Topic: Death to the mercenary miners! - page 2. (Read 4101 times)

If you're in it for the long haul and not planning on selling your own coins in the short or medium term, then why are you concerned about the current downward pressure on price?

Never, Never, Never, Under any Circumstances............................

Underestimate the power of STUPIDITY!

 

DKN

How'd you get your coins?  Oh yea, Miners who sold them.

Nuff said.

So you are saying the entire volume has been miners selling off their immediate gains and then bots recycling the coins back and forth? Really? So what about the guy who dumped ~10k bitcoins in the market last Monday? Was that miners instantly selling their earnings or bots? Or how about any of the other large (>1000 btc) asks that have been there all last week and weekend, effectively stalling the market and causing its gradual decline?

Nice way to try and shift the blame to miners tho. Here, let me tell you a little something, boy. I'm cracking 6 Ghash/s and I am making ~3btc per day. Your average miner, he's got a lot less hardware and is lucky to be making even .75 btc/day. I highly doubt they are taking their .75 btc that they mined that day and immediately selling it. And even if they did, your precious bots would eat those btc up without even blinking. Miners aren't the ones causing excess supply in the market, early adopters and speculators who hold a lot of bitcoins are.

I do hope that your little fantasy world is warm and that everyone likes you there. Out here in the real world we know better. Do you honestly believe that load of horseshit you spewed at the top of this thread? If so then you are definitely one useful idiot. If you don't believe it, then you are probably one of the ones trying to quietly exit stage left before the inevitible panic selling begins.

And of course, if the blocks continue to be found more frequently than every 10 minutes, that halving will be brought even further forward.  Here's the calculation if the average block finding rate continues:


blocks 136939 through 136943 (5 blocks) were found in the last 8 minutes!

For many of the purposes that generated coins would be valuable, coins purchased from a large exchange work just as well, or perhaps even better.

We're currently on block 136938.
Block reward halves after block 210000.
New blocks happen about once every 10 minutes.


At that rate, we can expect the first halving in December 2012.

This makes sense because the difficulty lags behind the network speed, and so blocks have been generated a little more quickly than every 10 minutes, meaning the reward will halve to 25 BTC in a little less than 4 years from 9-Jan-2009 (the date block 1 was found).


The average time between blocks so far has been 9.7 minutes, not 10 minutes.

Not next year, it's 2013

No, of course not, you genius. It couldn't possibly have anything to do with the free trades and the inevitable high frequency churn it facilitates, could it?   Couldn't possibly be the same coins traded over and over, right? It must pain you to know that if you were twice as smart, you'd still be stupid.

there's also the factor of newly mined coins that holds some kind of value for some people. when you mine, then you know these virgin coins has never been touched by anyone else  , whereas if you only buy coins, you know for sure it has already been "used". like mentioned before in this thread, mining is not always about selling right away for a profit. it's about the value of newly minted coins, which pure traders will never see.

by increasing supply, obviously.

Some early adopters are already planning on heavily investing right back into the community...

That's a nice fantasy, but the volume of trading on Mt.Gox for the last week alone has been significantly higher than all the bitcoins mined for the entire last month.

What most people aren't realizing is that the huge sell orders are not coming from miners, well not any that started after March, anyway. It's the people who have tens of thousands of bitcoins that are putting up the 'sell' walls you see on the charts. Simply put, some early adopters are slowly cashing out. Makes one wonder about the actual long term viability of the project.

When I decided I wanted some exposure to bitcoin it seemed to me that an efficient mining setup would exceed the amount of $$$ I wanted to have in play in the near future.  Also, that there were significant risks in terms of overall mining participation.  For that reason, I choose to simply 'speculate'.

I cannot begrudge any miner for any liquidation strategy they may choose...they did the work and carry the water to make the system sound at this point so what they do with their earnings is not my business.  Indeed, I may well continue to accumulate so any miners who 'mis-manage' their liquidations and cause price dips on the exchanges are doing me a big favor.  Similar to the (purported) paper shorts in the PM markets over the years...if they have the half the impact on price that many PM-bugs assert, I owe them a giant debt of gratitude.  (Though I am sure I would feel differently if/when I wish to be a seller

If miner liquidations are a major reason for the decline in BTC value and subsequent loss of confidence by otherwise interested participants, that would be unfortunate.  But I actually doubt that this is a large factor though I have nothing more than a hunch to back this up.

When I entered the bitcoinverse I looked things over and saw two options: mine or speculate.

Now I've got a fair economic background/education and I probably could have done pretty well for myself as a speculator, but my technical side is MUCH stronger so I went with the position that better suited my skills. I sell some of my coins, I hold others and I even do a bit of speculative trading with a few. After amortized cost of hardware and electricity, I've paid under $5 for each BTC mined, which is a pretty good bargain compared even to the currently low/stagnant market prices.

Mining is nothing more than a method for the more technical among us to obtain BTC at a fraction of market value and if more people looked at it in this light rather than as an effortless source of income, the markets would probably be much better off.

bumb

It could be that the rest of July may be a good buying opportunity   btc and used hardware wise.  All who wanted to get a hold of BTC at lower rates - this is your time now.

This is just not true at all.  I run a large mining operating and I have never sold a single coin.  I pay for my electricity through other sources of income (and I suspect many other do also).  My point being that many miners use mining as a way to get in without using the exchanges.  People miss this point *all the time*.  Mining costs a lot of money, but so does buying it on the exchange (it takes US dollars to buy the bitcoins).  Mining is an easy way to use USD to buy Bitcoins.  I'm not buying them in the traditional sense (purchasing them on an exchange, like mtgox), but I am buying them in terms of computer parts that generate bitcoins.

How is the Price driven down can someone explain it to me?

Mining is a crucial part of the equation, so whether someone panics and sells their mining rig before recouping the costs or panic sells their 1000 BTC at $10, only to watch it bounce right back to $15.......its simply a bad decision.

There's room for miners and speculators but doing either successfully is never easy.

Just like in trading the US equity markets, If you are under the gun to make money (trading or mining) then your are doomed for failure most of the time.

Mine some coins, buy some coins, sit back and watch the show.......................

Weeeeeee

DKN