Disadvantages of non detectable early Plagiarism

GeorgeJohn

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Quote from: Habibul08 on November 26, 2021, 01:02:31 AM

As a newbie in this forum of course it will be very difficult for me to post quality things without reading a lot and increasing knowledge. Without the two things above, it is very possible for us to be involved in plagiarism, whether detected or not.

you can read from anywhere depending your research and understanding before putting it in writing for the community, but the major concern is that read and provide the source, and don't act as the original source while is already existing work done for period of time.

Quote from: Habibul08 on November 26, 2021, 01:02:31 AM

Of course this is very detrimental and also never recommended even though basically we just want to contribute. I've heard a lot of advice on how to do it well, but I know it's hard, but I'm sure it will pay off and eventually we can feel that it will never be in vain.

It's obvious that to secure knowledge or master a specific something it will surely undergoes strees and other difficult things to make it to come to reality, nothing comes so easily, it's hard work that makes impossibility to become possible.

UserU

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Quote from: LoyceV on November 27, 2021, 06:25:41 AM

This rule has no meaning! If it would be removed, nothing would change because anything that isn't in the rules is allowed. The "discouraging" comes from users, not from Mods. So I consider it a clarification and warning instead of a rule.

Agree, I feel its more or less caveat emptor. Not like those involved would be banned anyway.

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Quote from: GeorgeJohn on November 26, 2021, 04:01:24 PM

are you saying that someone who is writing an article about bitcoin mining and draft out like half of the article by itself and the completion of the work happened to be four lines stanza from someone's work that has be done initial or previously without adding the reference source, is not a plagarism?

I'm not sure what exactly you're asking, but it's quite simple: if you copy something, make sure the reader understands you took it from someone else.

Quote from: _BlackStar on November 26, 2021, 04:40:46 PM

How much time can each guilty user ^[plagiarism] be given before being reported to a moderator?

If you think it was a mistake, notify the user instead of reporting it.

Quote from: Mpamaegbu on November 27, 2021, 03:04:53 AM

something being allowed but then discouraged

It's allowed by the forum, but you might receive negative feedback. Kinda the same as scamming, that's allowed even though many users disapprove.

Quote from: Mpamaegbu on November 27, 2021, 04:17:09 AM

How do you allow something and then discourage it at the same time. Why not make it either acceptable or discourage it outrightly?

Allow me:

Quote from: mprep on July 21, 2014, 01:27:51 PM

18. Having multiple accounts and account sales are allowed, but account sales are discouraged.

This rule has no meaning! If it would be removed, nothing would change because anything that isn't in the rules is allowed. The "discouraging" comes from users, not from Mods. So I consider it a clarification and warning instead of a rule.

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Quote from: lovesmayfamilis on November 27, 2021, 03:55:06 AM

Quote from: Mpamaegbu on November 27, 2021, 03:04:53 AM

~snipped~

I think everything is clear enough. The forum declares freedom. You can do whatever you want, but at the same time, you need to understand that this is unacceptable, and for some actions, there may be a response, such as a negative tag. But this is by no means an account ban. Therefore, anyone who wants to walk with a negative mark in their account can buy an account. Everything seems clear enough.

Well, at the risk of sounding like a broken record; that comment is still self contradictory. How do you allow something and then discourage it at the same time. Why not make it either acceptable or discourage it outrightly? I'm cocksure that rule will create a lot of problems for newbies who may not have come in contact with how derogatory account sales have been made to become here now. To the best of my knowledge, I still believe that's a grey area that should be addressed by @theymos (or who else is in charge here).

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Quote from: Mpamaegbu on November 27, 2021, 03:04:53 AM

Quote from: KingsDen on September 18, 2021, 07:02:53 AM

Quote from: mprep on July 21, 2014, 01:27:51 PM

18. Having multiple accounts and account sales are allowed, but account sales are discouraged.

The statement that something is allowed and at same time discouraged is somewhat ambiguous.

My dear, it's really the height of a hidden paradox. Frankly, I have tried to wrap my head around that part too of something being allowed but then discouraged and it keeps beating me hallow. To put it mildly, it doesn't make sense to me. Could that be that it's either I've a minimal grasp of English idioms or I simply don't understand basic English language 🤔. Maybe it's about time theymos reviewed that rule so we could understand it better. I guess it was made at a time when there was skeletal traffic here and the forum needed to coax posters to stay active but the rhythm has obviously changed now and it should call for a change of parade too.

I think everything is clear enough. The forum declares freedom. You can do whatever you want, but at the same time, you need to understand that this is unacceptable, and for some actions, there may be a response, such as a negative tag. But this is by no means an account ban. Therefore, anyone who wants to walk with a negative mark in their account can buy an account. Everything seems clear enough.

Quote from: GeorgeJohn on November 26, 2021, 05:42:23 PM

That means is not sure before taking decision and is under assumptions, because i think some people don't fall the victim of plagarism intensionally, except it's the person method of life is to mimic someone kind of research, i think the best is to pm the user base on the rank, and if happened to be old user it's very obvious that such Skip the memory and it deserve to be corrected through private information or communication, so if the user refused to accept it's mistake within some hours, the function to report to the mod can be carried out without hesitation and that indicates intensionally Plagiarism instead of unintentional mistake.

If you report plagiarism to the moderators, I can tell you from experience that mods are also very good at viewing the account you are filing a plagiarism complaint with. If this is an isolated case, then the account will not be banned. More examples may be needed to prohibit.
So there is no need to worry. Just let mods know, and the moderators will make the right conclusions themselves. Otherwise, in some cases, supposedly helping someone, you take the side of the one who is considered to be a violation of the rules. Shocked

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Quote from: KingsDen on September 18, 2021, 07:02:53 AM

Quote from: mprep on July 21, 2014, 01:27:51 PM

18. Having multiple accounts and account sales are allowed, but account sales are discouraged.

The statement that something is allowed and at same time discouraged is somewhat ambiguous.

My dear, it's really the height of a hidden paradox. Frankly, I have tried to wrap my head around that part too of something being allowed but then discouraged and it keeps beating me hallow. To put it mildly, it doesn't make sense to me. Could that be that it's either I've a minimal grasp of English idioms or I simply don't understand basic English language 🤔. Maybe it's about time theymos reviewed that rule so we could understand it better. I guess it was made at a time when there was skeletal traffic here and the forum needed to coax posters to stay active but the rhythm has obviously changed now and it should call for a change of parade too.

Igebotz

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A user who copied a few lines into 95% of his own words and forgot to reference the few lines he copied is not the same as someone who wrote a wall of copied text; both are plagiarism, but I would personally PM the first user and tell him to properly cite his work for the sake of the 5% plagiarism rule then report the other user for plagiarism.

Quote from: GeorgeJohn on November 26, 2021, 05:42:23 PM

Quote from: Igebotz on November 26, 2021, 04:50:31 PM

There is no time limit. If you believe it is deliberate plagiarism, you should report it; however, if you believe the user forgot out of stupidity to include reference links, a simple PM can remedy the situation.

That means is not sure before taking decision and is under assumptions, because i think some people don't fall the victim of plagarism intensionally, except it's the person method of life is to mimic someone kind of research, i think the best is to pm the user base on the rank, and if happened to be old user it's very obvious that such Skip the memory and it deserve to be corrected through private information or communication, so if the user refused to accept it's mistake within some hours, the function to report to the mod can be carried out without hesitation and that indicates intensionally Plagiarism instead of unintentional mistake.

GeorgeJohn

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Quote from: Igebotz on November 26, 2021, 04:50:31 PM

There is no time limit. If you believe it is deliberate plagiarism, you should report it; however, if you believe the user forgot out of stupidity to include reference links, a simple PM can remedy the situation.

That means is not sure before taking decision and is under assumptions, because i think some people don't fall the victim of plagarism intensionally, except it's the person method of life is to mimic someone kind of research, i think the best is to pm the user base on the rank, and if happened to be old user it's very obvious that such Skip the memory and it deserve to be corrected through private information or communication, so if the user refused to accept it's mistake within some hours, the function to report to the mod can be carried out without hesitation and that indicates intensionally Plagiarism instead of unintentional mistake.

Igebotz

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Quote from: LoyceV on November 26, 2021, 07:56:07 AM

Quote from: Igebotz on November 25, 2021, 04:54:20 PM

without even realizing it

That's not possible. You'll know when you copy something.

If I were to write about Bitcoin mining, as you suggested, there is a good chance that my own words will match those of someone else who has previously written about mining, and if the content were put through a plagiarism test, it would come back as copied, but you would know you wrote it from your head, which is what I meant by plagiarism without realizing.

Quote from: LoyceV on November 26, 2021, 07:56:07 AM

Quote from: Igebotz on November 25, 2021, 04:54:20 PM

[Academic work is continued work + added value.

And references Wink

You can't continue or add value without making it verifiable.

Yeah in science methodology must be shown - if it's something you invented yourself but if it's something you added value to then the existed work must be cited first for reference purpose.

Quote from: GeorgeJohn on November 26, 2021, 04:01:24 PM

I want to really understand something here, are you saying that someone who is writing an article about bitcoin mining and draft out like half of the article by itself and the completion of the work happened to be four lines stanza from someone's work that has be done initial or previously without adding the reference source, is not a plagarism? We are here to learn.

four stanzas? Without seeing at your material, I'm not sure my personal words can match four stanza of your words. It is feasible to write a one-line phrase, but not four stanza. That is plagiarism!

Quote from: _BlackStar on November 26, 2021, 04:40:46 PM

How much time can each guilty user ^[plagiarism] be given before being reported to a moderator?

There is no time limit. If you believe it is deliberate plagiarism, you should report it; however, if you believe the user forgot out of stupidity to include reference links, a simple PM can remedy the situation.

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Quote from: GeorgeJohn on November 26, 2021, 04:01:24 PM

Quote from: LoyceV on November 25, 2021, 08:34:14 AM

Quote from: Igebotz on November 24, 2021, 09:28:10 PM

In academic works or projects, 5% plagiarism is permissible; anything above 5% is considered plagiarism and is not accepted

I've never heard of that 5% rule. If you write an article about Bitcoin mining, chances are at least 5% of the words are also used by someone else who write an article about Bitcoin mining. And that's fine.
But if you write 10 pages and copy half a page from someone else, that's not good.

I want to really understand something here, are you saying that someone who is writing an article about bitcoin mining and draft out like half of the article by itself and the completion of the work happened to be four lines stanza from someone's work that has be done initial or previously without adding the reference source, is not a plagarism? We are here to learn.

I believe what he's saying that's if someone writes an article which she drafts out 50% and copy 50% from someone else it's still plagiarism, which totally makes sense.
In this situation what I do is copy and someone else article as a tip to write my own sentence which I believe will save the writer from plagiarism.

_BlackStar

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How much time can each guilty user ^[plagiarism] be given before being reported to a moderator?

I got someone doing paraphrasing plagiarism yesterday but didn't report it because just wanted to give him a chance to correct the post with the source link. If there wasn't a time limit, maybe someone could still reason that they forgot to attach the source even though the logic doesn't make sense, imo.

GeorgeJohn

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Quote from: LoyceV on November 25, 2021, 08:34:14 AM

Quote from: Igebotz on November 24, 2021, 09:28:10 PM

In academic works or projects, 5% plagiarism is permissible; anything above 5% is considered plagiarism and is not accepted

I've never heard of that 5% rule. If you write an article about Bitcoin mining, chances are at least 5% of the words are also used by someone else who write an article about Bitcoin mining. And that's fine.
But if you write 10 pages and copy half a page from someone else, that's not good.

I want to really understand something here, are you saying that someone who is writing an article about bitcoin mining and draft out like half of the article by itself and the completion of the work happened to be four lines stanza from someone's work that has be done initial or previously without adding the reference source, is not a plagarism? We are here to learn.

LoyceV

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Quote from: Igebotz on November 25, 2021, 04:54:20 PM

I believe the 5% rule applies to all academic journals globally because there's a 100% possibility you'll have to cite or copy a few lines from someone else's work

Nothing wrong with that, as long as you add it to your long list of references.

Quote

without even realizing it

That's not possible. You'll know when you copy something.

Quote

No academic publication or paper can pass a plagiarism test with a score of 0%.

If you're talking about an automated plagiarism checker, then sure, they'll always find something. But that doesn't mean it's really plagiarism.

As a test, I ran everything I typed above through the first plagiarism checker I found (Grammarly). It shows: "Significant plagiarism found", which is BS.

Quote

Academic work is continued work + added value.

And references Wink

You can't continue or add value without making it verifiable.

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Quote from: Habibul08 on November 26, 2021, 01:02:31 AM

As a newbie in this forum of course it will be very difficult for me to post quality things without reading a lot and increasing knowledge. Without the two things above, it is very possible for us to be involved in plagiarism, whether detected or not. <…>

Not if you read and digest the information, and they lay it out in your own words. If you feel compelled to copy parts of what you read (i.e. lists, parts that are really well expressed as they are), it might be best to place those as a quoted text, so that people can see that straight away.

The idea is not that you can’t base your post on what’s already out there, but rather not to just simply copy/paste it here (even if including the link will get you off the hook), nor deliberately just alter a few words to make it look like it’s yours.

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Quote from: Habibul08 on November 26, 2021, 01:02:31 AM

As a newbie in this forum of course it will be very difficult for me to post quality things without reading a lot and increasing knowledge. Without the two things above, it is very possible for us to be involved in plagiarism, whether detected or not.

If, when writing your post, you do not look at an outside page, but use your thoughts, no one will ever accuse you of plagiarism. There can be practically no such coincidences, when a person memorizes the text in full, including the entire word order.
But you also need to understand that to paraphrase someone else's text read on the Internet, if you stick to it, it will be safer for you to add a link to the site from which you read and decided to share your thoughts.

Habibul08

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As a newbie in this forum of course it will be very difficult for me to post quality things without reading a lot and increasing knowledge. Without the two things above, it is very possible for us to be involved in plagiarism, whether detected or not.

Of course this is very detrimental and also never recommended even though basically we just want to contribute. I've heard a lot of advice on how to do it well, but I know it's hard, but I'm sure it will pay off and eventually we can feel that it will never be in vain.

Igebotz

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Quote from: LoyceV on November 25, 2021, 08:34:14 AM

Quote from: Igebotz on November 24, 2021, 09:28:10 PM

In academic works or projects, 5% plagiarism is permissible; anything above 5% is considered plagiarism and is not accepted

I've never heard of that 5% rule. If you write an article about Bitcoin mining, chances are at least 5% of the words are also used by someone else who write an article about Bitcoin mining. And that's fine.
But if you write 10 pages and copy half a page from someone else, that's not good.

I'm not sure, but I believe the 5% rule applies to all academic journals globally because there's a 100% possibility you'll have to cite or copy a few lines from someone else's work without even realizing it, as you said it happens on a regular basis. No academic publication or paper can pass a plagiarism test with a score of 0%.

Academic work is continued work + added value.

LoyceV

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Quote from: Igebotz on November 24, 2021, 09:28:10 PM

In academic works or projects, 5% plagiarism is permissible; anything above 5% is considered plagiarism and is not accepted

I've never heard of that 5% rule. If you write an article about Bitcoin mining, chances are at least 5% of the words are also used by someone else who write an article about Bitcoin mining. And that's fine.
But if you write 10 pages and copy half a page from someone else, that's not good.

philipma1957

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Quote from: Despairo on September 18, 2021, 02:01:48 AM

Quote from: KingsDen on September 17, 2021, 07:19:03 PM

I am surprised to know from you that account selling is not against the forum rules. Can you please give me a link to any thread or rule that states thus?.

Quote from: bitgov on September 18, 2021, 01:30:31 AM

AFAIk, its not allowed to sale or purchase bitcointalk.org account. Count me in for people looking for reference where it says "its allowed".

On forum rules number 18 said account sales are allowed, but discouraged. What does discouraged mean? to let know members who trust user A isn't controlled by A person anymore, which is you can gave negative trust to the account if you didn't trust him again or you could gave neutral trust as for your own notes.
To be honest I don't see any reason why someone need to buy an account except participating in Bounties or Signature campaign, any opinions?

Quote from: mprep on July 21, 2014, 01:27:51 PM

18. Having multiple accounts and account sales are allowed, but account sales are discouraged.

Quote from: Poker Player on September 18, 2021, 01:04:35 AM

Quote from: SquirrelJulietGarden on September 17, 2021, 09:47:03 PM

You are referring to OP, I understand. I would like you to clarify this. Are you saying we have another pokapoka124 case? In the archived link I can't see any evidence of plagiarism, and if so it should have been reported.

Read @DdmrDdmr replies below the thread.

@DdmrDdmr post provide a link to buy Bitcoin in ATMs

Quote

By the way, the so called instructions are very similar to those found here: https://coinatmradar.com/blog/how-to-buy-bitcoins-with-bitcoin-atm/

Quote

San-Diego based company Genesis Coin produces three types of ATMs: Genesis1 (two-way), Satoshi1 (one-way) and Satoshi2 (two-way). The process of purchasing bitcoins may have a verification procedure, in this case:
• Click “Buy Bitcoins”
• Provide mobile number
• Enter received validation code
• Scan fingerprint
• Select coin (this type of machine may support not only Bitcoin, but also Litecoin, Dogecoin, Blackcoin, XCurrency)
• Choose to scan wallet (pre-defined) or generate new
• Scan wallet QR code if chosen
• Insert cash bills
• Click send
• Get printed receipt

@GeorgeJohn thread

Quote

-step1: just click on " buy Btc"

-step2: click " input your mobile number "

-step3: enter your received validation code.

-step4: scam your thumb in the machines, for security purpose.

-step5: select your crptocurrency you need, example: LTC, ETH, BTC or any of the coin you choose to buy.

-step6: select your scam wallet.

-step7: select scam wallet code.

Step8: input cash bill.

-step9: click send.

-step10: wait for transaction to process.

Close isn't? what is scam wallet lol, this is proof @GeorgeJohn direct copy paste an article.

Buying accounts in 2012,2013,2014 were commonly done. Mostly to do signature campaigns. A lot of people do not understand what is was like in those years.

In 2012 BTC was as low as 6 bucks

big ripoffs of coins happened a lot.

blocks wer 50 coins not 6.25

It was not a big deal to buy an account.

and Plagiarism was less enforced back then.

The industry changed ie 6 usd coins are now 58000 usd.

No one was sure about btc survival.

Frankly I would prefer a 5 year look back for plagiarism to be in effect.

Ie no bans for any work from 2009-2016. You could give a -trust for it, but no bans.

From 2017 on bans should occur. People know better by then.

Igebotz

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Quote from: Rikafip on November 24, 2021, 07:49:55 AM

I might be wrong here, but I don't think that percentage of the plagiarized material makes any difference when it comes to deciding whether someone will get banned or not. At least I haven't noticed any difference.

In academic works or projects, 5% plagiarism is permissible; anything above 5% is considered plagiarism and is not accepted; however, there are no standards on the forum to determine what percentage of plagiarism is acceptable or not; yet, the majority
y of plagiarism cases are 50% or more.

Quote from: Gambit2s on September 22, 2021, 06:55:15 PM

While we are at the topic of plagiarism..im a bit curious what kind of tool/website do you guys use to detect it ? or do you guys just recognize a plagiarised content just by looking at it?

It's easy to detect a plagiarized post merely looking at it but most of the time I use a tool to be 100% sure before reporting.

Topic: Disadvantages of non detectable early Plagiarism (Read 926 times)