

Not at all. The new rule was introduced because Daniel and I receive different legal advice.

Quote from: JollyGood on July 21, 2024, 05:39:59 AM

As for only using private information for checking eligibility for bankroll investment, how will the data be protected. I cannot locate GDPR information on the website even though Europe based players must be using the website.

bustabit is required by law to retain records of all transactions in which it participates. Regardless of whether the GDPR is applicable to bustabit, data kept to fulfill legal requirements is exempt under the GDPR. From a technical perspective, this information is stored in a secure database with restricted access.

JollyGood

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July 8, 2024: To ensure compliance with securities law, only accept new bankroll investments from verified and eligible investors

In the end you have to take the advice your legal team provides because they get paid to protect you and your interests but when you cite security laws, they vary from country to country. There is no one standard unified law. Was the new rule introduced because you hold a particular passport and nationality which was different to the possessed by Daniel?

As for only using private information for checking eligibility for bankroll investment, how will the data be protected. I cannot locate GDPR information on the website even though Europe based players must be using the website.

Quote from: leomedina on July 19, 2024, 10:55:16 AM

Quote from: xxjumperxx on July 19, 2024, 02:28:31 AM

Why was this never an issue with Daniel and now is an issue with the new owner?

Hey, we made KYC mandatory based on our lawyers' advice, and Daniel had a different legal team. Rest assured, your personal information is only used to ensure you're eligible to invest in the bankroll and won't be passed on to third parties.

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Quote from: hopenotlate on July 20, 2024, 12:41:08 AM

This new measure makes me wonder a bit; players can keep on playing anonymously, old investors can still stay in the dark but new ones ( or already existing that want to raise their stack) have to verify their identity : why so? Is there any new recent legislation that requires you to verify the source of your investors from a certain date onwards or what? Why investors and not also players?

1. The casino probably has way more old customers from the early days vs recent times so it better no to bombard them with KYC immediately and make them leave the casino as soon as possible
2. They could be rolling out the KYC verification program in phases, starting with new users

3. Crypto regulations are getting tighter, Gambling regulations a like, so this was expected, similar to what you have seen with most centralized exchanges, so I don't think they have a choice if they want to keep operating.

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Quote from: hopenotlate on July 20, 2024, 12:41:08 AM

Quote from: TheUltraElite on July 19, 2024, 01:55:14 PM

Read carefully, the need to KYC is currently only applicable to "new" investors, not existing investors, not players, only those who change their investment or newly invest.

So players can continue as they were playing.
-snip-

This new measure makes me wonder a bit; players can keep on playing anonymously, old investors can still stay in the dark but new ones ( or already existing that want to raise their stack) have to verify their identity : why so? Is there any new recent legislation that requires you to verify the source of your investors from a certain date onwards or what? Why investors and not also players?

In that case, i think sooner or later the same rules for KYC may apply for old investors and players too. I also don't think that why only new investors are under the radar ?
Perhaps, they may implement changes in steps otherwise it will being panic among the gamblers already active at bustabit.

hopenotlate

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Quote from: TheUltraElite on July 19, 2024, 01:55:14 PM

Read carefully, the need to KYC is currently only applicable to "new" investors, not existing investors, not players, only those who change their investment or newly invest.

So players can continue as they were playing.
-snip-

This new measure makes me wonder a bit; players can keep on playing anonymously, old investors can still stay in the dark but new ones ( or already existing that want to raise their stack) have to verify their identity : why so? Is there any new recent legislation that requires you to verify the source of your investors from a certain date onwards or what? Why investors and not also players?

TheUltraElite

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So anyway, I applied as a merit source :)

Quote from: virasog on July 19, 2024, 11:48:03 AM

The real test will be how many users continue to gamble at bustabit and how many decide to leave because of the KYC ?

Read carefully, the need to KYC is currently only applicable to "new" investors, not existing investors, not players, only those who change their investment or newly invest.

So players can continue as they were playing.

We can assume things may change in future, but for the time being, its not.

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Quote from: xxjumperxx on July 19, 2024, 02:28:31 AM

Why was this never an issue with Daniel and now is an issue with the new owner?

I don't think it is an issue with the owners but it is the pressure by the authorities to have the KYC implemented (as with many other gambling sites) and in most cases, the owners does not have much choice and not everyone is willing to go against the law and eventually face the legal issues in operating the site.

The real test will be how many users continue to gamble at bustabit and how many decide to leave because of the KYC ?

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Quote from: xxjumperxx on July 19, 2024, 02:28:31 AM

Surprised nothing is being said about this:

Quote

Important: verification required for new investments

Mon, Jul 8, 5:21 PM

Dear investor,

To comply with securities law, we will only accept new bankroll investments from verified investors going forward. If you wish to add more money to the bankroll, we will need to confirm your age and your citizenship/residency. If you choose not to go through the verification process, you will not be able to make new investments. However, you will still be able to divest and withdraw your funds as usual.

If you would like to continue investing, please reply to this email or submit a new support request using the form at https://bustabit.com/help/contact to begin the verification process.

Thank you for your understanding, Leo

Why was this never an issue with Daniel and now is an issue with the new owner?

Different times, different rules when it comes to money and online sites. This could be part of the reason Daniel decided to sell the site and walk away. If Leo is being told to do KYC, I'm sure he has good reason and isn't out to screw people over. Just protecting himself and the site.

Topic: bustabit – The original crash game (Read 61361 times)