Topic: ▁ ▂ ▄ ▅ ▆ Cloudmining 101 (ponzi risk assessment) ▆ ▅ ▄ ▂ ▁ - page 35. (Read 361607 times)

Quote from: cryptojumper on June 25, 2015, 05:49:51 AM

Up until break even, you are just receiving your own money back.

You are technically right, but in this forum roi often means that you got your money back (since you lose them most of the time lol).

According to wikipedia
return on investment = (gain from investment – cost of investment) / cost of investment
or
return on investment (%) = (Net profit / Investment) × 100
where:
Net profit = gross profit − expenses.

So if your cloudmining contract repaid itself, but did not generate any profit, it would be most accurate to say it was 0% roi, but it's no fun Tongue

For me, ROI can also be seen as a time unit, maybe there is a correct word for it, too.

So: ROI could be 13 months, for example, meaning the time to reach break even (0 expenses, 0 profits).

It's more a return OF investment than ON investment if you look at it this way. But I copied an official explanation of this ecomonic term. Of course it is often being used a bit differently in these forums..

Hubus

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Quote from: cryptojumper on June 25, 2015, 05:49:51 AM

Up until break even, you are just receiving your own money back.

You are technically right, but in this forum roi often means that you got your money back (since you lose them most of the time lol).

According to wikipedia
return on investment = (gain from investment – cost of investment) / cost of investment
or
return on investment (%) = (Net profit / Investment) × 100
where:
Net profit = gross profit − expenses.

So if your cloudmining contract repaid itself, but did not generate any profit, it would be most accurate to say it was 0% roi, but it's no fun Tongue

For me, ROI can also be seen as a time unit, maybe there is a correct word for it, too.

So: ROI could be 13 months, for example, meaning the time to reach break even (0 expenses, 0 profits).

SavellM

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Quote from: cryptojumper on June 25, 2015, 06:10:39 AM

Just a clarification about the much used term ROI (return on investment). I just want to make sure everyone's talking about the same thing.

Someone told me the other day that they had bought some hash contract for let's say 1BTC. It is not transferable or resaleable.
Its only value is its projected earnings. He was very happy to tell me that, over 4 months, he had cumulatively received back in small payments 1BTC and that his ROI was 100%.

I have a conventional fiat business background and said no, your ROI is 0%. The 'asset' that you paid 1BTC for has no fungible value so it is a -1BTC on your balance sheet, which also contains a +1 from your earnings, equalling zero, which is the ROI you would have if the contract stopped paying now.
Up until break even, you are just receiving your own money back.

No need for any abuse here (probably get it anyway), it's a serious question because I can see some newbies seeing claims of 150% ROI meaning 150% profit.

You are technically right, but in this forum roi often means that you got your money back (since you lose them most of the time lol).

According to wikipedia
return on investment = (gain from investment – cost of investment) / cost of investment
or
return on investment (%) = (Net profit / Investment) × 100
where:
Net profit = gross profit − expenses.

So if your cloudmining contract repaid itself, but did not generate any profit, it would be most accurate to say it was 0% roi, but it's no fun Tongue

+1 this is exactly how it should be viewed.
Especially for those contracts that you cannot sell up.

ATCkit

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I stumbled upon such a gem I couldn't resist pasting it here...
Anyone still wondering how all these ponzi scams able to generate quick roi etc? No problem - here is your answer from one of those scams:

Quote from: CoinPig.net on June 24, 2015, 07:36:26 AM

Quote from: Johny Depp on June 23, 2015, 06:10:08 PM

How do you plan to generate the extra percent per month ?

Extra percentage generated automatically.

ya- generated automatically like unicorn droppings.

Phildo

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Quote from: tyrexs on June 25, 2015, 03:32:56 AM

Quote from: Phildo on June 24, 2015, 11:46:45 PM

Quote from: mmmaybe on June 24, 2015, 10:13:55 PM

Quote from: CoinPig.net on June 24, 2015, 07:36:26 AM

Thank you Puppet and all other contributers

I've started cloudmining recently (well, you gotta do something... even if losing) and this thread has been of great importance. Sending a little token of my respect for your work, Puppet Wink

Why do you "gotta do something?"

Because I'm human. Partly, at least Wink

And humans tend to get bored by doing nothing. I'm kinda too old for football etc, so why not mine?

Because you will end up with less bitcoins than you started with. If you want to give away money, I'm sure you can find a better place to spend them than a cloud mining company.

agree with you, because i have bad story with cloud mining. i get my coins back but less bitcoins than i started. so what do you think better ponzi or cloud mining?

Better is doing nothing. If you have x bitcoins or enough money to buy x bitcoins. If you do nothing you will have x bitcoins. No matter what the price of bitcoins, you will be better than having less than x bitcoins which is what you will have if you do a cloud mining ponzi.

cryptojumper

full member

Activity: 154

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I stumbled upon such a gem I couldn't resist pasting it here...
Anyone still wondering how all these ponzi scams able to generate quick roi etc? No problem - here is your answer from one of those scams:

Quote from: Johny Depp on June 23, 2015, 06:10:08 PM

How do you plan to generate the extra percent per month ?

Extra percentage generated automatically.

cryptojumper

full member

Activity: 154

Merit: 100

Quote from: Phildo on June 24, 2015, 11:46:45 PM

Just a clarification about the much used term ROI (return on investment). I just want to make sure everyone's talking about the same thing.

Someone told me the other day that they had bought some hash contract for let's say 1BTC. It is not transferable or resaleable.
Its only value is its projected earnings. He was very happy to tell me that, over 4 months, he had cumulatively received back in small payments 1BTC and that his ROI was 100%.

I have a conventional fiat business background and said no, your ROI is 0%. The 'asset' that you paid 1BTC for has no fungible value so it is a -1BTC on your balance sheet, which also contains a +1 from your earnings, equalling zero, which is the ROI you would have if the contract stopped paying now.
Up until break even, you are just receiving your own money back.

No need for any abuse here (probably get it anyway), it's a serious question because I can see some newbies seeing claims of 150% ROI meaning 150% profit.

You are technically right, but in this forum roi often means that you got your money back (since you lose them most of the time lol).

According to wikipedia
return on investment = (gain from investment – cost of investment) / cost of investment
or
return on investment (%) = (Net profit / Investment) × 100
where:
Net profit = gross profit − expenses.

So if your cloudmining contract repaid itself, but did not generate any profit, it would be most accurate to say it was 0% roi, but it's no fun Tongue

tyrexs

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Activity: 266

Merit: 250

Quote from: mmmaybe on June 24, 2015, 10:13:55 PM

Quote from: mmmaybe on June 24, 2015, 10:13:55 PM

Thank you Puppet and all other contributers

I've started cloudmining recently (well, you gotta do something... even if losing) and this thread has been of great importance. Sending a little token of my respect for your work, Puppet Wink

Why do you "gotta do something?"

Because I'm human. Partly, at least Wink

And humans tend to get bored by doing nothing. I'm kinda too old for football etc, so why not mine?

Because you will end up with less bitcoins than you started with. If you want to give away money, I'm sure you can find a better place to spend them than a cloud mining company.

agree with you, because i have bad story with cloud mining. i get my coins back but less bitcoins than i started. so what do you think better ponzi or cloud mining?

tmfp

legendary

Activity: 1932

Merit: 1737

"Common rogue from Russia with a bare ass."

Just a clarification about the much used term ROI (return on investment). I just want to make sure everyone's talking about the same thing.

Someone told me the other day that they had bought some hash contract for let's say 1BTC. It is not transferable or resaleable.
Its only value is its projected earnings. He was very happy to tell me that, over 4 months, he had cumulatively received back in small payments 1BTC and that his ROI was 100%.

I have a conventional fiat business background and said no, your ROI is 0%. The 'asset' that you paid 1BTC for has no fungible value so it is a -1BTC on your balance sheet, which also contains a +1 from your earnings, equalling zero, which is the ROI you would have if the contract stopped paying now.
Up until break even, you are just receiving your own money back.

No need for any abuse here (probably get it anyway), it's a serious question because I can see some newbies seeing claims of 150% ROI meaning 150% profit.

Phildo

legendary

Activity: 1526

Merit: 1000

Thank you Puppet and all other contributers

I've started cloudmining recently (well, you gotta do something... even if losing) and this thread has been of great importance. Sending a little token of my respect for your work, Puppet Wink

Why do you "gotta do something?"

Because I'm human. Partly, at least Wink

And humans tend to get bored by doing nothing. I'm kinda too old for football etc, so why not mine?

Because you will end up with less bitcoins than you started with. If you want to give away money, I'm sure you can find a better place to spend them than a cloud mining company.

mmmaybe

sr. member

Activity: 462

Merit: 250

Thank you Puppet and all other contributers

I've started cloudmining recently (well, you gotta do something... even if losing) and this thread has been of great importance. Sending a little token of my respect for your work, Puppet Wink

Why do you "gotta do something?"

Because I'm human. Partly, at least Wink

And humans tend to get bored by doing nothing. I'm kinda too old for football etc, so why not mine?

cryptojumper

full member

Activity: 154

Merit: 100

Thank you Puppet and all other contributers

I've started cloudmining recently (well, you gotta do something... even if losing) and this thread has been of great importance. Sending a little token of my respect for your work, Puppet Wink

Why do you "gotta do something?"

You know an old saying a man's gotta do what a man's gotta do.. Lol he takes it literally looks like.. Tongue

Seriously, he does not intend to lose it, just says he is willing to a take big risk I would think..

Phildo

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