Topic: Buy the DIP, and HODL! - page 314. (Read 123703 times)

I don't agree with you guys, your most emphasis on price fluctuations are made upon upward trend whereas there can also be a downward trend of price fluctuations which will become more advantage to the investor who has decided to accumulate a certain quantity within a specific period of time. There is a prvoverb that says before a blind man says he is going to stone you he already had a stone in his possession. It shouldn't be seen that anyone venturing in to Bitcoin investment is poor there is still investors that can afford to buy Bitcoin even if the price makes x3 or more the current price that is an assumption based on if their is an upward trend in price fluctuation what about when there is a downward trend?

In my own opinion I dont see any difficulty using the dca method in terms of accumulating Bitcoin on a particular quantity either weekly or monthly, before an investor will have this decision definitely he must have got all his plan worked out by making provisions for his personal needs emergency and reserve fund and also have factored in the price fluctuations as a principle factor of Bitcoin functionality. I think this whole thing is apparently and typically based on individual financial capability.

Indeed, anyone looking forward to build an emergency fund should build it alongside his Bitcoin investment. Lets say the person is using DCA strategy for investment, from a monthly income of $2k. based on the fact that he is still a single youth, he can minimize his expenses to 1k a month then, such person could possibly invest 30% of his income into Bitcoin for a month, which  would be $600 while he can keep 20% for his emergency fund which is a $400. Based on the fact that his monthly expenses can be dealt with $1k, after doing this for 15 months, he must have built a 6 months expenses worth of emergency fund. And thereafter, we can become more aggressive with his Bitcoin investment untill he feel he'll be needing a break or if he has accumulated enough.


I doubt that any of your advise could lead to such scenario of making a failed investment planning. Anyone thinking normally can understand the benefits of your teachings and apply them to make a successful life investment  except, the person is dumb enough not to understand. Though mistake can aren't something we all are immune from, but from experts like yourself, they are minimal.


Trading is like a term used in shitcoins, and Bitcoin primarily is not a short term investment. Those who started their investment early and still holds their coin can attest to the fact that Bitcoin is not a coin for trading. I saw a post some couple of months ago were an investor was bitterly expressing his experiencing how he sold some of his Bitcoin when the price pumped, and he thought that was all, unknown to him that the price just started then. And his advice was, don't sell your coin hold and if possible you could pass some to your next generation. There are many others who had such experience with selling your coin at the peak of a bull run and later came to understand that, it was a dumb discussion they took. Trading Bitcoin will only result to missed opportunities compared to what you could achieve with just holding.

This is right and sometimes experience can determine the faith of an investor, I can relate with what you're trying to say even if I haven't gotten to such level in terms of holding. We can't compare an experienced investor to some newbies who just started their early journey and each time the price keeps increasing or decreasing there's this urge to sell cause they're new to the market. Aside from bitcoin investment, the example you set out is common and I can agree that a lot of newbies could not reach their target due to the excitement or fear of the price meanwhile investors who started earlier could decide to hold regardless of an increase or decrease in Price.


We can all agree not all investors have this faith of holding bitcoin for long term or rather some are just here to hold till they get an increase in the price and decide to sell.
In situations like this It doesn't necessary matter cause it seems they buy for just profit and nothing else. Newly investors who really want to buy and hold will not get over excited with an increase in price, I believe every one has a target for their long term holding and if working towards the line rightly you will definitely exhibit the habit of self control, like some newbies will ask how can I develop such characteristics of an experienced investor, this is just simple and all you need to do is learning from experienced investors who love sharing different ideas on their early holding for example JJG, as a newly investor it's advisable to always follow and read threads like this "dip and hold". I don't know why most people find it difficult to hold or maybe they lack finance for investing but in summary it's advisable never use the money met for something else to accumulate bitcoin.

Of course there is a basis, the only difference between the old holders than the recent new holders is just in the price at which they met bitcoin and nothing more. The spirit of thought to be drawn from the old holders by the recent new holders as a motivation to hold steadfast for long long should be that if the old holders could hold that long and had made this amount of profit assuming as at a time when bitcoin was 7k to now it's rally around $43k, this thought should be something for recent holders to go on with as new investors in the market believing that they too can become lifetime holders just like the earliest bitcoin holders till date. In any business a person engages in if he/she doesn't have a motivating factor it's very easy for the person to crash at the hit of any challenge, which is why in this case the old holders should be seen as a motivating factor to the recent new holders for them to be able to hold too for long because the huge profit from bitcoin is embedded in a long time holding.

Old holders are like heroes the new holders should aspire to be like in the next few years in their holding.

The truth is that is actually very difficult and challenging to  constantly buy a certain amount of Bitcoin on a weekly or monthly basis through DCA method reason been that the price of Bitcoin use to be very volatile and the possibility of meeting or buying at the same price as the previous week is not certain and perhaps it could be that the price has gone up way beyond the price of your last buy so perhaps that's were the ability to adjust to Bitcoin accumulation pattern comes in, so perhaps you can still accumulate with your normal weekly budget even if the amount of Bitcoin you will have will not be up to the last accumulation but however if you have other spare funds that doesn't have any budget for, then you can adjust the accumulation pattern a bit.

Those who held Bitcoin all the way from $7k to $50k are probably lifetime holders. They would have concluded that no matter the price of Bitcoin, they will hold it. They would have overcame the temptation of taking profit that many investors usually do. That price range actually shows such person have seen two bull runs yet still holding so I don't think there is any basis for comparison between such old hands and some new investors that have nit witnessed any bull run.

I do not know about people like this and even if they exist, it could mean such a person is sick of terminal disease of which doctors would have informed him his health status and how long they might possible live. It could also be someone that is healthy but very old to think about investing rather enjoying the retirement and remaining days of their lives is their major concern. Apart from other of these categories, it does not really sound nice to me that someone will refuse to plan for their children and heirs and would want to lavish all he has worked for without leaving a legacy and something the next generation can build from.

To be honest with you, such discussion is outside the scope of our discussion here because we are talking about how to invest in Bitcoin and hold for a long time. If we go into that discussion, it might distract us from the topic of this thread.

My fellow plebs, there's no need to argue or debate on what's the best Bitcoin buying strategy. We simply need to know that if we want to HODL, it should be done with the best asset that will continue to exist for many cycles. If you want to invest in commodities - invest in Gold, if it's in stocks - choose the best companies, but in cryptocurrencies? HODL Bitcoin.

What we truly need to remember is that there's a reciprocation between the global money supply and Bitcoin. If someone could get a graph of the Rate Of Change of the global money supply Year-On-Year, and put a price chart of Bitcoin over it, the reciprocation would be obvious. Is this merely an accident? A mere coinidence? Perhaps it is, but I believe Satoshi might already have a projection in what would happen because of the way the supply distribution and supply inflation was designed.

I don't really think that buying a fix amount of Bitcoin when talking about DCA is proper because to my own understanding, if you really want to buy through the DCA method, then you have to buy with a fix amount of money, weekly or monthly irrespective of the current price of Bitcoin, but if you want to buy a fix amount of Bitcoin, them you might  spend more or less depending on the current price of Bitcoin, but the major challenge with this strategy is that you will be forced to tamper with you emergency fund that would have been for your upkeep till month ending when you are expecting money from another source.

I just believe that the DCA method is design for us to buy in a comfortable manner, not in away that will make us to start doing opportunity cost just to meet up to the target of buying a fix amount of Bitcoin.

Yes, I agree with this. People who have a big income flow daily, weekly, and monthly can buy a fixed amount of bitcoin anytime they want to accumulate it. We should introduce a buying plan that will be suitable for the newbies because they are here to be guided on the right path to accumulate their bitcoin. A newbie who has a low monthly income flow might adopt the buying of a fixed amount of bitcoin, thinking that he or she is using the DCA strategy to accumulate bitcoin, not knowing that he or she will end up selling his bitcoin holdings shortly because he or she will not be able to save an emergency fund to use and settle his financial needs when they arise.

from what you're saying you may agree with me that between the earliest stage bitcoin holders and the recent stage holders, the earliest stage bitcoin holders has the tendency to hold much more longer than they have even previously held compared to the recent bitcoin holders who have just gotten into the market and have little or no experience of certain ups and down in the market from what earliest holders must have experienced.

Imagine a $7k price rise into the current $43k+ price of bitcoin making it $50k, a recent holder will be triggered)tempted to jump into selling to make dollar profit forgetting that the idea was initially to hold for a long long period accumulatively without tampering regardless of  the market price, but to an earliest holder such a price increase is next to nothing or less because he had seen many higher price increases in the past than what he's getting now and to him the holding target continues even after the next ATH. It will take a lot of discipline and determination to hold irrespective of what come may in price for a recent holder to find himself in the lines of holding for long as expected.

I think you are getting it all wrong because that's not what @JayJuanGee was emphasizing on, however I don't think your theory concerning the reason why most people doesn't go for long term holding is right because I find it to be an assumption because there is no way an investor will allow his mindset of living long or not determines his intentions of holding Bitcoin for a very long term because there is no way an investor will no when he will be gone, so that shouldn't be a determining factor against his Bitcoin accumulation and however short term or flipping practice is even the worst because you could lose everything all in the name of chasing Bitcoin price, perhaps understanding the power of holding Bitcoin is actually the beginning of your investment knowledge because holding is the only way to the heart of Bitcoin.

This issue of trading has been addressed by JJG that we shouldn't be doing the comparison between buying and holding and trading in this thread as talking more about trading seems to be like an off topic discussion since the name of the thread is buying the dip and hodl. I honestly see the reason why he said so. Moreover I don't see a base for the meaningless comparison between hodling and trading. Anyone who is interested in talking about trading should look for a thread talking about trading or a thread that allows the comparison between trading and holding. But here let's keep the discussion going according to the thread name.

The amount that is reasonable for anyone to pursue changes with time.  When I first got into bitcoin in late 2013, there were still many normal people shooting for 100 BTC, but then it started to become more and more unrealistic to shoot for that quantity of BTC... so then there became times in 2015/2016 that maybe people were shooting for 21 BTC and then it became 10 BTC, which was still somewhat popular in 2018 through 2020 to shoot for 10 BTC, and so we likely realize that shooting for  1 BTC has been popular recently, but still there are guys who are starting to realize that they may well not be able to reach a whole BTC.. and so it is becoming more realistic to shoot for 10 million satoshis or 21 million satoshis.. and so probably with time, we shoot for as many as we can and we continue to build to then have a next target if we are able to achieve a lower target first we can keep working to increase the target, when it might b feasible to have those kinds of goals.

It is up to you to figure out what might be some potentially reasonable and feasible goals over various periods of time and whether you want to frame your goals in terms of the quantity of BTC accumulated or the quantity of dollars invested, those are all reasonable ways to attempt to make goals that are reasonable and feasible for your own situation.


It is still discretionary how to replenish your emergency fund, including that there could be a period of time in which someone is buying bitcoin and building their emergency fund at the same time, and even thugh that is not ideal and it is a bit of gambling, I would not blame someone to make sure that they are buying bitcoin, since it can take a fucking long time to build an emergency fund that is 3-6 months and sure people who invest should have these things, but if they wait until they have their emergency fund up to adequate levels, then they might delay themselves a year or even longer before they even buy 1 satoshi.. which surely would not be very smart.

Let's say for example someone has a very screwed up financial situation.  He has a debt of $3k and payments of $100 per month for the next 3 or 4 years on the debt and then he has expenses of $1k per month an income that varies between $800 and $2,400 (but usually is around $1,400), and maybe he does not really have any emergency fund, but he usually has about a 2-week float (which means $500), so yeah if he starts building his emergency, he is largely starting from zero, and it coudl take him 2-3 months to build every month worth of emergency fund, so it could take him 6-9 months to get up to a 3 month emergency fund, but if he does not have any BTC investment, then he is not protecting anything with his emergency fund because he has no investment in anything. 

I would suggest that the guy invest equally in his bitcoin and his emergency fund, so even if it takes him 12 to 18 months to build his emergency fund up to 3 months, he has been simultaneously building his Bitcoin, and so once his emergency fund is 3 months, then he can likely be more aggressive with his bitcoin investment, and perhaps still continue to build his emergency fund up to 6 months, and maybe after 4-6 years investing in bitcoin, at that point he might have started to get close to reaching 6 months of an emergency fund and maybe right around the same for his bitcoin investment, and perhaps even more for his bitcoin investment, and the stronger his emergency fund, the more aggressive he can start being with his bitcoin investment and maybe he has a combination of BTC investment, emergency fund, reserve funds and a float.. all building up the longer that he is in bitcoin.


So many people are already used to living without much of an emergency fund.. and yeah, maybe they are not used to investing either, so surely investing should contribute towards their being more responsible in their own finances, otherwise they are going to end up getting reckt at some point sooner or later, and we can say, I told you so... so for sure, no one wants to get reckt. .and so the precautions can really pay off, especially when they are investing into something as volatile (and even inevitably volatile) as bitcoin.


Even though I am glad that some of you guys feel some benefits from some of the ideas sharing in this thread (and maybe other parts of the forum), don't come crying to me if you end up losing money... 

Many of us are regular people and sometimes we even make mistakes in terms of how we say things and how we might be interpreted by others...

and another thing is that there can be two guys looking at the same situation, who may well end up slightly different tradeoffs, and maybe either choice is good for that person, but sometimes there are better choices amongst the ones available, and it can frequently be difficult to know exactly how to make the tradeoffs.. and sometimes taking a bit of extra risk is o.k.. and sometimes playing around a bit is o.k... as long as we don't devolve too much into gambling.. and no one is going to completely know when they have devolved too far into gambling.. because 10% to 20% investment might work for some guys, but others might not be able to afford that level of investing based on their own cashflow versus expenses situation.


That does not really sound like what I was trying to say.  In the end, you have to figure out for yourself what you want to do in terms of what your goals are, and if you want to try to play the short term waves or if you want to accumulate BTC until you get to a certain amount.

Maybe you will be able to figure out how to sell BTC in order to accumulate more BTC, yet it seems to me that in your earliest  years of BTC accumulation you should not even try selling BTC to try to accumulate more, and you should merely be using various kinds of buy strategies including DCA, buying on dips and lump sum buying.  The more BTC you accumulate the more options that you have, and the more BTC you accumulate, you can attempt to assess the status of your own BTC holdings (including how much they are in profits - presuming that they are in profits) and also how much they are worth compared to other kinds of investments (which also may well including your various currency/cash holdings) that you have.

No one can tell you how many BTC that you should have before you might start to consider to modify your BTC accumulation strategy and perhaps start to shift into some other kind of strategy such as maintenance or liquidation... and even going into maintenance stage from accumulation stage, it still might be a bit gradual, so you are still accumulating BTC but is is just a bit differently (and presumptively more informed based on your own situation) than it had been during your earliest stages of BTC accumulation.. it could take you 4-6 years or even longer just to transfer from your early accumulation stages to something that is starting to feel as if you need to make some adjustments from what you had been doing.

You are also responsible to establish how it is that you manage your emergency funds, reserve funds and float.. which may then also help you to figure out if your own BTC accumulation style is aggressive or whimpy... and two people might be employing a 15% BTC accumulation practice, and for one that is whimpy and of the other that is aggressive and maybe even overly aggressive if he does not otherwise have his finances and psychology together sufficiently enough.

Most of the new investors think that Bitcoin investment will only give them profit and they get the impression that they will only keep buying Bitcoin at low price and selling Bitcoin at high price, but they have no idea whether they are investing or not. We know investing and trading are two different things but trading is more difficult than long term investing. A trader should always be active and understand the market well because he is trading for a short period of time and aiming to make some profit, so he must buy coins at the right time. But in case of long term investment there is no such pressure or any such problem. If an investor invests in a long term plan with a little understanding of investment risk and some patience and if he continues to invest consistently then it is definitely positive for him. Since in long term investment plan an investor is buying bitcoins step by step for long term purpose, there is no need to worry about the market or whether he is buying coins at the right time. Since the plan is long-term, he can invest in every market condition.  

I always say this and always believe that investment is much safer than trading and investment is much less risky and investment pressure is much less.

If you are an experienced trader then good luck to you but talking about those new members who just started investing or trading. I believe that those who have enough knowledge about trading and who have enough business skills must have their own investment and trade along with investment. But you will find some new members who have no idea about investing as well as those who have no idea about business they decide to invest or trade only based on the success of others.  

I am not saying that all new investors or new tedders are wrong but there is a class of traders or a class of investors who have the mindset of directly relying on others. When it comes to investing or trading, nothing can be done by depending on others, you should always believe in yourself. You talked about traders as well as you talked about DCA investment strategy.


Investing and trading are two different but similar types of investors who start by investing first give their investment the highest priority as well as continue trading if they can afford it. Since trading is done for a limited period of time, investors consider trading as a separate source of income but their main focus is on their investments.

DCA investment strategy and holding investment are two investment strategies that are interrelated, which is why holding and DCA investment strategies are always discussed together in investing. You may ask me that if I invest a small amount then can I hold my small amount for a long time without DCA investment? Yes of course you can hold your small amount of money for a long time but DCA strategy is considered as the most important investment strategy in investing today to make the investment easier and consistent and to maintain that consistency for a long time.  

No amount of investment is small, but investors invest with some purpose, so if a small amount of money can be invested and held for a long time, then that small amount of capital will not give us much profit. So investors can grow their capital without taking pressure and can maintain this consistency for a long period of time, DCA investment method is currently invested in.  

Just as electricity was a great discovery in science, you can say DCA investment strategy is a great discovery in investing.

This your last paragraph talks more of someone who doesn't like trading but checking your last sentence shows that you like trading. Well in the game of crypto currency every body is left with their personal choices. It might be that most people make profit In trading but trading doesn't gives you the time to do other things. Your focus is only on uptrend and downtrend. to use the opportunity of the down trend 📉 to make profit in the up trend📈. but the disadvantages of trading over holding is that.
  
The mindset of a trader.
1. Trading makes you nervous and panic when you loose.
2. Causes mental and psychological unrest. Every 247 always concentrated and doesn't need distractions.
3 prevent you from doing other important things except if you make out time. Because most traders I know of dont have time for themselves, all what they think is to only focus on their market, because they cant have such fund on trading app, and expect to leave it their without monetoring it.
4 a traders mindset make h/her feel that holding bitcoin for long is a waste of time. because the up and down movement would have been used to make profit, rather leaving it there to waste. So when you are a frequent trader you can never think of holding.

Mindset of a holder over a trader
1. You are not nervous because you don border about anything wether it falls or rise. But keep accumulating and hoping for a better tomorrow.
2. There is no mental psychology unrest. Because your mind is set at zero(0) degree. No need to put all your mind on it anymore.
3. It doesn't prevent you from doing other things. Because you accumulate and hold and feel free, you can go anywhere without monetizing anything.
4. You don't have that mindset that holding is a waste of time and effort. But rather strive to make sure you accumulate knowing truely that the future has a great potential with Bitcoin HODL

So checking the two, you will discover that a holder has more advantage and  health benefits over a trader. For me I prefer HODL for long.

I do not know why some people see DCA and holding as the same thing. DCA is a strategy used in accumulating bitcoin at regular intervals, and it is usually used by old and new investors because it helps to take care of the volatility of bitcoin in your bitcoin investment. Holding is your ability to hold bitcoin after you have accumulated it with the DCA strategy, even when the bitcoin price is increasing or decreasing to the expected year you want to sell it.

Many are not interested in any investment that will take up longer time probably with the notion that they are not going to live longer enough to enjoy it neither do they want family or generation to enjoy it or that they are much comfortable with their current condition and refused to take a step.

Thou, both the short term and long term investment have thier potential benefits but the LONG TERM INVESTMENT POTENTIALLY PROVIDES AN INCREASED CHANCES OF A HIGHER RETURN THROUGH THE COMPOUNDING OF OUR INTEREST AND THE RECOVERY OF LOSSES OVER TIME.

Everyone should know that Bitcoin isn't about getting rich quick thou alot of people sees it that way but it is also about storing and protecting your money and time from government and banks.

Volatility is a factor and principle of Bitcoin functionality (inevitable)  which every good investors sees as an opportunity by always being in the market all the time and without the stress of  timing the market. Your dca strategy serves you better.

I agree with you on this, waiting for the dip is what is unwise here, cause buying the dip is good and would help accumulate more bitcoin and for a cheap price. But waiting for the dip as your only strategy is fucked up for many reasons and one of them to me is how would you know the dip and having to monitor the Market and chart all the time is not reasonable, from my opinion I think most persons that priotise only buying the dip are actually short term investors, else why would they be bothered about buying the dip.
As DCA investor and long term holders we don't have to worry about buying the dip cause we are always accumulating bitcoin no matter the price and if the dip comes we would also be one of the first to take advantage of it, cause instead of wondering where the last dip would be, rather we would DCA IN and end buying at all those profitable intervals.


Indeed the testimony is same for long term holders so far, trading requires much attention and knowledge to be profitable and the risk involved is too much, but we are not here to talk about trading,  DCA has proven to be a good and reliable strategy in accumulating bitcoin cause it is cost effective meaning as a newbie you can start at your level, it's also good cause it eliminates the pressure that comes with market volatility, with DCA all we have to do is remove a portion of our earnings to accumulate bitcoin and start buying, we do not even need to know too much, no rocket science here.

As someone who has been holding for so long, I can attest to this. I've trade and tried to relied on it but it didn't do any good for me. It's stressful and needs more time to focus on.

While for holding, it's just there and no need to do such things but to accumulate and have more through DCA. Proven and tested and very effective.

But for those that are good in trading and they're making a living out of it, I see people that do that and I guess it's just really for them but for me, it's not but it won't stop me to do trades.