Exchangers - Fake Volumes- FRAUD - page 2.

CryptoBjorn

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Quote from: Kprawn on June 15, 2016, 11:36:09 AM

What else did you expect with non-regulated exchanges all over the place? The Chinese has been doing this for years and for that reason many people do not even use their volumes as a indicator of the

average price per Bitcoin. I use the average price listed by these exchanges, Bitfinex | Bitstamp | BTC-E | LocalBitcoins as a guideline. The private sales are a much better indicator, but in many cases

a bit inflated. The regulated exchanges should be a bit more trustworthy... well, more that Mt Gox. Roll Eyes

This is the exact reason why those volumes are manipulated. Those exchanges are an unregulated and luckily reputable parties put them aside.
Just look how coinmarketcap.com put some of those exchanges which have zero fees not in the total volume. It's from from realistic

CIYAM

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Quote from: European Central Bank on June 15, 2016, 11:50:18 AM

Gemini, Itbit and now Bitstamp? I assume they gotta do something to satisfy the authorities to get their pieces of paper like banking charters and so on.

Well even if all of those - that is three out of how many?

And I'm still waiting to see public auditing reports (from any Bitcoin exchange).

European Central Bank

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Quote from: CIYAM on June 15, 2016, 11:38:11 AM

And which exchanges are actually "regulated"?

Gemini, Itbit and now Bitstamp? I assume they gotta do something to satisfy the authorities to get their pieces of paper like banking charters and so on.

CIYAM

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Quote from: Kprawn on June 15, 2016, 11:36:09 AM

The regulated exchanges should be a bit more trustworthy... well, more that Mt Gox. Roll Eyes

And which exchanges are actually "regulated"?

(the firms that audit them should be public as well as their audit reports - if not then I wouldn't say they are any more trustworthy than the "unregulated" ones)

It seems to some extent that this thing about exchanges often is just a "racist" thing - if you're non-western then your exchange must be suspect but if you are western then somehow it is not.

Perhaps it is just sour grapes from western exchanges that can't work out how to make a profit without charging trading fees. Cheesy

Kprawn

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What else did you expect with non-regulated exchanges all over the place? The Chinese has been doing this for years and for that reason many people do not even use their volumes as a indicator of the

average price per Bitcoin. I use the average price listed by these exchanges, Bitfinex | Bitstamp | BTC-E | LocalBitcoins as a guideline. The private sales are a much better indicator, but in many cases

a bit inflated. The regulated exchanges should be a bit more trustworthy... well, more that Mt Gox. Roll Eyes

lumeire

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Next-Gen Trade Racing Metaverse

Quote from: gtglener on June 15, 2016, 10:52:51 AM

No I don't think that they are fake transactions, as in some exchanges i am seeing that the price sometimes reach to a much higher value and on yobit I am selling my bits at much higher that the normal price.

These aren't fake transactions IMO they're bots trying to raise the volume by trading with themselves. What's new anyway, even the mining's controlled by 'btc mining cartels.'

RawDog

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Quote from: alani123 on June 15, 2016, 09:10:33 AM

Quote from: RawDog on June 15, 2016, 08:50:37 AM

Quote from: alani123 on June 15, 2016, 08:39:02 AM

Even the most trusted exchanges are suspected for manipulating volumes.

Bitcoin - the whole damn thing is just filthy

Well that's a funny approach, but it might not be that far off. The biggest and most compliant bitcoin company has an orderbook so thin and disproportionate to the volume on their exchange^[1]that manipulation even for them doesn't sound that far off. And yes, I'm talking about Coinbase. Perhaps volume manipulation is an industry standard.

[1]

Also, what happened to your videos?

Here you go Slavetard!! Here is my latest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKw_7sh1LSY
Thanks for watching

...and here is an important one on that lying bitch Hillary Clit-on: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oE43M1Z8Iew

gtglener

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No I don't think that they are fake transactions, as in some exchanges i am seeing that the price sometimes reach to a much higher value and on yobit I am selling my bits at much higher that the normal price.

CIYAM

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Quote from: alyssa85 on June 15, 2016, 10:27:13 AM

It depends on where they are based. In the western world, an exchange with that kind of volume and which is charging fees on every trade, is expected to show revenue in line with that and pay tax on the profits generated. There is no benefit in pretending you are making more than you really are because you only attract the attention of the taxman who wants his share. Tax authorities: keeping business from over stating revenue since the dawn of time.

And you are very wrong to think that any Bitcoin exchange is being properly run in the way you are stating (show me who is auditing them for a start).

NOTE: It is possible that Gemini is being run this way but I doubt any other western exchange is (they would be the exception rather than the rule).

The tax authorities don't even understand crypto (so they are hardly going to be sending experts in to check the trading records logs which can all be forged anyway).

In many western countries the "tax man" has actually been outsourced to the businesses themselves (it's known as GST or VAT).

patronis

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Quote from: alyssa85 on June 15, 2016, 10:27:13 AM

Quote from: CIYAM on June 15, 2016, 08:50:57 AM

Quote from: alyssa85 on June 15, 2016, 08:46:11 AM

Bitfinex, Kraken, Coinbase, Bitstamp all charge fees. It is too expensive to manipulate volume on those exchanges as every trade will cost you money.

The only exchanges where the volume may be suspect are the ones that don't charge fees - Huobi and the other Chinese ones. But some of their trade is definitely real.

This is nonsense - if the bots are run by the exchange then the fees "cost nothing" (as it is coming from their own profits).

You can't trust *any* exchanges volume in Bitcoin (and never have been able to).

People seem to confuse Bitcoin exchanges with things like regulated stock exchanges - a very naive thing to be doing.

It depends on where they are based. In the western world, an exchange with that kind of volume and which is charging fees on every trade, is expected to show revenue in line with that and pay tax on the profits generated. There is no benefit in pretending you are making more than you really are because you only attract the attention of the taxman who wants his share. Tax authorities: keeping business from over stating revenue since the dawn of time.

but what their statistics shows that faking volume increases revenue and number of people trading causing them to profit more then what would need to be paid in tax?

alyssa85

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Quote from: CIYAM on June 15, 2016, 08:50:57 AM

Quote from: alyssa85 on June 15, 2016, 08:46:11 AM

Bitfinex, Kraken, Coinbase, Bitstamp all charge fees. It is too expensive to manipulate volume on those exchanges as every trade will cost you money.

The only exchanges where the volume may be suspect are the ones that don't charge fees - Huobi and the other Chinese ones. But some of their trade is definitely real.

This is nonsense - if the bots are run by the exchange then the fees "cost nothing" (as it is coming from their own profits).

You can't trust *any* exchanges volume in Bitcoin (and never have been able to).

People seem to confuse Bitcoin exchanges with things like regulated stock exchanges - a very naive thing to be doing.

It depends on where they are based. In the western world, an exchange with that kind of volume and which is charging fees on every trade, is expected to show revenue in line with that and pay tax on the profits generated. There is no benefit in pretending you are making more than you really are because you only attract the attention of the taxman who wants his share. Tax authorities: keeping business from over stating revenue since the dawn of time.

European Central Bank

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I think it's very possible. When you look at the exchanges that are subject to some type of regulation, though I dunno whether it covers stuff like front running, like Gemini, Itbit and I guess Bitstamp they all have some weedy volumes compared to others. Lack of margin stuff could be a factor too.

rickadone

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I am not really surprised. I knew this was bound to happen sooner or later, but it seems that it actually is happening.
And of course, if there's an opportunity to monopolize, many will seize it, just like those of the big exchangers you mentioned.

X-ray

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Quote from: onlinedragon on June 15, 2016, 09:16:18 AM

People running bots on exchanges only to make bigger volumes. Take a look at Yobit exchange and you understand what I mean. Many scam coins around where bots buy there own coins to lure people. It's gigantic market and some people earn big money with it. Who are this persons behind it I think they operate not only on Yobit but also on other exchanges.

I don't think so because all of the bitcoin users is feel the advantages from this way, Make a manipulate with their volume, It's just assume... Not flaming or another. Maybe, I was an impressed hypocrite but this is fact.

onlinedragon

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People running bots on exchanges only to make bigger volumes. Take a look at Yobit exchange and you understand what I mean. Many scam coins around where bots buy there own coins to lure people. It's gigantic market and some people earn big money with it. Who are this persons behind it I think they operate not only on Yobit but also on other exchanges.

alani123

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Quote from: RawDog on June 15, 2016, 08:50:37 AM

Quote from: alani123 on June 15, 2016, 08:39:02 AM

Even the most trusted exchanges are suspected for manipulating volumes.

Bitcoin - the whole damn thing is just filthy

Well that's a funny approach, but it might not be that far off. The biggest and most compliant bitcoin company has an orderbook so thin and disproportionate to the volume on their exchange^[1]that manipulation even for them doesn't sound that far off. And yes, I'm talking about Coinbase. Perhaps volume manipulation is an industry standard.

[1]

Also, what happened to your videos?

Herbert2020

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this happens everywhere, what you gonna do about it!
and manipulation is not only restricted to bitcoin but also it is available in all the markets, the form of it might be different but it always exists.
if you can notice it and make a profit from it then good, and if you can't just stay away from trading!

besides i should add that there is a totally different time than the time of willy bot of mtgox!

Joel_Jantsen

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Get your game girl

Quote from: eneilwex on June 15, 2016, 08:46:01 AM

The Centralized Bitcoin exchanges seem to coordinate their prices across continental divides. One goes down – they all go down.

How ? Do you even have a idea how a exchange works or how the prices are hiked ? I don't think so.The prices cannot me manipulated as you have put it,if that was the case,the market would go down in seconds,one cannot control the aspects of the market to an extent where they have the potential to destroy it's functioning.

Quote from: eneilwex on June 15, 2016, 08:46:01 AM

The question is why the public tolerates their scam.

How are you planning to distribute bitcoins ? Home to Home selling ? I don't think that's a good idea.Very few peer to peer exchanges ,filled with scammers I may add.Not everyone is technically sound and hence their primary source of buying bitcoin are the exchanges.

Quote from: eneilwex on June 15, 2016, 08:46:01 AM

If they were useful or desirable, they’d consider the very people who sustain the Bitcoin network, namely Bitcoin miners. Exchange clients and miners get whatever is happening in the busiest exchange.

I believe they pay a good amount of fee,more than bitcoiners who set-up custom fees using Core.They're rightfully supporting the miners exactly by the way they should.You can't expect them to hand out individual trophies to every miner for their work.

Quote from: eneilwex on June 15, 2016, 08:46:01 AM

The exchanges’ arbitrage bots equalize prices between one another. Miners – you’re the backbone of this innovation. Cryptomonkeys – you think you’re trading – but your centralized exchange rides you bare-back.

That is wrong,you cannot manipulate the prices to an extent where it causes a scarcity of the commodity in the market unless of course the situation is worse.

7788bitcoin

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I think we are definitely seeing an exaggerated price increase in such a short period of time. I won't be surprise if there is another "Willy bot" behind this.

However, I do think the current price is reflecting the current value of each coin. Perhaps a slow increase between now an halving is reasonable. If we ever get pass $1000 in the next few weeks, I am sure it is a bubble.

familiaverde

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This is why https://bitsquare.io is a good project , decentralized bitcoin exchange , and localbitcoin.com is also good.

Other upcoming decentralized exchanges are: http://mercuryex.com , http://www.coincer.org , http://www.supernet.org , https://etherex.org ,
https://bcexchange.org

Topic: Exchangers - Fake Volumes- FRAUD - page 2. (Read 1765 times)