Topic: DESIGNING the next generation FAST CRYPTO CURRENCY MINING MACHINE - page 3. (Read 23001 times)

Question are you willing to be taxed for using bitcoins? Mining it tax and spending tax and transfer tax.

Lets not kid ourselves here, you want bitcoins to be accepted by government right? and most important of all Vendors as that seems to be you're most important player in the game. Before all vendors accept Bitcoins with all its disadvantages government will need to regulate it for the security of the economy and global markets. Then the internet will require less anonymity to access and conduct affairs for business.

Just want everyone to have this reality check.

Again you are assuming people have to mine to use bitcoin, which is just flat out untrue.  There will always be enough miners to keep the system going, as the orders for ASICs have shown us.  There is no shortage of people willing to pay the costs to continue to mine bitcoin, it will just be fewer than were able to when GPU mining was profitable.   More and more online vendors are taking bitcoin every day, and they have no need whatsoever to even think about mining a bitcoin.   Miners are important, they aren't the only part of bitcoin however.

Maybe that's how litecoin works, and if so great we'll have litecoin be the "miners only" cryptocurrency.  Bitcoin however has bigger goals with broad usage among the developing world being a primary one.  These users will never have a chance to mine even if mining stayed GPU only, but will have a chance to reap the same benefits all users of bitcoin as a currency enjoy.

OP deleted posts to clean up the thread. Not to silence you.

Sour grapes? Woh! I have no skin in this game. I'm presently in litecoin. I'm not arguing I'm putting my opinions out there and it seems to not to be your liking. I sense a bit of elitism in your tone.

You seem to have forgotten one thing and that is people will lose interest in a game they can't win at. How are you going to have the global population adopt something they can't afford? Asic's may be affordable now they will eventually be more and more specialized and less people in control of it. You think everyone here would be interested in asic's if they first came out? No it was mine on your CPU and get rich.

Now its if you want to stay in the game you need to buy this product that does only one thing. I'm mining litecoins and will until I can't make money after that I'll do something else other than mining and guess what happens to my wallet? Then guess what happens to many other wallets. This is just a scenario. One scenario you refuse to see.

In the end unless people mine it they won't use it. The rise in price is only due to speculation and the miners need to profit for their work. Less miners and you get less people using the money. Unless the government adopts it and makes it legal and tax it. Then businesses will adopt it and it becomes what we hate now the reason why we mine bitcoins in the first place DECENTRALIZED CURRENCY. Then who will want bitcoin? maybe a few but it will just become what we are running from.

centralized and dominated and controlled by the few with too much.

This is my opinion

Your argument falls flat on it's face when you look at bitcoin becoming globally accepted.  How do people in other countries "compete" when they cannot even afford simple GPU set ups many miners currently use?   Mining was always going to be a highly specialized field, not the "everyone who uses bitcoin also mines for profit" utopia you seem to envision. 

Honestly reading through the replies this just seems to be alot of sour grapes that the boat is passing them by, those that can't afford to get in ASICs see their potential profits being taken away and are understandably upset.  There will be alt coins for GPU miners once enough ASICs go online and "price you out", but bitcoin will continue to be a thriving cryptocurrency as long as vendors and users keep joining.  Be thankful you were mining on a GPU when you were and made what you made, many didn't even get that far.

I disagree with you sir. That was one of the fundamentals of bitcoin as it has slowly eroded to satisfy peoples inability to compete.

You really don't make any good points as to why average Joes need to be mining.  We're talking about 100,000 ASIC miners by the end of the year with Avalon and BFL both likely shipping as well as whatever ASICMINER puts out on top of any another companies that come out between now and then.  Your fears of "one miner standing" are highly unfounded, the pool will be smaller than if "GPU mining only" existed but still large enough and continue to grow.

GPU miners are not the backbone of bitcoin as much as some of you in this thread seem to think you are.  MINERS are the backbone of bitcoin, whether they be GPU or ASIC based does not matter to the overall success of the coin.  It's adaption by vendors and users, two groups which have no need to do any mining, will determine whether or not it succeeds.

Litecoin is def. The way to go if you are going to invest that kind of money. Litecoin is bitcoins baby brother, I think the bitcoin market in a year is going to be so saturated and difficulty so high you ill literally need hardware thats 100x as fast as today.

Yes there have been those that have tried with their own solutions. Not many people have gotten it to perform adequately because everybody wants BTC right now.

Many modern FPGA's would be just fine at mining LTC, however it just takes dedicated coders to actually develop the Verilog for scrypt on FPGA's.

As far as building ASIC's for scrypt goes, it would require the understanding that developed through SHA256 with bitcoin and FPGA's first. So essentially the same evolution of hardware.

Even after NAT?

i have access to at least 8192 different ip addresses from at least one /19 sub. you see this will not work.

How about limiting the ghs/ip and/or ghs/pool/ip's connecting to it. The ip is the only local denominator here. So that brings another limit. Unless there is a way of spoofing ip addresses then its a no go.

I really don't want to go into licenses as that becomes taxable although that would make the currency legal and most would hate that.

However if you could make this p2p to generate temporary tickets according to locations it would be harder to spoof. I dunno I guess people would see they can't expand and stop mining.

// end rambling

I have to crash too, but I'll sleep on this.  we need a solution from now until the end where the miners are always decentralized and always reasonably compensated.. else it's just "vlad the mining empire".

The whole wealthy vs joe blow is extremely hard to solve without creating a managed crypto-currency. Even if you control technology progression, the wealthy can build a bigger farm and push Joe out by the sheerness of difficulty.

The only solution I have come to is to tie the price of the currency to the difficulty itself, so as difficulty goes up so does the price equally. What this would accomplish would be fixed profitability. By price in this part I mean the exchange rate to other currencies.

For example a 5gh/sec machine will always produce the same income. The next problem is how can you control the price against other currencies? I guess the only way to acomplish this would be that the currency itself is also a decentralized exchange.

So the crypto currency quotes the ask and the bid not the buyers and sellers. Basically the ask/bid would always be the same on any given day, and people can only buy and sell at that price.

So the Rich guy can buy more machines to make more money if so he deems, and Joe can make the same income. These are just some thoughts on re-writing the abilities of the currency.

At the end either way you look at it bitcoin or lightcoin or any current coin will become centralized because of the opposite things outlined in this post. The only time that might stop is if transaction fees are high enough to make it worth while for avg joe to run.

If you even reply to this, make sure you read each point slowly and re-read it, I'm re-reading it now and new ideas and thoughts are coming to my mind. I will sit down at a later time and work on this some more and improve upon it, as there are many more questions. Such as how would the above said coin work if becomes a world currency and replaces other currencies or makes then absolete?

I guess then goods and services would alter their price based on the daily value of the currency all done automatically of course. I will post this to a new thread later as it will hijack this one, I am going to sleep now to tired to keep thinking about this hopefully it doesn't keep me awake lol

To add to this a good solution to decentrilization would be insanely low energy as it run off a solar panel type of energy, at least if the operational costs are none or almost none. Either by free energy sources or the operational costs are covered by the transaction fees in the end, once all coins are created. Then people will run the miners to support decentralization.

In the end though the ideals of bitcoin or even our above fantasy coin will falter and die. What bitcoin, through the idea of de-centrilization stands for is freedom. Absolute freedom, the highest form of morality. Freedom from fiat. Freedom from the machine of debt and inflation which destroy wealth. Freedom from enslavement. Freedom of life! This freedom is very dangerous to the "Vlad" (The elite in this definition). As we move toward a new world order, a world of fascist enslavement. The "Vlad" will corrupt the ideals of bitcoin into a centralized one world currency. The transactions will be encrypted for the masses, but not for Vlads centralized monotoring system. Encrypted, Centralized, and controlled for the benefit of the Vlad. Meanwhile the masses, will without question blindly accept the corrupted ideals under the guise of "safety and security". Through the corruption of their souls, their only goal will be self preservation, they will easily give up the ideal of freedom.

 No one will care about the dream that once was and will never be...

Sorry I won't I might as well trust the bank.

Eventually a 600W ASIC device will only mine several dollars worth of bitcoin per day, barely pay the electricity, but by that time the amount of people who are mining might be magnitudes higher than today

It is difficult to follow the hardware trend, eventually people will just buy coins and leave mining to a couple of companies to handle the infrastructure of this payment network

Hey there was a governing effect that gave value to the crypto currency which involved the price of electricity. It could be argued that by using asics that require less electricity to create more hashs it devalues the bitcoin. Even though the amount is finite. This is the reason why gpu's are leaving in the first place.

definitely still interested in helping out as much as I can!

i say that. first of all amd gpu can be bought almost everywhere today. asic can not. second: security of btc is in numbers of people mining not just th/s. asic will consolidate miners, few large ones will remain, and that makes network weaker. ultimately if there was just one miner left standing, would you consider btc safe? no? even if he had gazzilionH/s? still no?

even if there will be 1000 asic miners left which i doubt it would still be worse than ltc network with 10000 gpu miners.

the point of crypto currency is decentralisation. asic is the force to the opposite.

Q: Has anybody designed/tried to design an FPGA to mine LTC yet?