Central banks getting ready for cbdc-s USA is good for freedom

DrBeer

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Quote from: lombok on November 29, 2023, 08:50:41 AM

Quote from: DrBeer on November 29, 2023, 06:51:49 AM

....
This is the deepest misconception!
CBDC is not a centralized blockchain like Bitcoin or Ethereum. CBDC is a completely centralized system using blockchain technology. And the desire of states to implement this technology is quite understandable - complete control and management of digital currency, without physical contact with the “wallet owner”. Wallet owner in quotes - this is how it will be written correctly after the introduction of CBDC, because this “owner” is not such, “thanks” to the new technologies embedded in CBDC

I'm dealing with this. CBDC is a currency that is blockchainized and will be very different from Bitcoin and even cryptocurrencies in general which adhere to a decentralized system. In reality, CBDC will act like a country's fiat currency in general.

OP and other Newbies, don't be fooled by this, it is very misleading if CBDC is equated with cryptocurrencies that already exist today.

That’s the whole problem - a substitution of concepts occurs, and a centralized solution for total control of financial flows is passed off as a “free blockchain”. Unfortunately, insight will come very soon, and it will be very unpleasant.
Many people cannot understand a simple axiom - power/state and its financial system require total control and centralized management. And it won’t be any other way, at least in the coming decades... More precisely, until a global change in the paradigm of the state system

lixer

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Quote from: Argoo on November 28, 2023, 01:52:06 PM

Quote from: Darker45 on September 08, 2023, 06:12:58 AM

CBDCs to me are unstoppable. They're a matter of when and not if. Paper bills and coins will be gone. That's the call of the times. The fast development in technology means cold cash is becoming obsolete. The financial world is turning digital. Although developing countries like mine will take a much longer time to adopt, it will eventually happen.

As a result, Bitcoin becomes more and more relevant. CBDCs mean death of privacy. CBDCs mean death of ownership. CBDCs mean death of freedom of money. Bitcoin is our refuge.

CBDC is just an improved cashless payment system that is completely managed by states and their governments. The level of confidentiality in them will be as much as the states themselves want. But states and their authorized bodies will have complete information about everyone who will use CBDC. There is no death to privacy, property or money from CBDCs because they themselves are non-cash government money.

At the same time, paper money will decrease in the volume of its circulation, but I do not think that in the foreseeable future it will disappear completely. There are many categories of people who will not have access to CBDC for various reasons.

CBDC's are centralized, so there is no confidentiality here. Everything is transparent as all transactions are recorded in their own blockchain, just like a typical centralized crypto. There is a death of privacy actually by the time centralized cryptos came out, and add in these CBDC's. But not totally since we can still choose the decentralized cryptos like Bitcoin and then there are still crypto mixing service out there that can make us more private.

Yeah, that's right, paper money will never disappear because there will always be people who prefer them. And it can work as an alternative because an internet or electricity can sometimes be unavailable for us to use a digital currency.

lombok

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Quote from: DrBeer on November 29, 2023, 06:51:49 AM

Quote from: Londonboss2007 on September 08, 2023, 02:07:38 AM

Few up coming cbcd

Countries and their currency projects

Turkey: bitlira
USA USD , circle usdc,dai,busd,paxos,usdt
Europe: eurt tether euro
Canada r3 ubin project Jasper also its joint project with boe the bank of england
Ukraine e-hyrvina
Russia: unknown ? probably russian currency will disapeare.
Australia: unknown
Sweden ekrona
Latin america: e peso
Also the thailand and asia strong cbdc projects joint venture projects.

Conclusion: all other countries Will be clearly strongly regulated and less market dictating everything USA Will be ruled by the capital and markets more then other countries the USDC and usdt and other Stablecoins gives more freedom to people then other cbds projects.
So get your crypto stack it up and head to USA in USA Will be more freedom.
Off course poverty will take over the USA aswell but it will create more opportunities there.
In the next years we probably have situation when USA Will be like tax Free zone like dubai there will be a lot innovation and freedom and people would have more freedom becouse they can use freedom blockchain the btc eth USDT while most of the countries choose very heavy regulated without much of freedom at all cbdc system.

This is the deepest misconception!
CBDC is not a centralized blockchain like Bitcoin or Ethereum. CBDC is a completely centralized system using blockchain technology. And the desire of states to implement this technology is quite understandable - complete control and management of digital currency, without physical contact with the “wallet owner”. Wallet owner in quotes - this is how it will be written correctly after the introduction of CBDC, because this “owner” is not such, “thanks” to the new technologies embedded in CBDC

I'm dealing with this. CBDC is a currency that is blockchainized and will be very different from Bitcoin and even cryptocurrencies in general which adhere to a decentralized system. In reality, CBDC will act like a country's fiat currency in general.

OP and other Newbies, don't be fooled by this, it is very misleading if CBDC is equated with cryptocurrencies that already exist today.

CRAIC

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Quote from: Londonboss2007 on September 08, 2023, 02:07:38 AM

Europe: euro

To be more precise, it's called a Digital Euro

Quote

A digital euro would ensure that citizens of the euro area would continue to have access to widely accepted, safe and trusted means of payment for the digital age. The issuance of a digital euro should be considered a complement to cash and not a replacement for cash

https://www.centralbank.ie/financial-system/payments-and-securities-settlements/a-digital-euro

Husires

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If the market is regulated, why would you need to use USA USD, circle usdc, dai, busd, paxos, usdt? You can directly convert cryptocurrencies into dollars, as banks and exchange services will work to accept cryptocurrencies since they are legal, or accept Bitcoin, and then there is no need for these Stablecoins unless you use some decentralized stablecoins.
Stablecoins were a temporary solution because converting Bitcoin to cash required several days, but now, using the bank, you can convert to dollars at the same moment or vice versa, and you will not need these currencies. However, if they are not legally regulated, restrictions may be imposed on them and then this will cause them to go bankrupt.

benalexis12

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Quote from: Londonboss2007 on September 08, 2023, 02:07:38 AM

Few up coming cbcd

Countries and their currency projects

Turkey: bitlira
USA USD , circle usdc,dai,busd,paxos,usdt
Europe: eurt tether euro
Canada r3 ubin project Jasper also its joint project with boe the bank of england
Ukraine e-hyrvina
Russia: unknown ? probably russian currency will disapeare.
Australia: unknown
Sweden ekrona
Latin america: e peso
Also the thailand and asia strong cbdc projects joint venture projects.

Conclusion: all other countries Will be clearly strongly regulated and less market dictating everything USA Will be ruled by the capital and markets more then other countries the USDC and usdt and other Stablecoins gives more freedom to people then other cbds projects.
So get your crypto stack it up and head to USA in USA Will be more freedom.
Off course poverty will take over the USA aswell but it will create more opportunities there.
In the next years we probably have situation when USA Will be like tax Free zone like dubai there will be a lot innovation and freedom and people would have more freedom becouse they can use freedom blockchain the btc eth USDT while most of the countries choose very heavy regulated without much of freedom at all cbdc system.

I'm not from the US, but what you said op for me is big nonsense. I don't think that will be the way for what you say is freedom. By the way, where did you get that news, because you didn't even provide a source link to make what you say credible?

Just for me, I don't believe in that matter. There is also no reason for me to go to the US just to experience the freedom you are talking about, because even knowing the country we are in, we can experience the freedom you want to convey.

DrBeer

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Quote from: Londonboss2007 on September 08, 2023, 02:07:38 AM

Few up coming cbcd

Countries and their currency projects

Turkey: bitlira
USA USD , circle usdc,dai,busd,paxos,usdt
Europe: eurt tether euro
Canada r3 ubin project Jasper also its joint project with boe the bank of england
Ukraine e-hyrvina
Russia: unknown ? probably russian currency will disapeare.
Australia: unknown
Sweden ekrona
Latin america: e peso
Also the thailand and asia strong cbdc projects joint venture projects.

Conclusion: all other countries Will be clearly strongly regulated and less market dictating everything USA Will be ruled by the capital and markets more then other countries the USDC and usdt and other Stablecoins gives more freedom to people then other cbds projects.
So get your crypto stack it up and head to USA in USA Will be more freedom.
Off course poverty will take over the USA aswell but it will create more opportunities there.
In the next years we probably have situation when USA Will be like tax Free zone like dubai there will be a lot innovation and freedom and people would have more freedom becouse they can use freedom blockchain the btc eth USDT while most of the countries choose very heavy regulated without much of freedom at all cbdc system.

This is the deepest misconception!
CBDC is not a centralized blockchain like Bitcoin or Ethereum. CBDC is a completely centralized system using blockchain technology. And the desire of states to implement this technology is quite understandable - complete control and management of digital currency, without physical contact with the “wallet owner”. Wallet owner in quotes - this is how it will be written correctly after the introduction of CBDC, because this “owner” is not such, “thanks” to the new technologies embedded in CBDC

target

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Every country will have its own CBDC, I don't think there will be an escape for it since the majority of the people are not into crypto yet. Governments may be struggling to catch up with the technology for now but because banks today are like banding together for the adoption of CBDC, crypto may just be adopting side by side with CBDC.

Darker45

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Quote from: Poker Player on November 28, 2023, 10:22:35 PM

Quote from: Darker45 on September 08, 2023, 06:12:58 AM

CBDCs to me are unstoppable. They're a matter of when and not if. Paper bills and coins will be gone. That's the call of the times. The fast development in technology means cold cash is becoming obsolete. The financial world is turning digital. Although developing countries like mine will take a much longer time to adopt, it will eventually happen.

As a result, Bitcoin becomes more and more relevant. CBDCs mean death of privacy. CBDCs mean death of ownership. CBDCs mean death of freedom of money. Bitcoin is our refuge.

It is an optimistic vision of the topic that not many of us share in the forum. Go through other threads and you will see. CBDCs indeed spell the death of privacy but Bitcoin is in more danger than ever of censorship. If you add to that the fact that most people who buy Bitcoin are only thinking about profit and don't care about privacy, using CEX and/or custodial wallets, I'm not that optimistic.

Bitcoin can't truly be in danger of censorship. It resists censorship. People get themselves involved in many things they don't understand or care about. They get themselves censored in one way or another. It's either they learn their lessons or they let history repeat itself. I'm sure the huge majority will embrace whatever currency governments order them to use. CBDCs will be adopted as soon as they're enforced.

Those who "are only thinking about profit and don't care about privacy" might not mind using CBDCs. It's not a problem. But to those who seek an alternative, or when those who are apathetic suddenly realize and begin to shudder at the thought or experience of censorship, Bitcoin will always be there.

moneystery

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with the increasing development of bitcoin, governments are becoming more active in developing their cbdc to match or beat bitcoin. they say cbdc products have transaction speed and security that exceeds what bitcoin offers, but does this threaten the existence of bitcoin? that's not it at all.

in fact, the more active the government is in developing their cbdc, the more people will adopt bitcoin as their means of payment. the reason is simple because bitcoin offers freedom, transparency and pseudonymity in transactions, and the government will not be able to interfere with your ownership of bitcoin. that's what makes bitcoin superior compared to cdbc products which are centralized and prone to intervention.

Poker Player

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Quote from: Darker45 on September 08, 2023, 06:12:58 AM

CBDCs to me are unstoppable. They're a matter of when and not if. Paper bills and coins will be gone. That's the call of the times. The fast development in technology means cold cash is becoming obsolete. The financial world is turning digital. Although developing countries like mine will take a much longer time to adopt, it will eventually happen.

As a result, Bitcoin becomes more and more relevant. CBDCs mean death of privacy. CBDCs mean death of ownership. CBDCs mean death of freedom of money. Bitcoin is our refuge.

It is an optimistic vision of the topic that not many of us share in the forum. Go through other threads and you will see. CBDCs indeed spell the death of privacy but Bitcoin is in more danger than ever of censorship. If you add to that the fact that most people who buy Bitcoin are only thinking about profit and don't care about privacy, using CEX and/or custodial wallets, I'm not that optimistic.

franky1

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Quote from: Londonboss2007 on September 08, 2023, 02:07:38 AM

Few up coming cbcd

Countries and their currency projects

USA USD , circle usdc,dai,busd,paxos,usdt

nope.. stablecoins were not made by anyone affiliated/contracted/proposed to a central bank

however look at some of the ideas coming out of "hyper ledger"
look at things like
https://www.bostonfed.org/publications/one-time-pubs/project-hamilton-phase-1-executive-summary.aspx

o48o

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Quote from: Londonboss2007 on September 08, 2023, 02:07:38 AM

Conclusion: all other countries Will be clearly strongly regulated and less market dictating everything USA Will be ruled by the capital and markets more then other countries the USDC and usdt and other Stablecoins gives more freedom to people then other cbds projects.

You can think stablecoins as tokens representing a value of fiat money, CBDCs are that fiat money itself, so they are very much different concept.
And i am not sure where you are getting this idea that stablecoins would give you more freedom then cbdc. Every stable coin is complying authorities. Tether gives userdata to fbi and they are constantly freezing money etc...
Also stablecoins don't have anough liquidity to hold a candle to cbdc

Quote from: Londonboss2007 on September 08, 2023, 02:07:38 AM

In the next years we probably have situation when USA Will be like tax Free zone like dubai there will be a lot innovation and freedom and people would have more freedom becouse they can use freedom blockchain the btc eth USDT while most of the countries choose very heavy regulated without much of freedom at all cbdc system.

Do you think people in US will want to go in the same direction as dubai? Becoming a tribal autocracy? Human rights violations would go to next level, and most likely so would mass surveillance. Also no more rights for women or lgtb? Flogging and stoning becoming legal forms of judicial punishment? Is that american dream or what you are talking about?

tjtonmoy

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OP here's the information about USDT, USDC, DAI based on Wikipedia.
USDT: Tether (cryptocurrency)
USDC: USD Coin
DAI: Dai (cryptocurrency)
These are not the property of the United States government. Those companies are owned by different individuals. The government can not seize those properties from them(maybe they can if they want to, but this will create conflicts amongst users and many will not use it). Thus they will have no control over them. If you don't know about this then let me tell you, the US government will never allow the use of something that they can't control. That is the reason why they are creating CBDC. It follows the same fundamentals of cryptocurrency which is blockchain technology but it will be more controlled and the government will be able to do whatever they want with it.
With other stable coins or cryptocurrencies, they can't do that. So there's no reason for them to allow its usage. So how does your post make sense? The SEC will soon come after stablecoins. It's just a matter of time.

Argoo

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Quote from: Darker45 on September 08, 2023, 06:12:58 AM

CBDCs to me are unstoppable. They're a matter of when and not if. Paper bills and coins will be gone. That's the call of the times. The fast development in technology means cold cash is becoming obsolete. The financial world is turning digital. Although developing countries like mine will take a much longer time to adopt, it will eventually happen.

As a result, Bitcoin becomes more and more relevant. CBDCs mean death of privacy. CBDCs mean death of ownership. CBDCs mean death of freedom of money. Bitcoin is our refuge.

CBDC is just an improved cashless payment system that is completely managed by states and their governments. The level of confidentiality in them will be as much as the states themselves want. But states and their authorized bodies will have complete information about everyone who will use CBDC. There is no death to privacy, property or money from CBDCs because they themselves are non-cash government money.

At the same time, paper money will decrease in the volume of its circulation, but I do not think that in the foreseeable future it will disappear completely. There are many categories of people who will not have access to CBDC for various reasons.

DrBeer

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Quote from: Londonboss2007 on September 08, 2023, 02:07:38 AM

Few up coming cbcd

Countries and their currency projects

Turkey: bitlira
USA USD , circle usdc,dai,busd,paxos,usdt
Europe: eurt tether euro
Canada r3 ubin project Jasper also its joint project with boe the bank of england
Ukraine e-hyrvina
Russia: unknown ? probably russian currency will disapeare.
Australia: unknown
Sweden ekrona
Latin america: e peso
Also the thailand and asia strong cbdc projects joint venture projects.

Conclusion: all other countries Will be clearly strongly regulated and less market dictating everything USA Will be ruled by the capital and markets more then other countries the USDC and usdt and other Stablecoins gives more freedom to people then other cbds projects.
So get your crypto stack it up and head to USA in USA Will be more freedom.
Off course poverty will take over the USA aswell but it will create more opportunities there.
In the next years we probably have situation when USA Will be like tax Free zone like dubai there will be a lot innovation and freedom and people would have more freedom becouse they can use freedom blockchain the btc eth USDT while most of the countries choose very heavy regulated without much of freedom at all cbdc system.

I will allow myself to globally disagree with you.
1. There is a lot of talk about CBDC, but so far there are no real realizations, and it is not clear when they will be. And there are a lot of objective reasons - we need to restructure the financial system and the banking system of the country.
2. "Good for freedom" - diametrically opposite opinion to reality. CBDC is just a mechanism of total control over the movement of money. And just anonymity and freedoms will lose a lot when CBDC is launched. I repeat 100500 times - CBDC is a transition from incompletely controlled financial systems, to fully, totally controlled and managed financial traffic

Gyfts

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Quote from: Londonboss2007 on September 08, 2023, 06:53:26 AM

And we can expecting trump to come power next year trump support always free markets and that's what usa is all about.

The U.S. is one of the most regulated markets in the world and it will never become a tax free zone for crypto assets (or any other asset, for that matter). It won't be any different when CBDC's get introduced either, I'd expect even higher regulations when the central banks start issuing out CBDC's.

Trump is not going to change any of this. He is pro-free markets, but he's also anti-Bitcoin. He's gone on the record calling it a scam and a threat to USD. He'll easily be influenced into curbing Bitcoin growth by regulating it, and that's under the presumption he wins in 2024 which isn't guaranteed.

mindrust

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I am sick and tired of all the CBDC talk. We have been discussing it for multiple years now and nothing is happening. CBDC's are not even good for crypto, in fact, they are no good for nobody. They suck. I hate FIAT as much as the next guy but CBDC's are worse than FIAT. FIAT at least has a physical form which you can store way and it is anonymous too. CBDC's have none of these features. This freak of nature gives all the control over your finances to the governments. Crypto gives you freedom, this is the exact opposite. We must stand and fight. FIAT and Crypto are the different sides of the same coin. One cannot exist without the other. Fight for FIAT. Fight for crypto. We are together in this war. What is Batman without the Joker? A whole big of nothing.

Cryptomultiplier

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Still in dream land, aye. The reality is far from what you have done well to explain, because as free as the U.S is, the systems is strictly monitored. Anyone with crypto can trade with it, but the current issues lies with the SEC trying to regulate along with other ETF projects and lawsuits that needs sorting and understanding before using CBDC and acceptance of crypto as legal tender.
Still it will be taxed. It's clear how taxing is one major source of economic security for the U.S.

cabron

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Quote from: Londonboss2007 on September 08, 2023, 11:02:03 AM

Quote from: Argoo on September 08, 2023, 09:52:48 AM

I don't think it's worth agreeing with your opinion about the financial freedom that CBDCs bring to people. CBDCs of different states increase the efficiency of the functioning of their national currencies, but do not provide any noticeable freedom in financial relations, since they are completely controlled by the governments of these states. Government cash gives people even more financial freedom than their CBDC.

As for private and commercial CBDCs, such as USDT, USDC, DAI, BUSD, they are direct competitors of state CBDCs and states will limit their circulation over time.

Those will be the CBDS only that those ones Will be relaxed ones. Other countries will get the R3 system cbdcs those will be total control curreencies but USA will get relaxed ones.
The USDC USDT busd Are allready on the plan have seen the future blockchain plan? I guess you are not

Their CBDC is meant to give them universal basic income when the FED starts their QE again. Yup, it must be a good thing for those who don't want to work for they still get some amount of money every month. But of course, this is printed money which will drive also inflation in the coming years. This is going to be scarier by the month.

I think we will be seeing it very soon since Biden is already scaring people with the new covid variant and mandates the mask again and lockdowns.
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