Topic: few questions from newbie (Read 339 times)

This forum is quite complicated at some point but I'll try to answer some of your questions. What you've read about scammers here in the forum is true, there are plenty of them so you better be careful with whom you are giving your trust to. Before you can do anything here in the forum, you should first be knowledgeable enough or be an experienced investor here so that such things which those who are in the higher are doing will also be open for you. If you are still confused, try finding someone who has great knowledge about the forum or in crypto, make sure that person is trustworthy, and just simply follow his instructions and listen clearly for the information that person is giving to you.

Yes, there are so many red flags for selling around and for buying around, as well.
You have to understand that the bitcoin transactions are irreversible so the customers are at a disadvantage in here, unlike, for example, ebay. If you open a self-moderated topic you have protected yourself from trolls and competition but what protects the buyer?

Dealing with annoying people is the cost of doing business. Don't send first if you don't trust the other party, or deal with the fact that some users (mostly newbies) are going to try to scam you. After some time of being a legit seller non-rule breaking negative comments from trolls and competition will matter less, and more people will be willing to send the BTC first.

Go to Amazon or Ebay.

i just read about this guy and that's creepy asf...
but there is si many red flags for selling around and i cannot figure out how to do it safe.
in first place, it is not good idea to use self-moderated or locked topics because i am newbie and i cannot protect myself from trolls and competition, in other hands you highly doubt to find escrow who will help about the security of that kind of sales.
so what should i do ?

First of all, I highly doubt you're gonna find an escrow for that kind of thing around here. Second of all, one important thing you skipped over was how do you know you are dealing with an honest escrow? Whatever you do, don't fall victim to an escrow scammer such as this guy.

There's a particularly dumb scammer on the forum who keeps pretending to be trusted forum escrows like monbux and SebastienJu on Telegram, even though they don't use Telegram and have been largely inactive for years. So if someone recommends them as an escrow to you off-forum, make sure they contact you via PM here on the forum before agreeing to any kind of deal.

sorry for my 99 questions but i have more..
lets say i start a digital goods selling topic.
how the escrow could verify microsoft key/steam/amazon or anything like that
i know there is few ways to verify some of those without being used, but some cannot be verified/check
and what stop the buyer if the keys cannot be verified by the escrow to say they were already used or invalid?

True, this is some reason why people creating self moderated thread because many members here is spamming with low quality post or off topic... this also help moderator to reduce more post that has been reported by member. But some people misusing this option by a scammer (deleting post that can destroy/attack their reputation

Creating self moderated topic wouldn't make you earn more merit, it's based on your quality post.

In my own point of view, I think creating a self thread connotes that the post wants a significancy among other posts provided that the contents relays a very good and useful explanation. It also depends on the composer's intentions towards earning some amount of merits, why would anyone make a self thread topic in the first place? I believe we are answerable to our individual actions here.

Do you mean that there are people who are doing their best effort to bust those scam projects and expose scammers. Anyway, creating a self-moderated threads doesn't mean you have hidden agendas. Just make sure you mentioned it in your thread that you are making a self-moderated thread so you can delete the shit posts made in your thread. It is true that some may think that you have hidden agendas so, it's your responsibility on what will hapoen to your account.

Welcome amoung us Nancy!
I would like to say that you're the one and only responsible for your interactions with these members and with the whole community whether we're talking about projects or entities or even individuals. There's a trust system, a ranking system and that enables you to know who's a newbie and who's highly trusted. You can find alot of newly signed up accounts selling stuffs without any vouch copies or without any trust, those aren't the ones you might want to trust.
In the other hand, you can always browse and search using that tool at the top right for subjects, feedbacks and opinions about anything. You can even use this section to post any questions before doing any financial trades. Be safe and have a nice day/ new year beginning.

having self Moderated topic means you are limiting the chance of Having Good conversation and also Giving impression to the community about your hidden agendas ,so this will less the Opportunity to grab what you really tend to do.

I don't usually engaged in Self moderated topics specially if the one created this thread is newbie,Red trusted or account that has Nothing proven in the forum ,I first look at the History of this account and if i find some flags in making Self controlled topic ,then i will either ignore this and deny the thread even if this looks legit and worth reading , because why need a control over Posters if you are not hiding anything ?and besides if the Posts looks like irrelevant ,you can just report to the Mod and let them decide if need to delete or not.

You can become a trusted seller while staying in your current "Newbie" rank...

• Merits are given to high-quality posts ^{[some users tend to give it to those that they agree with, even though that's not how it supposed to be used]}.
• You're not limited in regards to receiving the appropriate feedback ^{[positive/neutral/negative]} for your forum transactions or dealings.

That's right but you still have the option ^{["Report to moderator" button is in the bottom right corner of each post]} of reporting each one of their posts ^{[most of those posts will most likely go against the "rules"]}.

---

While we're at it, take the time to read "this thread" as well ^{[it's outdated but still a valid one]}.

thanks for all the answers.
still, this is just a forum no matter it is bitcointalk or different name.
for you could be more, but for many newbies is just another forum with marketplace.
escrow is great option but still does not prevent people to shit post on your topic

No. You can offer to sell through a reputable escrow or be the one to send first. When dealing with other newbies or potentially untrustworthy users use escrow (google 'bitcointalk escrow' for some suggestions whose services to use)

If there is sufficient evidence that indicates the items being sold are stolen or hacked the post will be removed.  But like all free societies, everyone gets the benefit of the doubt.


Form features aren't there to be abused by scammers, they have legitimate uses that have nothing to do with sales threads.  No one will support the removal of valuable forum features just because scammers abuse them.  And scammers will continue to scam even if those features aren't there.


This isn't some other forum, this is Bitcointalk.org.  Every forum I've ever visited has it's own culture.  Take your time, get to know this one, and you won't aggravate the natives.  


It has nothing to do with rank.  There have been and likely still are plenty of high ranking members who are scammers.  The specific threads you're talking about are commonly created by newbies because they're previous account was red-tagged.  They create an account, get caught doing shady shit, get red-tagged, then create another account and start over.  It's a never ending cycle.


Lack of merit and rank don't prevent you from selling your goods.  Use a trusted escrow, sell your goods only through the forum, don't sell stolen or hacked goods, and don't scam anyone.  I guarantee you that none of the member who would be your "competition" are on DT, so their reviews would be essentially invisible.  If any of them were to make allegations against you in your unlocked, non-self-moderated thread, they would need to show proof or no one will believe them.  And, no highly reputed member is going to risk his reputation by making false allegations against a competitor.

so in few words i get that:
newbies as me cannot protect their self from the competition using self-moderated/locked topics to prevent fake negative feedback just someone to cut their business
also newbies as me who like to sell things around and are not allowed the above, have zero chance to become trusted because there won't be any merit for market transactions.
that's not really a warm welcome to any new user coming up here.

Newbies have a harder time demonstrating trustworthiness and there isn't much that they can do about it other than waiting until they have a better reputation, or having someone vouch for them.


Because too many newbie scammers abused this option other users are more wary now. Although if someone calls them a scammer without providing any more details why they're a scammer, such a post may be deleted.


Merits and forum ranks aren't given for making a set amount of posts or for seniority but for contributions to disincentivize making low quality posts. It's easier to receive merits if you post in Marketplace child-boards not dedicated to buying or selling. You can, for example, help other users solve problems they have using particular goods or services, e.g. in Service Discussion.

but why consider some rules says that "hacked/stolen" and that kind of things are not allowed, those topics are still there and not removed?
why there is an option "locked/self-moderated" if someone will point you as "scammer" just because many of them doing that.
i mean, yeah i can see there is many scammers around, but not everyone is such, and how you can protect yourself from the competition if you do not moderate your own topic?
and lets say someone had already experience in other platforms and it is familiar with the things around but not the things in this forum, why would some newbie rank will be called a scammer if he's not naturally stupid and can read how the things going around?
why should everyone be consider as scammer, if he use options provided by the forum no matter the rank ?
lets say people come in this forum only for sales but not valuable as knowledge posts, they will never rank up and earn that "merit" to get high rank.
why would that makes them less valuable than the other people?
many people may come to contribute in the marketplace but not the discussion sections.
that's like that kind of the forum the "marketplace" is being cut from ranking up

There's a lot to cover in your questions, and it's not a simple answer.

All those "newbies" who create locked topics with auto-buy links are scammers, and none are actually newbies.  They've been around a long time and only lock their threads so none of the legitimate members will post in them to warn real newbies about the scam for they're about to fall.  Also, I'm going to assume you're talking about all the locked threads in the digital goods section, which are mostly hacked accounts, stolen keys, and other ill-gotten offerings.  None of that is welcome here, but you're right about scams not being moderated.  It's unfortunate for some, but caveat emptor is the philosophy of the trading section of the forum.  As unfortunate as it may be for some, it is compatible with the philosophy of freedom from which bitcoin was born.  That doesn't mean it a free-for-all for scammers, however.  Through the trust system, the community does have the ability to expose scammers by leaving them feedback on their trust wall.

Through an election system, senior members of the forum are chosen to what we call the "Default Trust" system.  When a member from of the Default Trust system leaves a review on one's trust wall, that review has higher visibility and counts as part of the recipient's trust score.

If you have a legitimate product to sell, you shouldn't have any trouble selling through the appropriate board.  Don't lock your post, and don't make is self-moderated, when members do that (especially newbies) it's assumed to be a same.  I also recommend against using auto-buy links.  They may be convenient for sellers of of digital goods and access keys, but they are also commonly used by scammers.  So, again any time some newbie is directing forum members to an auto-buy link it's assumed that it's a scam.