Topic: china will no longer able to control bitcoin market??? - page 3. (Read 3868 times)

depending with the amount that they are holding mate, as we knew that most of the miners are there, so they can really make some moves
but like what you have said its been international so the holdings are still split and we just needed for big investors to come up and join
the ride.

but i think bitcoin is not a centralize currency as bitcoin is an international currency and therefore China as well as any other country cannot manipulate the price and market of bitcoin.

I've heard it many times that the IMF forbids its members from pegging their currencies to gold

I don't really know if they really claim what they are ascribed to claim but even if so it is not what is going to stop China from pegging its currency to gold. Gold is a highly volatile asset on its own, and its volatility doesn't depend on how well (oh how bad, for that matter) a specific economy fares (which has chosen to peg its currency to gold). Thus, if some country pegged their fiat to gold, that would most certainly create total chaos in the economy once the gold value (price) starts to thrash about as a headless chicken. I think that's the primary reason why the IMF has set this rule. Apart from that, why would China ever want to destroy the dollar if that would inexorably destroy the market for their exports? I don't know about you, but personally, I don't see any real sense behind this idea. Especially when in reality they are hell-bent on devaluing their own currency against the same dollar (obviously, trying to keep balance between devaluation and runaway inflation which such devaluation is prone to cause)

I think you misunderstand me.  Certainly, the yuan won't be stronger than that which it is pegged to.  But it will be fundamentally stronger than all national currencies in the world which are still fiat.  That is all it will need to destroy the dollar.

Why do you think the IMF forbids member states from pegging to gold?


Remember, I wrote, the pegging has to be at a proper price.  At the proper price, the pegging *cheapens* the currency, but at the same time creates confidence in its stability, from then on, at that price.  This was what France did in the 1920s.  Since that was good for France for a decade but  helped destroy the global system, no wonder nothing of the sort has happened with a major economy since.  But, again, the option is there for any country that wants to give the middle finger to the imperial system.  (At least, the option is available to China for blackmailing US policy into helping it out of its current troubles.)

Not many people truly understand pegging, even though it's been done for centuries.

And in all this discussion we have not even got into the relative merits of what you call 'hard currency' or what not (and I assure you the issues are a lot more complex than on the surface.)  I've only been talking about objectively what will happen under what condition.


The Chinese government has a problem today, and that is a more unstable asset bubble than any other major economy.  That is in part due to its own doing, but also in part due to the way the imperial system victimizes countries like China.  (Regardless, the game will be based on power rather than moral rights.)  What we do know is that this brings unpalatable choices, going forward, for both China and the global system, and that the US and China are both trying to push as much pain to the other as possible.

This is a recipe for conflict, and we know that this kind of conflict is good for non-state monies like gold and Bitcoin.

It reflects on the block voting. But to control the price and volume of bitcoin will not possible for the Chinese. The strict rule by the PBOC was making a limit access for the Chinese community to make another manipulation for the bitcoin right now.

I think, The possible thing for the Chinese community are trying to attack through the scalability rule.

yes that is right to say that china do not have an control over bitcoin, as bitcoin is becoming more and more stable therefore it is now becoming more and more popular and that i the reason that china is losing control over bitcoin.

Sure if Bitcoin gets decentralized enough then the Chinese and other monopolywhores wouldn't be able to control much stake in the network and volume of bitcoins in their possession in order to determine prices for us all. We need get involved and get the message everywhere.

China was already not in position to control bitcoin, as bitcoin is a universal currency and therefore it is not such an easy job for a single country to manipulate the price of bitcoin.

Stronger than what they peg their currency to. It is really strange that you can't follow your own idea (or just don't want to)


Read again what I wrote

And then think whether China actually needs that. They have been deliberately devaluing the Chinese Yuan for the purpose of making their exports more competitive at international markets. Pegging the Chinese currency would be a suicide which the Chinese authorities will never go to. If only in your mind heavily obsessed with the ideas of hard currencies. Or should I say delusions?


Me? It is you who first started talking about the Chinese government wanting to issue some obscure GovCoin to solve some of their no less obscure problems. You are as dishonest as before

I think that from the beginning it was impossible for Bitcoin to control Bitcoin, if it was controlled, this would be against nature of Bitcoin. Bitcoin is completely freedom, does not depend on anyone so it is not controlled by anyone. China only has certain influences on Bitcoin as it affects Bitcoin pricing. China is so influenced by the large number of Bitcoin users, miners, and traders most concentrated there. The demand for Bitcoin in China is also quite high, so many transactions are made daily.

Yeah you right, Thanks for the PBOC for what they did was a big factor for the bictoin enthusiast. Whenever China can't happen that they control bitcoin price even before. But I believe China always doing to dump the price value of bitcoin.

In bitcoin, it is only the the people control the price and volume and if majority of people in china uses bitcoins, it means they can collectively make strategies and control the greater share of the bitcoins.

China doesnt have control on bitcoins price is just a hypothesis. After the Chinese Exchanges have failed to do some withdrawals and deposits of bitcoin due to their non-compliance to the AML and KMY regulations the Chinese bitcoin holders has shifted to localbitcoin.com. Chinese has still have a power to manipulate the bitcoins price but we cannot determine its them since they are no longer the Chinese Exchangers.

It is true that they cannot withdraw their coins but they can still trade and sell off their coins if they want to and do what ever they want to other than withdrawals,i have never traded in an Chinese exchange because i am not confortable with it mainly because of the language and i need to use a translater so i am not sure what the situation is at the moment.

This happens because many users from other countries who started adopted bitcoin so that the number of users bitcoin from china are not so giving effect to much for the price of bitcoin. I think this is great news

Sorry, I have no idea what you mean by this.


True.  That is what they have been doing and they are now looking for an exit (or at least potential exit.)

Pegging it to gold would be a declaration of war to the global elites.  It might happen is China is pushed to far, but still not likely, from what I can see.  A properly done pegging would mean the yuan becomes the most stable money, and would send a lot of global capital and demand to China (since initially the yuan would be very cheap, if they do it right.)  Not good for the Western empire's (already shaky) stability!

In any case, it always makes sense for China (or any power not totally in bed with the global elites) to acquire more gold and Bitcoin.

The elites want us to believe gold is volatile and there is plenty of evidence of their manipulation of the gold and silver 'markets.'  Still, over the 4 decades since gold was 'demonetized,' the dollar has lost 97% of its value against gold.  I agree, gold is not for the short-term nervous, but it's a good long-term investment, in proper proportion to your other assets.


Which problem are you talking about?

That all state powers will abuse their issuance of any kind of money is a given.  However, pegging the yuan to a ChinaCoin means that the limited-issuance structure of cryptocurrencies and the yuan becoming an IOU payable in a cryptocurrency will make the yuan structurally the soundest state currency in the world.  That would not be too different from pegging to gold (as I described above.)

And, as I mentioned, the only way the Western elites can fight that eventuality is to support Bitcoin.  So if China doesn't support Bitcoin, the West will (that is, unless and until China becomes a fully embraced ally of the West, which is probably not going to happen.)

In the final analysis, there really is something written in the stars that, in times of global disunity, non-state assets will gold and Bitcoin will do well, one way or another.

I don't think it will change anything

Or do you mean to say that if the Chinese government levies heavy taxes on the miners in China, the latter will do everything to raise fees and thus move the tax burden on ordinary Bitcoin users? I'm afraid they are already laying themselves out to get as much fees as they only can and trying to raise fees further (whatever means they might choose for that) would actually be counterproductive and likely lead to a decline in fees since people will just move to offchain transactions (which they are already doing, anyway)

Actually, I am not so worrying about PBoC and Chinese traders but you are right about miners which located in there would be something if Government trying to push them harder to get some portion of money through taxes.
Current market on China exchanges still on silent phase and we can say they are no longer control bitcoin price but as soon as PBoC allow withdrawals, then... Let's see what will happen, but they will buy I guess and make bitcoin price climb up a bit before sell it again.

until now china exchanger can't withdraw
so china trader still wait and see, can't doing anything, and not deposit again, so in china exchanger bitcoin price always low is compare another exchanger

So they are moving Bitcoin out of China, right?

But isn't that what most government strive for, i.e. to get rid of this Bitcoin? Really, why would they want to prevent bitcoins from leaving China if it would in fact remove a competitor from their national currency, i.e. the Yuan? I see no logic in fighting with that. On the other hand, how can you actually move bitcoins from one country to another? They would still remain in your wallet, and the whole question makes no sense. I'd rather say that the matter is actually about dollars flowing out of China from the accounts in the Chinese banks to accounts in the banks beyond the jurisdiction of Beijing, and that's not what the authorities might want since they understand that their own currency is not worth a shit. But Bitcoin has nothing to do with that