Topic: Do you think Bitcoinica should switch to TradeHill? [Edited] - page 2. (Read 7068 times)

Bam.

I am eager to see how this progresses. Down with gox!

Sure. REST API is a must-have for me too.

Thanks for your "hint of caution"!

Yes, I'm aware that real-world transactions can be difficult to handle due to non-standard interfaces. But that's not my competitive edge. I'm good at outdoing your 10% codebase.

I want RESTful API for trading (optionally over https with elliptic curve certificates)

So this is all you have to say to a young entepreneur? Dispraising comments? Is that how you would raise your kids? Worst case scenario, mr Tong learns from the experience.

Or is there perhaps another motive for the negative attitude? Why else would you "bite"?

That's precisely what I was saying, improved liquidity would benefit everybody, even those of us seemingly working at cross purposes.

However a hint of caution is necessary.

Accepting wire transfers, bitcoins, and mtgox codes is orders of magnitude simpler than other payment mechanisms.

Currently about 10% of the intersango code base is actually about exchanging bitcoins ... the rest is handling idiosyncrasies of various insane payment systems.

Bitcoinica should go where the liquidity is. An ideal solution would be to look at each of the top exchanges and send orders in proportion to the liquidity on each exchange.

In my opinion one of the exchanges should offer aggressive rebates for adding liquidity. The spot traders would get a rebate for adding liquidity and Bitcoinica would find the liquidity in one place. Although, all the liquidity is at Mt Gox right now. It's just both liquidity providers and liquidity takers are charged a fee. If there is a smart exchange out there, they'll pay for liquidity.

Mt Gox had the lion's share of volume before Bitcoinica and Bitcoinica using Mt Gox has just consolidated volume even more there. For now, Bitcoinica is the volume, wherever they go, the volume will follow.

I like this. Why not use all available resources?

I don't use bitcoinica but the indepedant exchange idea sounds great

hmmm, I did not interpret phantomcircuit's post like that at all

I thought he was just urging Z to build a portal out to the fiat economy, which we desperately need

He would trade on MtGox/Tradehill when it is cheaper than matching with available orders on his books... he can hedge on more than one exchange, and he can trade internally when that's the best option.  Independent exchange + hedging on as many other exchanges as possible is the way to go.  He may even be able to offer negative spreads (and still make a profit) when there are arbitrage opportunities between Gox and TH.

It's just a subset of features of the ICBIT trading platform I'm developing.
I explained only the futures trading section of it publicly in this forum, but since my trading engine is universal, I was working on bringing up the currency exchange section lately. My platform is nearly ready, I will post an announcement about it tomorrow.

I sent Zhoutong a private message about this as I'm quite open for collaboration.

Fuck mtgox.

Very good idea..

My opinion is that you make your own independent exchange. Even if the fees on the exchange might be so low that they only pay off its expenses, you will profit more simply because of the reduced spreads on bitcoinica (more people, like me, will use bitcoinica more often - I love bitcoinica but sometimes the spreads are just too high... simply because Gox has to have a piece of the cake)

You are the only one running an exchange type service who has excellent communication with their customers. Compare to gox which wont even reply to emails, will constantly "forget" tickets, will do crazy stuff like demand an ID and freeze up your money for no reason etc.

Actually, with 0.1% fees, you should profit off of that too, simply because you will take pretty much ALL the volume off of other exchanges (unless they tighten up their game that is, which doesnt seem likely). Traders will also most likely trade more. Spreads will decrease because traders will be able to profit off of smaller difference (e.g. buying and selling at a 0.4% difference would be profitable, compared to 1% needed in mtgox)


Why would you enter the thread just to say something negative? As an adult, dont you find it inappropriate to just enter the thread to dispraise a 17 year old in his business venture... As a matter of fact, it seems like mr.Tong is the adult (for not calling you an asshole, which you clearly are) and you are the "kid".

Is it perhaps jealousy? You have to realize that, since he offers better service than any other exchange, and is about to offer an exchange service for 1/6 the price of the top exchange, with same volume... The fact that he will offer BitInstant transfers (smart move there mr.Tong) means everyone from gox will most likely go to his exchange, unless of course they like being goxed.

Thank you mr.Tong for your service, and thank you for taking into consideration what the community might think of you opening up an exchange. To date, I have not seen a single exchange which can talk the talk (service) AND walk the walk (offer volume).

Wow! Great idea! This would improve things by quite a bit, by improving liquidity due to faster transfers. Smart thinking!

I suggest you create your own exchange. If you control the exchange, you could put in a circuit breaker to halt trading for, say, 10 minutes (or 2 blocks?) if there is a price swing of 10% either way, to allow time to warn people (text/email alerts) and let them set stop orders, deleverage, and/or add to their margin; as well as allow other traders time to place orders to catch the fall or rise.  There are obvious arbitrage opportunities if a circuit breaker is hit.  These kinds of circuit breakers are useful for leveraged traders, and now exist in all traditional exchanges (google "2010 Flash Crash" for details).

For example, when the price dipped to $5.00 yesterday, anyone with USD could have placed an order at $5.00, and might have prevented some liquidations and kept it from dropping to $4.8.  Everyone would have been happier with this reduction in volatility.

I had a liquidation yesterday because I had split my funds between a daytrading stake on Mt. Gox, long coins in my computer's wallet, and funds to back up my leveraged coins on bitcoinica.  I saw the squeeze coming, but couldn't transfer enough margin from Mt. Gox to Bitcoinica due to daily limits, and I couldn't get coins from my computer's wallet to bitcoinica fast enough.  I possessed more than enough margin (<1:1), but got clipped anyway because of the abruptness.  This wouldn't have happened if bitcoinica and Mt. Gox were the same entity.

Also, I think you should accept 1-block confirmations from customers, and perhaps even 0-block for trusted customers.  Just don't allow them to withdraw funds until 6 confirmations, which would eliminate your risk.

I support anything that reduces fees.  The independent exchange seems like a good idea.

I like Intersango as it's easy,free & quickish for me to deposit £s there being a Brit, at least when they have a bank account that hasn't been pulled out from under them at no notice, otherwise I go via XeTrade (1.4% less than mid market exchange rates & no fees) to my US bank account, 1 day or so & then Dwolla for 25 cents to Gox & atm I'd rather hold $s or BTC than anything € or in too close a proximity to it - I vote for these 2 as I like Gox's BTC & $ redeemable codes, Yubi keys etc & sometimes better the devil you know

I do though really like the idea of Khou setting up an exchange, completely independent from Bitcoinica or I'd feel that I had too many eggs in 1 basket (actually they're all in Khou's basket atm anyway for super margin to guard against any more shocking price gyrations) & I expect such an exchange to be superb for innovation, enthusiasm, professionalism & shaking up the Gox, I needed 3 votes really

as for TH I never found an easy way to get funds to them without fees or complications that I didn't want to get in to & haven't looked in to them enough to try & gauge their staying power or accountability

My understanding is that Singapore is one of the freest markets in the world.