Topic: Could Monero replace Bitcoin soon? - page 14. (Read 33721 times)

The bitcoin is the king at the moment as it is still developed actively.
If that does not happpened in the future, it will be replaced.

Remember Louis XVI...

You quoted one proposed resolution.  It may be that there are problems with it, due to bit mixing, but if everyone could destroy *part* of the key, it might be feasible to trust the set-up.  I have not worked through the math, so I am commenting from ignorance, but also from generally applicable principles.  Once the number and diversity of the required conspirators becomes large enough, a practically useful number of non-participants will deem the result trustworthy.

It's not my only reservation, or I might consider it resolvable.  The number of serious reservations makes resolution of all of them seem unlikely.

I have a question. If zcash will continue to release using the "trusted set up" then there is a high chance that it will be bashed by the known people of crypto. So I ask, what do you think is the better option for the zcash development team? How can they eliminate the trusted set up? Do they have to start from scratch?

Yeah, I remember people saying that about Netscape Navigator back when the internet was born and they commanded 50 USD to see it in color.

How did that work out for them again?

You just can't say that, nobody can. Sorry. Thanks.

Edit bad comparison, but you get the point. Innovation breeds more of the same and so on.

Its not possible no coin will ever overtake bitcoin. Bitcoin will always be the king and there will be other jesters and jokers and queens but only one king.

At this point Bitcoin acts like fiat... Yeah, sure these "investors" might just want Bitcoin out of it, but those same people just want to double or triple their fiat, not have there wealth in and transact in crypto currencies.

So when they get out of the markets with their precious Bitcoin/fiat ; I say good riddance.

you are right here bitcoin is public where people choose to use bitcoin as they currency because they can do many in bitcoin where they can exchange in into another coin , they can do gambling activities etc , and trading also in monero is private where some people don't know what is it for now

Of course not,but,who's care? Most of the investors just want to earn more BTC

Indeed, the "trusted setup" is a funny concept in a trustless, distributed environment.  This could be rendered trustworthy if each potential participant in ZCASH were be a member of the trusted setup.  As such, you know of yourself that you are "fair", and if ALL users collude, that's their affair, isn't it !

So ZCASH's system seems to be a perfect way of having an anonymous trusted PRIVATE block chain between a finite, and a priori known number of participants that don't need to know eachother.  But it cannot be trusted by newcomers afterwards (the old boys can collude against you).  In fact, ZCASH's system is a kind of Proof of initial stake to the extreme. 


This is my main problem with it.  The trusted setup is a problem of principle, but I could eventually live with it.  But you can only use "anonymity" with such a chain bloat that you can do it for only a few transactions if I understand well.  If ZCASH were to use anonymity systematically, it would be like monero using ring signatures with a few million of signatures or so.

I think the main selling point of ZCASH is that it can sell fake anonymity to believers.  And as most people are not sufficiently technically aware of all these aspects, there might be many many believers.   As such, a believers' trusted setup is not a problem.  Many people don't REALLY need anonymity, they only need to believe it.  Those that really need it might be in trouble of course.

I wasn't talking about the price of the coin, but the price of a transaction.   If there is a market demand for, say, 700 transactions per second (currency usage), and there is room for 7 transactions per second (that's optimistic: 0.3K per transaction is about the smallest you can do), then there will be a fierce fight to be in the 1% transactions that get in.  The fee war will be such that only big transactions are worth while.   Take the top 1% transaction amounts and you have an idea of what will be the amounts that can still be paid in bitcoin.

So, buying a new car with bitcoin is still something to do, but buying a coffee not.

If I cared about privacy I would not use cryptographic software implemented by former IDF, paid by the Israeli government.  The likelihood that these people are SIGINT operatives is overwhelming.  It's like accepting NSA-coin as your privacy cover.

Is it even remotely reasonable to trust the supply of ZCash?  The incentives to subvert this are potentially astronomical, and the act itself will be undetectable,  until the hyperinflation sets in.

The last time I reviewed their proposal and code, the sheer size of the proofs rendered the system incapable of scaling to any significant usage traffic.  Has that been fixed?

And even if none of those problems existed, the underlying mathematics has not seen the decades of peer review that cryptonote's algorithms have enjoyed.  The trust factor just isn't there.

Monero is clearly being pumped right now by folks who intend to switch to Z-Cash when it launches. Not saying Monero lacks merit, just that it's more fun and games than anything else at the moment. The vol is attractive as well.

Please keep in mind that I do not see pumping and dumping as a strategy used by day traders as bad. It is just a natural occurrence in the market that came from a trading strategy that is done for profit. The people who frown down upon it are the ones who are the victims of this. In fact the losers are at fault here because they were stupid enough to fall for the ruse.

If they are dumping into darknet users, then the valuation is partly utility, which changes the dynamics. The same could be said of Bitcoin's darknet and remittance markets, and use as an alt coin on-ramp.

Great insight... Only a couple more weeks until you can join a signature campaign!! 

Bitcoin = Public Ledger
Monero = Private Ledger

Everything else = Pump n' Dump / Speculation

There's no need to worry about because bitcoin for me is the father of all alt coins , why should it can be change by alt coins ? hmm and many people are using bitcoin to exhange into another altcoin so that they can grow their bitcoin by trading it selling it and etc m if bitcoin died then all alt coins will die soon also

monero never can move or replace posititon bitcoin

I am afraid that is true. There are many traders who are very happy to take advantage and trade in and out of XMR now because the upside volatility is very high. This is what I said in another thread and I did not mean anything bad with it. I was only saying it in a factual way because that is how markets are. But I was told by smoothie that I was envious because he thought I was saying that XMR is being pumped and dumped. Which it actually is happening now because the traders buy in and then dump higher.