Topic: ChainProfit.com - 27+ BTC Paid | 140% Return | Running over four months now - page 26. (Read 28698 times)

Without explaining how it accomplishes all the rules (especially #6: the owner should not play himself), then this is advertising.

I tried to explain this before.   The author of the code can leave a back door that allows them to game the system.  You have no idea what real code is running.   Just because you can prove the random number is the same for your given inputs, doesn't mean a back door can't be rigged into the code that allows the inputs to be know and tested ahead of time.  While it may not seem like a direct impact on the other players, it wouldn't be a fair system.  The impact could be the house wouldn't be able to allow as big of bets.   (Indirectly that would probably save people coins.)

I actually checked a few dice sites and the proof is mostly just a bunch have hand waving on some sites.   Others that showed the process and back and fourth between the client and sever only allowed one to verify the final result.   If you don't have a wire capture of someone using a backdoor, the end result could look identical.   

People using their own gaming systems is a problem.   That is why you have to have trust with the person.    Just because you naively believe it is safe doesn't mean it is.    There are also many, simpler ways to game the system.  I just don't seen any difference, in both cases it is wrong to allow insiders to play.

How do you solve issue 6 from the list above?

IMHO you are clearly lacking in terms of issue 2. From your description it sounds as if only one person could lose.

Your approach to issue 1 is basically: "we are honest", which is not helping. There is nothing about prior runs or similar things that might make you stand out from the other fresh faces. Even your youtube account is brand new. The video has a spelling error "best choise" instead of choice twice and does not inform about the risks at all.

The get in touch section on your homepage is not filled, its missing a phone number and location.

The overall impression is that you are incompetent at best. It all smells like a quick and careless setup. I am certain there will be a site that looks very similar next week.

No, 6 is a unique problem for ponzi games. A dice site operator playing against their own money does not affect the players.

Your list applies equally to all crypto gambling.   

A ponzi game will be fair only when :
1-the runner of the game, ponzi site, is honest
Well at the startup there is nothing that may proove whether a ponzi site owner is honest or not, however a surviving site will get positive feedbacks in the forums, that may be an indication of his honesty. Unfortunately there is nothing to guarantee it.

2- rules are described clearly and explained in details to make sure even the btc novice makes no mistakes
And assuming this is an honest site, it follows the rules set. And explaining the rules in detail is crucial because, for example, some novices are unaware what an exchange is and that if they use an exchange to send coins the ponzi site will return their earning to the exchange site which is not their own bitcoin address and that they will not receive those coins

3-site is never down during the game
Because this will stop or slow the pace significantly and the chance of latest senders will be lost

4-there are no bugs, and no errors
Such as wrong payment orders

5-show the list of players with all details, including time stamp, payment status etc.
Because a player has right to see them to decide on his chance to win and take the risk or not

6-the owner should not play himself
I don't know how we can be sure of that

Only in this case it can be a trusted one, however since this is gambling, without a license the most honest ponzi will be the most honest illegal ponzi at most.

There are many ways to design such a game to keep it going, such as paying an even greater prize to the last sender of coins, or even greater sum to one of the last 5 senders at random, or to 3 of last 15 senders etc.
Of course there is again a question of impossibility of being sure the prize draw is really random.

If such criteria is established by a non-greedy and honest runner, he can build others confidence  in him, and he can earn little but he can earn continually. However I think it is impossible to be sure of the honesty, I dont know. And it will always be illegal anyway.

I played and I lost and I think playing is being at the mercy of another who has the peace of mind that he wont loose anything and I do not like it, and therefore I do not think I will play again. Nearly all of them are scams anyway.

This is a Ponzi Game. Not a Ponzi Scheme. Ponzi schemes don't tell you they are ponzis. These games do, because they are telling people that giving their money is a gamble, you may or may not get it back. People should know that because they freaking tell you...

It is like boxing. If you start boxing with a random person on street, it is a crime. But, if u do it in the boxing ring, it is a game.

Is not a game, you can't do that. Other person needs to send money on top of the latest one.

i really agree with u.. only check blockchain to see hot wallet, our transaction.. when people do not join it.. we have lost our money

Ponzi by definition always pays until it dies, does not need to be provably fair. Provably fair are for gambling games, not scams.

provably fair and ponzi is contradictory, ponzis are a scam that steals money from "investors" to drive the "game" and provably fair games are games of chance. the two can never go together.

You can't make a provable one, all you can make is a trusted one, which is gained over time. Weeklyponzi is trusted because it has been around for a year. Other ones are not so trust worthy.

so youre saying every roll, you gain 30% profit? ponzis only work based on deposits. so they means the principal has to keep growing to pay per roll.

you would have to do it like a bit coin  casino with the code after every roll.

just like someone mentioned, I dont think a scam can be provably fair lol.

The operator play their own ponzi has no risk. Dice sites are not the same, they are proably fair. Stop repeating the same arguments over and over you allready know my answers. You just ignore the answers because you have no more arguments.

A ponzi is PvP, dice sites are Player vs House.

You just throw out these simple statements all the time.   How do you support gambling and making statements like that?  Do you hold an interest in a gambling site?  

Anyway these games are not proper Ponzi schemes.  There are risks but there are risk of any kind of BTC game.   From http://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/ponzi_scheme

Ponzi scheme
 
Definition

A type of investment fraud in which investors are promised artificially high rates of return with little or no risk; original investors and the perpetrators of the fraud are paid off by funds from later investors, but there is little or no actual business activity that produces revenue. The scheme generates funds for previous investors so long as there is a consistent flow of funds from new investors. This gives the impression that the earlier investments drastically increased in value in a short period of time. The scheme inevitably collapses when too many investors demand redemption or the scheme fails to attract a sufficient number of new investments. The Ponzi scheme is named after Charles Ponzi, who in the 1920s defrauded thousands of investors in Boston.

==================================================================

So far I don't see people promising high rates of return with little or no risk.   These games are clearly labelled how they work.

The only valid issues that I've heard are:
1) There isn't a good way to know the operator doesn't put in his deposits early.   However these sites do charge high fees so it is unlikely they want to make money that way as that would discourage the deposits they need.
2) The operator could just run away with the funds.   That is a common risk to many games, not just these Ponzi style games.

Anyway, in many places it is illegal to gamble unless the government is running the game, so in that context these would be illegal.   However it is unclear if these games would be illegal where gambling is legal.   I don't know of any court cases.    So claiming they are illegal is just blowing smoke.  

However, I do agree these games are very high risk.   It isn't clear that the risk is really worth the award.  

Yes, I hear what you're saying. I think it's a shame and it's true many people on this board have no sense of value or care, no respect for themselves or others. It's hard to find somebody that is trying to do the right thing, like Dooglus for example, so people have to be vigilant. I think it's possible with Ponzi systems so long as the payouts happen transparently, accurately and timely.  I screwed up big time with a small technical issue which delayed payments that were waiting to go out. It was an honest mistake, but it makes it look like I'm trying to pull something.

That is what I was thinking.   So far I haven't seen much proof of it.  The problem is the same with all of they games.   The are set up by people because of greed and it seems that greed is often stronger than honor.  

EDIT: So many of these Ponzi games now.   Clearly greed is the primary motivation.   That is the primary problem.