Topic: DIY FPGA Mining rig for any algorithm with fast ROI - page 77. (Read 99472 times)

thats how it works... well youd need to know how the fpga layout was not just have the bitstream i assume.
take the logic you can program into an fpga and hardcode it onto a chip and throw away everything else there is your asic chip. of course the $500k cost mentioned is referencing the cost of tapeout (unclear actual cost) to actually create the chip you have logic for.

Wait Wait.

You guys are saying that with the FPGA and bitstream code OP has, someone with deep pockets can actually produce an ASIC from it?

FPGA data + 500k$ = ASIC
Good luck 4% guy

I learned about this post and read in detail. It has become very inspiring, as I am both a crypto mining, AI and energy enthusiast (and professional). There are looming issues around the sustainability of PoW crypto economies, concentration of power in crypto economies, regulation of crypto economies and even availability of power for not only crypto security but also for other high density advancements in technology driven by AI.

For a long time I have felt that there needed to be a more distributed solution to secure the network.  Many limitations to GPU mining including power consumption and regulation (even as to individuals but also commercial operations) and simply a huge difficulty in building and maintaining mining rigs that are preventing a broader adoption. Normal people simply can't handle it.  I have tons of friends who are like "I would love to have one of those in my living room, I don't care how much it makes but it looks so cool!" I meet software developers that come into my office and see my mining rigs and don't even know what they are. We think everyone in the world knows everything about crypto.  But they don't.

This FPGA solution can answer many of those problems, by reducing the amount of power, space and cooling required to maintain blockchain security in PoW systems.  Prior to the newer and larger FPGA products this hasn't really been possible.

This has inspired me to consider developing a consumer grade, multi-purpose work station with specific capabilities needed for FPGA mining and deep learning networks. A "Personal Accelerator"

Link to sample marketing document I created for the project: https://www.dropbox.com/s/7w6ibv6q6o5x21k/algorithmic.energy.pdf?dl=0

As many people have commented, an open source, community based development approach is probably best.  The question remains how to compensate early developers to get it going. Because the FPGA firmware will be hardware specific, this should be easy for hardware makers to do based on cost recovery from hardware sales. I believe that the developers should be compensated for time and costs as any engineer is, but that the growth and maintenance of the available firmware libraries can be built on open source networks and a dedicated (even decentralized) organization. 

In a consumer grade product with multiple potential utility streams, it would be possible to leverage traditional financing solutions and with sufficient revenue from mining or cloud computing operations would be net revenue positive from the first day of ownership.  By exponentially expanding the potential network, outside of government regulation and concentration of power, it would be possible to overcome both the GPU and ASIC hashing capacity. 

What better place to open this can of worms that here.  Looking forward to thoughts and comments.

Initial questions would be:
1. Optimal selection of hardware based on cost/performance/packaging.  Currently looking at Alpha Data 8k5 with Xilinx KU115 core or comparable packages. Open to any suggestions, however the VU9 does seem a bit much for this kind of solution, the FPGA package needs to come in the $3K-$4K range tops and I don't see Xilinx doing it, even at volume.  A data center will pay much more than that, why would they lower their pants?  They won't... 
2. Support from OP and/or other thread members in working on the open source, based on below T&C assumptions?
3. Should there be a "maintenance model" in which the Open Source Org captures a portion of the revenue to maintain and grow support for new algorithms and uses (including deep learning networks), OR should there be a fixed fee charged upfront (included in hardware purchase price) for a "support term" and then an annual support fee when that term expires? I personally prefer the latter, much simpler.
4. Any ideas on how big of a support team would be required to maintain the org?  Would 3 full time developers x $150K/year salary+ 1 full time QC x $100K/year salary overhead $50K/head = $750K/year be sufficient?   
5. Would people buy this hardware for the suggested price range $5500-$6500? Would they finance it for 24 months for $265/month (including support and warranty)?  Would your friends or family do the same?
6. Anybody interested in investing or partnering in the hardware company? I am currently already looking at MFG solutions and supply chain and have most of that scoped out for volume production, the main part missing would be the firmware and algorithm development and QC. I have been building hardware, sensors, and software (including SaaS) for the last 18 years of my life.  I think we can handle this and put a good team together. 
7. What do people think of a "trade in" option, where you can get a credit value for exchanging your current GPU mining rig? We could reclaim existing GPU's, set them back to factory specs and then release them back to the gamers for reasonable prices that they so desperately have needed.

Although I appreciate answers from everyone, if someone is interested in a closer relationship I would only be interested in working with serious, professional people. This is not intended to be a hobbyist solution, but a real commercial, consumer grade product run by competent, experienced and professional management.  If you have less than 5-10 years of experience in the field and don't have credible professional references as an entrepreneaur, investor or engineer, then this is probably not an opportunity for you at this time (not to be unfair, just realistic). 

just my 2 cents...

seeing is believing

very interested in this project, i sent an PM

Hello,
Can R0land show us an evidence of the reached hashrate on CNv7?
Thank you

FPGAs and ASICs are very closely ralated, and FPGAs are generally used to prototype ASICs. But the statements below made by the OP shows that he has been removed from the industry for far too long.


If you want evidence of the OP's claims, there's none for now and you will have to wait until May 30th.

Is there any real proof of declared speed?
Just point it to yiimp pool and all could see real hashrate. 

That's not my point. (As I said he "proposed" this performance.)

The assessments of OP around Crypto/Equihash are not in the mistakes category, that seems to be a lack of knowledge on ASIC side, IMHO.

Note that I have Zero and Zero experience on FPGA and ASIC.

It was a claim not an estimate.
You are allowed to make mistakes with an estimate, but you have to backup your claims.

I was browsing the Baikal X10 thread and what the OP said there, this was March 12:


Two things to to note: Equihash falls to ASIC in 6yrs and Cryptonight ASICs will beat GPUs only margnially.


So a couple of days later, Bitmain announced X3 with 10x Cryptonight performance than Giant-N, and equivalent to 100 odd Vega-64s.

And 2 months later, we have the Z9 Equihash ASIC.


And now I have my doubts on OPs assessments...


Edit:

This is proposed performance for Phi on VC1525:

Phi1612 (Luxcoin, Folm): 5.2GH/s (650MH/s per card x eight) ($456/day at Apr-30 prices)

So 650MH/s = 20x 1080Ti

That should be well within an ASIC range, if and when one emerges.


Edit2:

While the OP maybe an FPGA expert, he does not appear to have much experience in what ASICs can do. Bitmain has!

I emailed the guy linked thru OP's post for VCU1525 through Avnet He said its the same price for active or passive and lead time is 4-8 weeks.

For a workable case, not sure if they ship to EU but I have two of these 6 card cases for gpus at a local my datacenter: https://www.miningrigs.net/product/gray-matter-v3-1-gpu-case/ they have great airflow. They take up 4U of space, and some rails to sit on are sold seprately. I have a mismash of different cards and i notice the blower style cards run hotter in this than the open fan gpus, so id probably go for passive fpga and buy another of these cases for them. I would probably try to modify the airflow so it was forced to go through the cards rather than through & around, though consideration for the back of board cooling would be in order.

Is there any information about this rig if it has been tested in another algorithm like equihash, dagger, lyra2rev2, nist5, skein? Thanks.

Athena code seem to be good. Although it's interface is very narrow so you will lose a hashrate by using it.

If you are on the fence about purchasing, then it is always best to wait and see how things play out. Most, if not all, industrial miners already understand the economics of mining quite well, and there’s no need repeating it here. But what some people do not understand is that these FPGAs are good for saving space and power, which can be appealing to some users.

Now let’s see what happens when the Keccak algorithm (assuming 17 GH/s) is released on May 30th and you are able to mine with it. Hmmm, your profitability will be on par with other GPU miners on other coins with the same overall costs. You haven’t lost anything, but at least you now know the OP is credible and have some space and power savings. Then guess what happens next, there’s going to be a massive influx of miners who will purchase these cards and wait for the next algorithm to be released. But even if the next algorithm turns out to be only as profitable as GPU mining, you will still have some space and power savings. Things will only go south if the OP cannot deliver his claims.

Look, ASICs will remain dominant, then followed by GPUS; FPGAs and CPUs will have to fight for third place. You can only displace GPUs if hundreds of $millions worth of these accelerators are sold to miners and it’s not going to happen anytime soon.

I can find a college student or two who may jump on that opportunity, we’ll see.

It would be very informal. Start writing the documentation for 3-4 PoWs. If it's high quality and think you have what it takes to continue, I'll periodically donate you some BTC whenever you add more PoWs to the doc ($10-20 per hour of work).

Any comments on the quality/portability of the athena code ?